[US/IRL] 6x17/18 - "The End" (2.5 Hour Series Finale) [ SPOILERS WITHIN ]

Star Lord · 24-05-2010 04:20PM

9

requiem1 wrote: »

Yeah but the question still remains what was the reflection in Jack's eye in the first season? I think people said it was the black smoke initially...maybe it was the plane flying overhead after all

I've watched that multiple times to see if I could see anything, but it seems to be just the light and the tops of the bamboo and the opening in the leaf-canopy reflected in his contracting pupil.

Tragamin2k2 · 24-05-2010 04:22PM

8

why was the island underwater in the "flash sideways" ?
gave it a 9. still a bit puzzled

prinz · 24-05-2010 04:23PM

9

seadnamac wrote: »

I'm just saying that it's open to interpretation. Is that not acceptable? I could give you links that go through the final episode of the Soprano to show 'clearly' that
Tony is dead
. Others disagree, they have their reasons, fair enough.

If it's open to interpretation you should at least have something to support that theory. I can't think of anything. I want to see your links about Lost, I've no interest in interpretations of The Sopranos whatsoever.

donfers · 24-05-2010 04:25PM

7

Please some help

1. what has jack been doing since he died on the island, I mean hurley showed up at his passing to the light so hurley must be dead too. So Jack died on the island and maybe Hurley died 800 years later, what was Jack doing for that 800 years?

2. When Juliet detonated the bomb at end of season 5/beginning season 6 what effect did that have? she said "it worked"...what was she referring to. Does it make sense if the bomb caused the purgatory universe?

3. The last scenes of Jack lying down in the bamboo with Vincent in the exact same spot he landed on the island - is this just a nice neat cyclical coincidence or is there more to it? Why in season 1 did we find him there in the first place, far from the plane? Are we allowed to interpret perhaps that going into the light is a rebirth/reincarnation allowing Jack to live out these days again and again forever.

4. What was the point of the island? They could just as well have crashed in some bog in Mayo for all the difference it made to the finale which is about a man realising he has died in a purgatory universe, accepting it and meeting with his other dead friends in order to move on to the light.

RolandIRL · 24-05-2010 04:25PM

7

Tragamin2k2 wrote: »

why was the island underwater in the "flash sideways" ?
gave it a 9. still a bit puzzled

i think it was to show that the Flash-sideways was where they didn't go the island but still were connected and found each other regardless.

i've my own idea on this, that they created the purgatory place based on the fact that the nuclear bomb denoted and sunk the island. just my own theory now.

prinz · 24-05-2010 04:25PM

9

Tragamin2k2 wrote: »

why was the island underwater in the "flash sideways" ?

To show that it didn't exist in the FST.

seadnamac · 24-05-2010 04:26PM

5

DingosAteMyBaby wrote: »

weird about the link

Well yes, feel free to interpet it as you wish...:)

even though it's blatantly obvious that the island wasn't purgatory and you are probably too stubborn to admit it now, but inside, you have realised that you are clearly wrong:P

Stupid Vista...

To be honest, FST probably is purgatory, I was argueing over semantics more than anything (allowing people their own interpretation). See the bit below in bold for why I would be perfectly happy if the island was infact purgatory.

seadnamac wrote: »

OK, this is what I thought immadiately after watching it;

The FST was Heaven. The island timeline was Purgatory.

They all died when they crashed on the island. Everyone else on the island (the Others etc.) were people that had died sometime in the past and were now in purgatory also.

Everyone had to serve out there time on the island until they were ready, at different times, to be accepted into heaven. Hence Christian saying that some came before Jack and some came after him.

While in heaven, they got to live out their lives the way they were meant to/wanted to. Then, once all reunited, settled in to an eternity of bliss with their loved ones/soul mates (Sayid & Shannon, Jack & Kate, Desmond & Penny, Saywer & Juliette etc). The others who weren't in the church are still living out their lives, having not being reunited with their soulmate yet, whomever they may be.

I'm sure there are holes that will be pointed out in this but show me theory that doesn't.

This all sits alot better with me, than the theory that the FST was purgatory, for one simple reason. The FST was only in season 6.

If the big reveal in the very last episode of Lost was exclusively only concerned with a concept that was introduced in the final season then I feel very, very cheated.

This would mean the writers planned this final season deciding that all the mysterious that have gone before, all the concepts that got us hooked on this show in the first place, would be ignored. The numbers, the rules (the f*cking rules!), the Dharma initiative, the time travel, Eliose Hawking, Charles Widmore, Widmore .VS. Ben, the f*cking island itself, etc. etc. etc.

They couldn't answer any of it so they decided to blindside us, introduce some other mystery (and a f*cking boring one at that) in the final series and provide an answer to that, hoping that we would forget about everything else. They can f*ck off.

If the FST was purgatory and the island timeline was real, then we know nothing. Nothing.

If the FST was heaven and the island timeline was purgatory, then at least we know what the last six series were.

I know which one I'd prefer it to be, but I don't know which one it actually is.

RolandIRL · 24-05-2010 04:28PM

7

donfers wrote: »

Please some help

1. what has jack been doing since he died on the island, I mean hurley showed up at his passing to the light so hurley must be dead too. So Jack died on the island and maybe Hurley died 800 years later, what was Jack doing for that 800 years?

time has no meaning in the flash-sideways. they all arrived there at the same time. they needed to go into the light together, but time is irrelevant in purgatory.

cork*girl · 24-05-2010 04:28PM

For someone who stopped watching it in season 3, could someone explain the ending? why are they there? what is the island? why was the polar bear there in season one? or is that possibe to explain :L

Essien · 24-05-2010 04:28PM

Not sure if it's been mentioned yet but was anybody else feckin' delighted when the runway (mentioned by Juliet to Sawyer & built by the others in season 3) was shown to have had such an important purpose all along

Dr Sinnott · 24-05-2010 04:28PM

8

I had guessed after “across the sea” we weren’t going to get any more answers as to the history of the island and it’s significance. So I didn’t feel let down by not getting anymore answers this morning.

What I was most confused about going into the finale was how they would explain the other timeline and I think they did that absolutely brilliantly. Superb television. Early on a lot of people were suspecting that the island was purgatory(or whatever you want to refer to it as) and the writers always denied it but then they turn around and use that to explain the flashsideways. Brilliant.

One thing though that seems to be questioned is what Juliet was referring to when Miles said she said “it worked”. I thought that was clearly revealed to be her commenting to Sawyer that plugging out and plugging in the vending machine worked(in a similar way to turning off and on the light worked in the final battle against MIB). She actually said “it worked” if I’m not mistaken.

I think that the explosion the atomic bomb at the end of season five didn’t sink the island or anything but caused “the incident” they had thought they were avoiding but that this was all part of their destiny.

The only thing that doesn’t make sense to me is why Richard, Miles and Lapidus were not in the church. Richard could have moved on with his wife, Miles could be staying back a while to get to know his father better(a la Faraday) but why wasn’t Frank there?

The Rook · 24-05-2010 04:31PM

9

donfers wrote: »

Please some help

1. what has jack been doing since he died on the island, I mean hurley showed up at his passing to the light so hurley must be dead too. So Jack died on the island and maybe Hurley died 800 years later, what was Jack doing for that 800 years?

2. When Juliet detonated the bomb at end of season 5/beginning season 6 what effect did that have? she said "it worked"...what was she referring to. Does it make sense if the bomb caused the purgatory universe?

3. The last scenes of Jack lying down in the bamboo with Vincent in the exact same spot he landed on the island - is this just a nice neat cyclical coincidence or is there more to it? Why in season 1 did we find him there in the first place, far from the plane? Are we allowed to interpret perhaps that going into the light is a rebirth/reincarnation allowing Jack to live out these days again and again forever.

4. What was the point of the island? They could just as well have crashed in some bog in Mayo for all the difference it made to the finale which is about a man realising he has died in a purgatory universe, accepting it and meeting with his other dead friends in order to move on to the light.

1. Time had no place in the purgatory place where Christian spoke to Jack (Christian said this himself) so some died before Jack, some died after him.

2. It worked was Juliette's reference to having (a) gotten off the island and (b) to having hooked up with Sawyer again post purgatory (see point 1 again ... while for Sawyer it was years before he met her again, for Juliette it would have been instantaneous.

3. Cyclical device used by writers ,....it adds a nice symmetry to it all !

4. Prior to the island Jack was an unhappy man, and the people on the island were the most important people in his life ... the point of the island (from Jack's perspective) was about redemption, acceptance and hooking up with Kate !!!

Marcaiocht_Tonn · 24-05-2010 04:31PM

9

The LA Times article (I think) mentioned earlier about the significance of Sawyer reading Watership Down in season 1, and its connection to how season 6 ended. Quality! The more cross-season links we can find, the better.

seadnamac · 24-05-2010 04:32PM

5

prinz wrote: »

If it's open to interpretation you should at least have something to support that theory. I can't think of anything. I want to see your links about Lost, I've no interest in interpretations of The Sopranos whatsoever.

First of all, no where have I said that the island was infact definitely purgatory. All I was arguing about was that people are free to interpret it however they wish, whether they are right or wrong. This is hardly a stretch.

In my first post, reposted above, (a few posts above this one) I said at first I thought it was, but at the end of that post I pointed out that I didn't know.

Links? Are people not free to come up with their own opinions without needing to find some other guy on the internet who thinks the same, as proof?

ibFoxer · 24-05-2010 04:32PM

9

Dr Sinnott wrote: »

why wasn’t Frank there?

Away doing open shirt manly awesomeness i'd wager :P

RolandIRL · 24-05-2010 04:32PM

7

Dr Sinnott wrote: »

The only thing that doesn’t make sense to me is why Richard, Miles and Lapidus were not in the church. Richard could have moved on with his wife, Miles could be staying back a while to get to know his father better(a la Faraday) but why wasn’t Frank there?

i think it's only the passengers of oceanic flight 815 that were in the church there. they were the ones who spent the most time together and the time they spent was the most important of their lives. Richard, Frank, and Miles may have had other achievements in life but they weren't part of that group.

astrofool · 24-05-2010 04:32PM

8

Well the Sopranos was open to interpretation due to the fade to black.

In Lost we are told directly that what happened on the Island is real and is what happened, so to interpret it as purgatory we need to think that that was a lie, and then go and make up our own other story to link the Island and FST.

prinz · 24-05-2010 04:34PM

9

donfers wrote: »

Please some help
1. what has jack been doing since he died on the island, I mean hurley showed up at his passing to the light so hurley must be dead too. So Jack died on the island and maybe Hurley died 800 years later, what was Jack doing for that 800 years?.

Time doesn't work that way. Christian Shephard explained that. It could be 800 years or it could be the blink of an eye.

donfers wrote: »

2. When Juliet detonated the bomb at end of season 5/beginning season 6 what effect did that have? she said "it worked"...what was she referring to. Does it make sense if the bomb caused the purgatory universe?

Possibly.I need to watch that again.

donfers wrote: »

3. The last scenes of Jack lying down in the bamboo with Vincent in the exact same spot he landed on the island - is this just a nice neat cyclical coincidence or is there more to it? Why in season 1 did we find him there in the first place, far from the plane? Are we allowed to interpret perhaps that going into the light is a rebirth/reincarnation allowing Jack to live out these days again and again forever.

Just poetic license IMO. Nice way of tying it up with a nod from the finale to the pilot. He probably got thrown out of the plane as it approached land. You can interpret any way you like as long as it makes some sort of sense in the overall picture.

donfers wrote: »

4. What was the point of the island? They could just as well have crashed in some bog in Mayo for all the difference it made to the finale which is about a man realising he has died in a purgatory universe, accepting it and meeting with his other dead friends in order to move on to the light.

What had to be done on the island played a role in who got to move on, when they got to move on etc. Some folk are still stuck on the island for instance. The island had to be saved from MIB destroying it or there would be no light to move into.

Royale with Cheese · 24-05-2010 04:35PM

6

If the big reveal in the very last episode of Lost was exclusively only concerned with a concept that was introduced in the final season then I feel very, very cheated.

This would mean the writers planned this final season deciding that all the mysterious that have gone before, all the concepts that got us hooked on this show in the first place, would be ignored. The numbers, the rules (the f*cking rules!), the Dharma initiative, the time travel, Eliose Hawking, Charles Widmore, Widmore .VS. Ben, the f*cking island itself, etc. etc. etc.

They couldn't answer any of it so they decided to blindside us, introduce some other mystery (and a f*cking boring one at that) in the final series and provide an answer to that, hoping that we would forget about everything else. They can f*ck off.

I think that sums it up pretty well. I mean as a stand alone episode I thought it was very good, and I think some people are being blinded by that. If you'd been able to watch this finale back in 2007 or 2008 it wouldn't have made a lick of sense to you. Even last year it wouldn't have made any sense.

They've rendered most of what happened in the show for the past 5 years pointless by making the focus of the series finale something that has only been introduced to the show 5 months ago. Looks like they're getting away with it too.

podgemonster · 24-05-2010 04:35PM

9

whiteman19 wrote: »

i think it was to show that the Flash-sideways was where they didn't go the island but still were connected and found each other regardless.

i've my own idea on this, that they created the purgatory place based on the fact that the nuclear bomb denoted and sunk the island. just my own theory now.

Yes i think you could be onto something here. The image of Juliet hitting the bomb with the rock could be the first scene of the Puragatory timeline, thus reseting everything with the plane never crashing, sinking the island and causing Ben and his Dad to leave the island.

Hence making Faraday right in saying he thinks he already set off the bomb. In the Purgatory timeline it went off, so when Juliet slipping into the afterlife, she thinks it works.

I don't know if this makes sense, I got very little sleep last night.

Dr Sinnott · 24-05-2010 04:36PM

8

whiteman19 wrote: »

i think it's only the passengers of oceanic flight 815 that were in the church there. they were the ones who spent the most time together and the time they spent was the most important of their lives. Richard, Frank, and Miles may have had other achievements in life but they weren't part of that group.

Penny and Desmond were both there so that doesn't make sense. Maybe could apply to Desmond but Penny was never even on the island.

Who would have thought that Desmond's line from season two to Jack at the stadium in LA "see you in another life brother" would come to pass!

seadnamac · 24-05-2010 04:38PM

5

Royale with Cheese wrote: »

I think that sums it up pretty well. I mean as a stand alone episode I thought it was very good, and I think some people are being blinded by that. If you'd been able to watch this finale back in 2007 or 2008 it wouldn't have made a lick of sense to you. Even last year it wouldn't have made any sense.

They've rendered most of what happened in the show for the past 5 years pointless by making the focus of the series finale something that has only been introduced to the show 5 months ago. Looks like they're getting away with it too.

Thank you, I thaught I was alone there for awhile!

prinz · 24-05-2010 04:38PM

9

seadnamac wrote: »

Links? Are people not free to come up with their own opinions without needing to find some other guy on the internet who thinks the same, as proof?

At least reference something from the show, no?

podgemonster · 24-05-2010 04:39PM

9

Dr Sinnott wrote: »

The only thing that doesn’t make sense to me is why Richard, Miles and Lapidus were not in the church. Richard could have moved on with his wife, Miles could be staying back a while to get to know his father better(a la Faraday) but why wasn’t Frank there?

I think Frank was contracted to do a series of movies starring Burt Reynolds, he's the comic relief.:D

Catsmokinpot · 24-05-2010 04:39PM

7

Was a good ending, i suppose :sigh:,

No Mr. Eko?

RolandIRL · 24-05-2010 04:39PM

7

Dr Sinnott wrote: »

Penny and Desmond were both there so that doesn't make sense. Maybe could apply to Desmond but Penny was never even on the island.

Who would have thought that Desmond's line from season two to Jack at the stadium in LA "see you in another life brother" would come to pass!

but desmond and penny had deep connections to the island via Widmore and pushing the button. Desmond was important cos he crashed the plane - penny cos she loved desmond and so moved on with him.

just my interpretation. not like the writers are going to disprove it now :rolleyes:

donfers · 24-05-2010 04:40PM

7

The Rook wrote: »

1. Time had no place in the purgatory place where Christian spoke to Jack (Christian said this himself) so some died before Jack, some died after him.

2. It worked was Juliette's reference to having (a) gotten off the island and (b) to having hooked up with Sawyer again post purgatory (see point 1 again ... while for Sawyer it was years before he met her again, for Juliette it would have been instantaneous.

3. Cyclical device used by writers ,....it adds a nice symmetry to it all !

4. Prior to the island Jack was an unhappy man, and the people on the island were the most important people in his life ... the point of the island (from Jack's perspective) was about redemption, acceptance and hooking up with Kate !!!

1. I know time is not an issue in the afterlife but my question is what was jack doing/where was jack for the 800 or so years between his death and hurleys

2. Did the bomb at end of season 5 cause the purgatory universe?

3. Why in first shot of episode 1 is Jack in the bamboo about 200 metres from the plane wreck and why does he die in the same place? Is it possible entering the light means the most intense meaningful period of his life (on the island) will be played in a kind of infinite loop?

4. But he could have found redemption, acceptance and hooked up with Grainne in Mayo...island had no effect on the key point of the show which is Jack finding meaning somewhere, then going to purgatory, then letting go and accepting death (all this could have happened anywhere so why all the meanderings and tangents and convoluted twists and plotlines on the island = I suspect it was all filler to fill six seasons but was the giantest red herring you'll ever see, interesting but meaningless in the overall context of the show)

campo · 24-05-2010 04:40PM

Ok I have never watched an episode of lost I had to have a look in this thread just to see what the ending was and I most say after reading a lot of the comments I am glad I never saw an episode of Lost.
Not putting down anyone who has watched it but I say a lot of people were disapointed with the ending

prinz · 24-05-2010 04:40PM

9

Dr Sinnott wrote: »

Penny and Desmond were both there so that doesn't make sense. Maybe could apply to Desmond but Penny was never even on the island.

It all depended on when they were ready to let go and move on. Some others obviously weren't ready yet.

johnny_ultimate · 24-05-2010 04:41PM

9

Seems to be a lot of people asking 'what was the point?' of the whole island business. Personally I thought they have explained the point pretty well over the years - ultimately, Jacob was seeking others to carry on protecting it. In this he succeeded. Individually, the characters also grew and dealt with their inner demons due to the events that occured, and most if not all of the mains found the redemption they were desperately seeking in the end. Jack smiling at the very end sums it up - he has helped the others escape & helped save the island, and that for him was reason enough. I'm sure you could go through the individual characters and find similar moments (Kate successfully getting Claire home, Ben atoning for his wrongs, Sayid's sacrifice etc...). It's always worth bearing in mind who these characters were before they arrived - there were three sometimes unnecessarily blunt & repetitive seasons of explaining this!

Honestly though I'm not sure if there has to be a point. At the end of the day, it was a science-fiction show about a magical island, in many ways it was just entertainment (albeit one with interesting characters and compelling mythology). Was there any need for an overall point, I dunno. Maybe it could have happened anywhere else, but would it have been anywhere near as fun? The island was one hell of a setting, that's reason enough for me.

[US/IRL] 6x17/18 - "The End" (2.5 Hour Series Finale) [** SPOILERS WITHIN **]

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[US/IRL] 6x17/18 - "The End" (2.5 Hour Series Finale) [ SPOILERS WITHIN ]