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Clamp down on L drivers

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    #32
    Max Power1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭Max Power1


    greenie wrote: »
    Ridiculous thing to say. Absolute menace? Did you know that most learner drivers are more aware of the constantly updated rules of the road than a lot of experienced drivers? And the main reason people have a problem with learners is because they tend to keep to the limit?
    and thats why they are legally entitled to drive unnacompanied right?

    Oh no, wait, they are not.As L drivers have not demonstrated a competency and ability to drive (seperate totally to theoretical knowledge of the ROTR)


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    #33
    mark renton
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,696 ✭✭✭mark renton


    Max Power1 wrote: »
    and thats why they are legally entitled to drive unnacompanied right?

    Oh no, wait, they are not.As L drivers have not demonstrated a competency and ability to drive (seperate totally to theoretical knowledge of the ROTR)

    The point you so blindly missed was that degredation in driving skills by many drivers over the years is completely overlooked - and as rightly pointed out, possession of a full licence does not exempt one from being a moron


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    #34
    Max Power1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭Max Power1


    john47832 wrote: »
    The point you so blindly missed was that degredation in driving skills by many drivers over the years is completely overlooked - and as rightly pointed out, possession of a full licence does not exempt one from being a moron
    Oh right. So if, having no licence at all (a learners permit is a permit, not a licence to drive) you consider that person a more competent driver than someone who has passed their test years ago and drives 20k km a year?

    FFS:rolleyes:


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    #35
    200motels
    Registered Users Posts: 2,603 ✭✭✭200motels


    anto_or wrote: »
    I just read a post on Ldrivers.ie saying that 14,000 L drivers have been prosecuted for either not displaying "L" plates or for driving unaccompanied. This is only in the last 18 months.:mad:
    I think the gardai are starting to take the law seriously, what a bummer for us learners. I will have to start looking over my shoulder again. And the news said the gardai are clamoing down on learner drivers again big time this weekend. Im getting the bus!!! And then am doing the driving test asap.
    Be careful out there:confused:
    Learner drivers should abide by the rules and you'll have no problems, I got my full licence in the UK and when I was learning I dare not go out in the car on my own as to do so would have seen my licence withdrawn, which should be the case over here.


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    #36
    greenie
    Registered Users Posts: 751 ✭✭✭greenie


    Max Power1 wrote: »
    and thats why they are legally entitled to drive unnacompanied right?

    Oh no, wait, they are not.As L drivers have not demonstrated a competency and ability to drive (seperate totally to theoretical knowledge of the ROTR)

    Obviously a Learner driver is not fully qualified to drive hence the title 'Learner'. They are learning, doing things by the book which tests the patience of some experienced drivers who do not always do things by the book. Experienced drivers rarely keep to the limit so a Learner doing 50km will look like they're doing 30km. Many experienced drivers do not indicate every single time they are supposed to. I've mentioned this before but a lot, I mean a lot of experienced drivers get into the wrong lane for going straight at traffic lights..extremely dangerous when you end up having two cars going ino one lane. You may not class these as serious faults but they are in fact illegal.
    L drivers may not have demonstrated competency but that in no way makes them bad drivers. If you are training for a job position does that mean you are bad and lack the ability to perform at said position until you complete training? If an L driver is incompetent today but passes his test tomorrow does he become competent? Because his driving is still the same isn't it?
    This is not a 'who is more skilled?' discussion..obviously experienced drivers are but some people need to stop treating L drivers like they're stupid. And honking at them and scaring them on the road is just the worst thing people can do.


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    #37
    sflemings
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭sflemings


    Just wondering have many learner drivers, both accompanied and unaccompanied (illegally) been asked for their licence at any checkpoint?
    I've my full licence for over 10 years at this stage and have come across many a checkpoint. Never been asked for my licence.


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    #38
    bmw535d
    Registered Users Posts: 1,160 ✭✭✭bmw535d


    i agree with john here,there are many learners on the road that are more compitant to drive than some 60+ year olds that were handed out a licence without ever doing a test because of a huge back log in the 70's
    .likewise there are alot of learners out there that are still wondering what pedal does what. im 17, ive been driving since i was 7 on back roads. one thing i can be sure of is when im driving im only concentrating on driving,nothing else unlike (mum with 10 kids in the back) therefor i may have less experience than a fully licenced driver but am i more of a risk than someone driving twentie years?, that thinks so little of driving now they forget they are doing it and are simply having a good look around them or discussing what will the get for dinner tonight?

    there is an age group of mainly female drivers around 60+ out there that have very little controll over there car and if they see anyone young that has complete controll,faster reactions, better sight, better hearing doing anything over 40mph there on the radio giving out stink about how these"young fellas" are going to kill us all, if it came to it we should all have to repeat out driving test at 60 years of age then 70 then 75 then 80 and after 80 i dont think you should be allowed to drive at all. some will say thats agesim and discrimination but you could argue the same for a 16 year who undoubtably has better vision/hearing overall abiltiy to adapt to sudden change than and 80 year old thats "feard" of their life on the road when they see someone doing 50 mph.

    i think learners shold only be fined for not having an accompanied driver if they crash or cause a crash this would let the more expericenced learner(if there is a such thing) a chance and it would sort out all the idiots on their first day out head first think later show off that i can drive kinda 17 year olds in thier mums yaris


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    #39
    Max Power1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,272 ✭✭✭✭Max Power1


    200motels wrote: »
    Learner drivers should abide by the rules and you'll have no problems, I got my full licence in the UK and when I was learning I dare not go out in the car on my own as to do so would have seen my licence withdrawn, which should be the case over here.
    +1

    Ireland must be the only country that people still drive on a learner permit. Most EU countries rigidly enforce the law in this matter. Ireland still seems to have a laxadaisical attitude.


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    #40
    bmw535d
    Registered Users Posts: 1,160 ✭✭✭bmw535d


    sflemings wrote: »
    Just wondering have many learner drivers, both accompanied and unaccompanied (illegally) been asked for their licence at any checkpoint?
    I've my full licence for over 10 years at this stage and have come across many a checkpoint. Never been asked for my licence.

    yes i was driving about 3 weeks and went through a checkpoint accompanied.so glad everything was right.the gaurd didnt even ask for insurance or look for a rear L plate which wasnt there:pac:


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    #41
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,022 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


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    #42
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    In an ideal world driving unaccompanied on a provisional license would mean losing your license and not being able to reapply for 12 months, along with a fine. The guards need to tighten up big time on learner drivers.

    To think that you can basically take a written multiple choice test then jump in behind the wheel of a car having never driven before and drive home knowing you more than likely wont get caught is a sickening thought to anyone who uses the roads...


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    #43
    bmw535d
    Registered Users Posts: 1,160 ✭✭✭bmw535d


    yes a 60 year old would normally be safer than an 18 year but there are over 10,000 fully licenced drivers in ireland that have never done a test,i live near one and she has been driving the same car for about 10 years and still puts on the wipers instead the the indicators. does she sound safe on the road?
    there are more dents on the car than a teenagers face

    also if you read my post again i said there are many learners not all learners,granted this may be a low figure compared to good 60+ year old drivers


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    #44
    JP Liz V1
    Registered Users Posts: 85,686 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1


    The Gardai inforce this majorly for 1 bank holiday weekend each year and then nothing
    https://forumofgames.com/




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    #45
    ardmacha
    Registered Users Posts: 7,476 ✭✭✭ardmacha


    Whether or not there exist other bad drivers is not an excuse to break the law. Two wrongs do not make a right.

    Hopefully the law will clamp down on all motoring lawbreakers.


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    #46
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,022 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


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    #47
    greenie
    Registered Users Posts: 751 ✭✭✭greenie


    djimi wrote: »
    The guards need to tighten up big time on learner drivers.

    They really do with everybody.


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    #48
    mark renton
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,696 ✭✭✭mark renton


    ardmacha wrote: »
    Whether or not there exist other bad drivers is not an excuse to break the law. Two wrongs do not make a right.

    Hopefully the law will clamp down on all motoring lawbreakers.

    If any man has to get into his car in the morning (with a provisional licence) and drives to an underpaid job where he has to work harder than usual, then takes all that money and pays off a never ending mortgage and feeds his hungry kids, with little hope of things getting better for a long time in the future - then appears in court and is fined 1000 euro and the rest, then I personally will gladly take up arms for such a cause


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    #49
    Eoin
    Registered Users Posts: 21,249 ✭✭✭✭Eoin


    What "cause" - why are you bringing financial circumstances into it? It's quite simply a case of driving without a license.


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    #50
    mark renton
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,696 ✭✭✭mark renton


    eoin wrote: »
    What "cause" - why are you bringing financial circumstances into it? It's quite simply a case of driving without a license.


    Maybe because this is reality, instaed of a pink cloud of political correctness that people on here seem to be lounging in


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    #51
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,022 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


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    #52
    Eoin
    Registered Users Posts: 21,249 ✭✭✭✭Eoin


    john47832 wrote: »
    Maybe because this is reality, instaed of a pink cloud of political correctness that people on here seem to be lounging in

    You honestly don't see a problem with somebody with absolutely no demonstrable driving skills or experience navigating a ton plus of metal around?

    I have no idea of what you mean by "political correctness" - it doesn't even make sense in this context.


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    #53
    mark renton
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,696 ✭✭✭mark renton


    eoin wrote: »

    I have no idea of what you mean by "political correctness" - it doesn't even make sense in this context.

    A bit like asking a blind man to read - no?


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    #54
    Eoin
    Registered Users Posts: 21,249 ✭✭✭✭Eoin


    I still don't follow you.


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    #55
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    john47832 wrote: »
    If any man has to get into his car in the morning (with a provisional licence) and drives to an underpaid job where he has to work harder than usual, then takes all that money and pays off a never ending mortgage and feeds his hungry kids, with little hope of things getting better for a long time in the future - then appears in court and is fined 1000 euro and the rest, then I personally will gladly take up arms for such a cause

    Dear lord what a load of rubbish... If that man, through inability to drive, ploughs into a school bus and kills 50 kids on their way to school, is he still the saint you are making him out to be? Get a grip; doesnt matter the circumstances, someone driving on their own without a full license is breaking the law and potentially putting peoples lives at risk.


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    #56
    JP Liz V1
    Registered Users Posts: 85,686 ✭✭✭✭JP Liz V1


    I know its wrong but the cost of the driving test is pretty expensive so I can see why people are driving without taking the test
    https://forumofgames.com/




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    #57
    sflemings
    Registered Users Posts: 148 ✭✭sflemings


    JP Liz V1 wrote: »
    I know its wrong but the cost of the driving test is pretty expensive so I can see why people are driving without taking the test
    That's no excuse not to get a full licence. Doesn't everyone want to say they have a full licence. It proves that you can actually control and drive a car safely.
    In saying that however, I do know that the actualy test isn't the greatest and doesn't cover all aspects of driving.


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    #58
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,238 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    JP Liz V1 wrote: »
    I know its wrong but the cost of the driving test is pretty expensive so I can see why people are driving without taking the test

    €75 is not expensive. If you have no intention of taking the test then why bother starting to learn in the first place?


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    #59
    Bigtoe107
    Registered Users Posts: 378 ✭✭Bigtoe107


    Tbh to really enforce this law, the test needs to be reformed and people should sit it every ten years.

    Driving and car control should be thought in school, with the driving test being a continual assessment exam in the leaving cert. Any plank can drive like an angel for a half an hour.

    This law just papers over the problems in the testing system.


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    #60
    Eoin
    Registered Users Posts: 21,249 ✭✭✭✭Eoin


    JP Liz V1 wrote: »
    I know its wrong but the cost of the driving test is pretty expensive so I can see why people are driving without taking the test

    It's a hell of a lot more expensive in other countries where you need to have notched up x amount of hours with an instructor and so on. I don't believe price is a factor at all.

    I think it's a throwback to when you could drive alone on a second provisional license (when that's what it was called), and probably fostered a little by society that provided the ridiculous amnesty a few decades ago.

    Don't try and think about it from the point of view of learners who have had lessons and a year of experience; think about how absurd it is that someone who has no proof of ever having even sat behind the wheel of the car thinking it's OK to drive unaccompanied. It's insane.


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    #61
    Alanstrainor
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 23,157 Mod ✭✭✭✭Alanstrainor


    JP Liz V1 wrote: »
    I know its wrong but the cost of the driving test is pretty expensive so I can see why people are driving without taking the test

    That's always an argument i hear thrown around these parts. My response is always that driving is a very expensive way of getting around no matter what you drive. If you can't afford the test, you can't afford a car. The test is peanuts compared to the price of buying and running a car. Even if you take the cost of buying a car out of the equation you have: tax, insurance, maintenance and fuel to worry about. Which is going to cost thousands a year for a learner driver.


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