Are all degrees created equal?

06-05-2010 12:10AM

PeakOutput wrote: »

well you must of heard it in your own head, read what you quoted again i didnt mention jobs

What are you talking about then? Resources? What you learn? Do you really think quality always corresponds with the price of tuition? The most expensive colleges in Ireland tend to be the worst.

tbh i didnt know cambridge was so reasonably priced but it dosnt offer the course im looking for which is why i didnt look any further at that particular college

london business school and oxford and possibly london school of economics have courses im interested in and the costs for those are slightly cheaper but comparable to the cost of going to mit and probably more expensive then going to ucla or berkley

LSE and Oxford are more expensive than UCLA and comparable to MIT? How are you working that out?

weather they believe that or not aside its certainly not true that trinity is the equal of oxbridge overall

That's how it's seen over here and in lots of other countries. I think Trinity is more respected abroad than in Ireland. People are more impressed when they find out I went there then when they find out where I study now.

RichTea · 06-05-2010 12:14AM

[quote=[Deleted User];65746032] think Trinity is more respected abroad than in Ireland. [/QUOTE]

Definitely wrong. Sorry to say it. It is respected but Trinity heads go on about it being this and that even if they're in the place a week and doing some 'Mickey Mouse' course.

PeakOutput · 06-05-2010 12:17AM

[quote=[Deleted User];65746032]What are you talking about then? Resources? What you learn? Do you really think quality always corresponds with the price of tuition? The most expensive colleges in Ireland tend to be the worst.[/quote]

i was talking about exactly what i said if you want to go to a top school you have to pay for it

LSE and Oxford are more expensive than UCLA and comparable to MIT? How are you working that out?

well it cost a friend 40Ksterling to attend one of those colleges for one year(all in)

i couldnt be arsed checking agian but iirc ucla is around 40/45Kdollars a year, mit is around 100Kdollars

That's how it's seen over here and in lots of other countries. I think Trinity is more respected abroad than in Ireland. People are more impressed when they find out I went there then when they find out where I study now.

iv said all ill say on trinity individually im not trying to attack your degree or trinity in general

06-05-2010 12:24AM

PeakOutput wrote: »

i was talking about exactly what i said if you want to go to a top school you have to pay for it

That makes absolutely no sense. As I said, Cambridge is way, way, way cheaper than Harvard or Yale. So is Oxford. So is Imperial College. So is UCL. These universities are all in the world top ten and the fees for UK and EU students are a fraction of most American college fees. What are you talking about?

well it cost a friend 40Ksterling to attend one of those colleges for one year(all in)

i couldnt be arsed checking agian but iirc ucla is around 40/45Kdollars a year, mit is around 100Kdollars

Where was this friend from? Those are international fees for sure, and they're steep even then. Or it's for some super duper special program. Because I go to college in London and I don't know one person who's paying more than £9000 a year for a postgrad course unless they're international. There is just absolutely no way that fees for UK universities are anywhere near as expensive as the average US tuition fee. Where on earth are you getting your figures?

RichTea · 06-05-2010 12:27AM

[quote=[Deleted User];65746263]
Because I go to college in London and I don't know one person who's paying more than £9000 a year for a postgrad course[/QUOTE]

Nope I know a lot of MAs and stuff that are. And when you get on to MBAs, you're paying SERIOUS money.

06-05-2010 12:33AM

RichTea wrote: »

Nope I know a lot of MAs and stuff that are. And when you get on to MBAs, you're paying SERIOUS money.

Which MAs and where?

06-05-2010 12:35AM

RichTea wrote: »

Nope I know a lot of MAs and stuff that are. And when you get on to MBAs, you're paying SERIOUS money.

It's true. I was looking at masters at Imperial College London. Taken from ICL's website, MSc Risk Management and Financial Engineering, the tuition fee for 2010 is £26,600. This fee is the same for both UK and international students. http://www3.imperial.ac.uk/business-school/programmes/msc-risk-management/admissions/feesandfunding

PeakOutput · 06-05-2010 12:35AM

[quote=[Deleted User];65746263]That makes absolutely no sense. As I said, Cambridge is way, way, way cheaper than Harvard or Yale. So is Oxford. So is Imperial College. So is UCL. These universities are all in the world top ten and the fees for UK and EU students are a fraction of most American college fees. What are you talking about? [/quote]

i think we are misunderstanding eachother all i said was you need to pay to go to a top school i didnt say how much and i never said you need to pay 100K to get a great job

Where was this friend from? Those are international fees for sure, and they're steep even then. Or it's for some super duper special program. Because I go to college in London and I don't know one person who's paying more than £9000 a year for a postgrad course unless they're international. There is just absolutely no way that fees for UK universities are anywhere near as expensive as the average US tuition fee. Where on earth are you getting your figures?

im saying this is from purely my own research and for purely the course im interested in and mainly figures from the colleges websites

for me to do the course i want to do the cost in london business school v ucla v berkely v virtually any top 20 school in the states iv looked at (besides the top 5) are all comparable (form a cursory glance just there ucla is cheaper) and the average earnings upon graduation are comparable

for mit or harvard the cost is more expensive and the average earnings after are greater aswell

that is all i was saying as regards fees not sure if that clears up whatever the misunderstand was

06-05-2010 12:45AM

PeakOutput wrote: »

i think we are misunderstanding eachother all i said was you need to pay to go to a top school i didnt say how much and i never said you need to pay 100K to get a great job

But what do you MEAN by that? You're implying that the more money you pay, the better education you receive. Is that not what you're saying? You need to pay to go to any school.

im saying this is from purely my own research and for purely the course im interested in and mainly figures from the colleges websites

for me to do the course i want to do the cost in london business school v ucla v berkely v virtually any top 20 school in the states iv looked at (besides the top 5) are all comparable (form a cursory glance just there ucla is cheaper) and the average earnings upon graduation are comparable

for mit or harvard the cost is more expensive and the average earnings after are greater aswell

that is all i was saying as regards fees not sure if that clears up whatever the misunderstand was

MBA courses and many postgrad business courses are a special case as they tend to be expensive everywhere. What you have discovered is really more of an exception to a rule than a general truth. I'd say over 95% of courses in the UK and Ireland are a fraction of the cost of an equivalent course in the States. I'm paying £3800/year for my course in a world top 5 uni, while a comparable course in lower ranked schools like Princeton and Columbia is many times that. My point is that I would be mad to choose Harvard when I could get educated for a much, much lower price. The point was that you (or someone) said it's realistic for Irish students to go to the States for college and I maintain that it isn't, for the most part. At all.

PeakOutput · 06-05-2010 12:58AM

[quote=[Deleted User];65746590]But what do you MEAN by that? You're implying that the more money you pay, the better education you receive. Is that not what you're saying? You need to pay to go to any school.
[/quote]

well you dont need to pay to go to school in ireland

which neatly brings me around to the point that if we want to compete we need reintroduction of fees for certain people

that is what i was saying in general but i am prepared to withdraw it on the back of newly acquired information shows mbas are particularly expensive and an exception

. but my general point was in comparison to ireland if you want a top education you need to pay for it. coming from ireland paying 10K a year or 50K a year is still top dollar for a postgrad and most people dnt seem to realise its much more the norm and ireland is the exception

however i didnt realise you can get postgrad courses for as cheap as you are in a top 5 school and of course its not the worth going to america

The point was that you (or someone) said it's realistic for Irish students to go to the States for college and I maintain that it isn't, for the most part. At all.

again i think you misunderstood what i meant. i said anyone who gets into harvard can afford it due to loans and earning potential, i didnt say this should be their only consideration and they should automatically go just cause its harvard

06-05-2010 01:12AM

PeakOutput wrote: »

well you dont need to pay to go to school in ireland which neatly brings me around to the point that if we want to compete we need reintroduction of fees for certain people

You don't have to pay? What's the 'registration fee' then? When I was in college, it was almost as much as the tuition fees my siblings paid in the UK and it's considerably more than tuition fees in France and Belgium. They might dress it up in a different way but it certainly isn't free for most people. Anyhow, do you really think paying £3000 as opposed to £950 (or nothing) makes any difference to the quality of tuition you receive? Do you think international students get special tuition because they pay ten times more than the rest of us?

that is what i was saying in general but i am prepared to withdraw it on the back of newly acquired information shows mbas are particularly expensive and an exception . but my general point was in comparison to ireland if you want a top education you need to pay for it. coming from ireland paying 10K a year or 50K a year is still top dollar for a postgrad and most people dnt seem to realise its much more the norm and ireland is the exception

What is this 'norm' though? An MA often costs between 500 and 600 euro a year in Belgian universities, it's generally around £4000 in the UK and $40,000 a year wouldn't be unusual in the States. Do you really believe Americans are better educated than the rest of the world because they pay so much more? I have already pointed out that tuition in the top UK universities is rarely more than £8000/year, tops, which is very similar to Ireland.

however i didnt realise you can get postgrad courses for as cheap as you are in a top 5 school and of course its not the worth going to america

If you had looked into it at all you'd see there are many, many top universities with much more affordable fees than Harvard.

again i think you misunderstood what i meant. i said anyone who gets into harvard can afford it due to loans and earning potential, i didnt say this should be their only consideration and they should automatically go just cause its harvard

You pretty much did say that.

gollem_1975 · 06-05-2010 01:15AM

apologies in advance for not reading the entire thread ( and for the long post ).

its an interesting question but one which is easy to give a short answer

i.e. NO degrees are not created equal

on the other hand it is difficult to provide evidence to back up this statement... because of the sheer number of degrees given by institutions all over the world over a large number of years.

how does one quantify the quality of degrees ? its very difficult to do imo.

outcome in terms of what people do at the end of the degree would be one metric.

however this outcome is dependent on factors other than the quality of the course material, lecturers , fellow students etc.

recently I have been reflecting on my own experience with 3rd level education and came across this article by seth godin which may be of interest.

in relation to the topic itself there are lists published every year of top universities in the world so we could assume that there are 'people' that evaluate the quality of degrees based along similar lines. i.e. the higher the position of the college on these lists the higher standing of the degree program offered by the college.

there are so many degree courses now in comparison to lets say 20 years ago. I think to say they are all equal would be naieve but objectively how many people care if they are not created equal anyway ?

when we graduated we were told that afterwards what we learnt on the course would not be as important so much as the network of people ( your classmates ) you were now a part of as a result of doing the course.

OT : i heard a quip from somebody the other night along the lines of
"a BA in your hand is now about as useful as a page of the clare leader"

RATM · 06-05-2010 01:39AM

Fremen wrote: »

TCD is known outside of Ireland, so people (in the UK, for example) tend to assume it's better than DCU or the various UCD/UCC/UCG colleges.

It's not really better, just older and more famous. The main Irish universities are more or less on par with each other at undergraduate level.

I wouldn't agree. I did my undergrad in Trinity and am now doing a Masters in DCU. In my final year in Trinity I had 6 subjects. Of these 5 were lectured by professors and the other by a Dr. In DCU I have 6 modules this semester. None are taught by professors, 3 by Drs and 3 by people who have a Masters.

There's a gulf of difference between the qualifications of staff at Trinity and DCU- many of my lecturers at Trinity are internationally renowned experts in their fields- I can't seem to say the same for DCU unfortunately.

That said DCU hasn't got Trinity's stifling level of bureaucracy and is a much more user friendly college to go to IMO.

PeakOutput · 06-05-2010 09:57AM

[quote=[Deleted User];65746973]
You pretty much did say that.[/QUOTE]

:rolleyes: ugh no i didnt but whatever makes you happy

06-05-2010 10:20AM

PeakOutput wrote: »

:rolleyes: ugh no i didnt but whatever makes you happy

You basically said I (or any Irish student) would be silly to choose Trinity or similar over Harvard because of the potential for high earnings, despite the fact that a student loan of about $250,000 would have to be paid back. Even if you did walk into a 90K a year job, that's a HELL of a lot of debt to be hanging over your head. You could go to Oxford or Imperial and walk into a well paid job, with only £15,000 in debt (assuming you avail of the student loan system). It's just absolutely ridiculous to suggest that any Irish student can go to Harvard if they want to. The costs are astronomical and the only people who do it either get full scholarships or have very, very rich daddies. You said there was no difference between an Irish student and one from California, well there obviously is. That kid's parents will have been saving for college since he was born, in most cases, and the American kid doesn't have the option to go to a high quality, low cost institution like Trinity or Cambridge. As I said, even a crappy local college is more expensive than Oxbridge. Why do you think so many American students come to Ireland and the UK to study? Because even paying international fees and flights, it's much more economical than staying in the US.

PeakOutput · 06-05-2010 11:50AM

[quote=[Deleted User];65749399]You basically said I (or any Irish student) would be silly to choose Trinity[/quote]

well i didnt say that but now that you mention it i completely agree they would be silly to pick trinity over harvard

The costs are astronomical and the only people who do it either get full scholarships or have very, very rich daddies.

i dont know why your picking on harvard i never said harvard was the only place i was talking about but either way i know for a fact that the above is incorrect

Why do you think so many American students come to Ireland and the UK to study?.

because they want to drink for a semester and do modules that make no difference to their gpa at home, i have met very few (1 i think) american students who are american residents and have chosen to come here to study for their entire degree

06-05-2010 12:05PM

PeakOutput wrote: »

well i didnt say that but now that you mention it i completely agree they would be silly to pick trinity over harvard

Why?

i dont know why your picking on harvard i never said harvard was the only place i was talking about but either way i know for a fact that the above is incorrect

You gave it as an example. And you know for a fact that the above is incorrect? How? Where are these Harvard going normal Irish people all hiding?

because they want to drink for a semester and do modules that make no difference to their gpa at home, i have met very few (1 i think) american students who are american residents and have chosen to come here to study for their entire degree

Well you obviously don't go to Trinity then, or any of the big UK universities. They are everywhere. With all due respect, I have no idea where you're getting this info from. Stuff like this is subjective as it depends on who you know but you don't seem to have any idea about tuition fees or reputation or job prospects re British and Irish universities. You seem to be making things up left, right and centre. I don't know how anyone could honestly say that a UK degree is anywhere near as expensive as the average American one. The only thing you've showed is that MBA's are expensive and I said I agree, but they're expensive everywhere. And still usually much cheaper in Europe than the US.

PeakOutput · 06-05-2010 12:21PM

[quote=[Deleted User];65751105]Why?
[/quote]

because if they are smart enough to be accepted into harvard they are smart enough to know that its not the only option for a great education and there are other, cheaper, alternatives that are far better then trinity

You gave it as an example. And you know for a fact that the above is incorrect? How? Where are these Harvard going normal Irish people all hiding?

i know it for a fact because i know people who have done it in colleges all over the states without full scholarships and rich daddies

Well you obviously don't go to Trinity then, or any of the big UK universities. They are everywhere. With all due respect, I have no idea where you're getting this info from. Stuff like this is subjective as it depends on who you know

of course its subjective but your the one who brought it up

but you don't seem to have any idea about tuition fees or reputation or job prospects re British and Irish universities. You seem to be making things up left, right and centre.

i already said believe whatever makes you happy, what you think im making up matters little to me

I don't know how anyone could honestly say that a UK degree is anywhere near as expensive as the average American one. The only thing you've showed is that MBA's are expensive and I said I agree, but they're expensive everywhere. And still usually much cheaper in Europe than the US.

and i dont know how anyone can misunderstand something so badly, how many times do you want me to say i didnt know postgrads besides business postgrads were as cheap as they are and again your putting words in my mouth i never said the average uk degree was the same price as the average american degree, in fact i am pretty sure i said specifically im not talking about averages here

Burning Eclipse · 06-05-2010 12:38PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I remember listening to the boss of Google Ireland a few months ago on the radio, during the debate on grade inflation. I'm sure he said they only accept graduates from TCD, UCD and UCC.

I can guarantee you you're wrong. Two of my classmates were hired straight out of 4th year. Marketing in UL, for the record.

I won't enter into this debate too deeply, except to say that of course not all degrees are created equal, imo.

06-05-2010 12:41PM

PeakOutput wrote: »

because if they are smart enough to be accepted into harvard they are smart enough to know that its not the only option for a great education and there are other, cheaper, alternatives that are far better then trinity

Yes, there are, that's exactly what I said, giving examples like Cambridge and LSE. But why are you acting like Trinity is rubbish? It's a very good university and very well respected. Why wouldn't people aim to go there? People from all over the world to go Trinity. I'm not quite sure why you're acting like it's some clown college. The college I'm at now has more resources and more famous academics, but there isn't a great deal of difference in the level of education. I actually found Trinity more demanding.

i know it for a fact because i know people who have done it in colleges all over the states without full scholarships and rich daddies

I'll have to take your word for it. Personally, I think it's rather foolish to take on that level of debt for something they could have got for a fraction of the price, but each to their own. I would have loved to have gone to Harvard, but I just couldn't justify the price. Even if you do get an amazing job, you're still paying that loan back for years.

i already said believe whatever makes you happy, what you think im making up matters little to me

I couldn't care less, but if you're going to make statements about how much degrees cost in the UK compared to the US, it might be good to have some idea of what you're talking about. I mean, what you said just isn't true. And that is a fact. I'm not claiming to know everything, but I put loads of research into where to go to university. I study in London now, between two colleges. I have a very good idea of how much things cost and what the quality is like, it's not stuff I heard from my friend's sister's aunt's hairdresser's dog. You've gone from trying to say that Oxford is almost as expensive as Harvard, so people might as well go to Harvard, to 'there are many better and cheaper places'. Which is it?

and i dont know how anyone can misunderstand something so badly, how many times do you want me to say i didnt know postgrads besides business postgrads were as cheap as they are and again your putting words in my mouth i never said the average uk degree was the same price as the average american degree, in fact i am pretty sure i said specifically im not talking about averages here

I'm not the one who is misunderstanding. You did say that you didn't know postgrads were as cheap as they are, so basically your argument was centered on something you just made up and didn't even bother looking into. Why are you saying that it is totally reasonable and sensible to expect Irish students to go to the likes of Harvard when you don't even know how much the likes of Oxford cost? It's a 30 second google. And even if we are talking about that one specific degree you're talking about, I'd be very surprised if it wasn't significantly cheaper, and just as well taught, in the UK. What was your point, then? You just keep changing it, as far as I can see.

PeakOutput · 06-05-2010 12:56PM

[quote=[Deleted User];65751712]Yes, there are, that's exactly what I said, giving examples like Cambridge and LSE. But why are you acting like Trinity is rubbish? It's a very good university and very well respected. Why wouldn't people aim to go there? People from all over the world to go Trinity. I'm not quite sure why you're acting like it's some clown college. The college I'm at now has more resources and more famous academics, but there isn't a great deal of difference in the level of education. I actually found Trinity more demanding.[/quote]

again your just making things up i specifically said i have great respect for trinity

I'll have to take your word for it. Personally, I think it's rather foolish to take on that level of debt for something they could have got for a fraction of the price, but each to their own. I would have loved to have gone to Harvard, but I just couldn't justify the price. Even if you do get an amazing job, you're still paying that loan back for years.

thats completely fine all i said was anyone who is accepted into harvard can afford it and you blew up. i didnt say it was for everyone or anything else you just made that up yet again.

I couldn't care less, but if you're going to make statements about how much degrees cost in the UK compared to the US, it might be good to have some idea of what you're talking about. I mean, what you said just isn't true. And that is a fact. I'm not claiming to know everything, but I put loads of research into where to go to university. I study in London now, between two colleges. I have a very good idea of how much things cost and what the quality is like, it's not stuff I heard from my friend's sister's aunt's hairdresser's dog. You've gone from trying to say that Oxford is almost as expensive as Harvard, so people might as well go to Harvard, to 'there are many better and cheaper places'. Which is it?

i never mentioned oxford and i said that everything i said is coming from MY OWN RESEARCH AND EXPERIENCE

I'm not the one who is misunderstanding. You did say that you didn't know postgrads were as cheap as they are, so basically your argument was centered on something you just made up and didn't even bother looking into. Why are you saying that it is totally reasonable and sensible to expect Irish students to go to the likes of Harvard when you don't even know how much the likes of Oxford cost? It's a 30 second google. And even if we are talking about that one specific degree you're talking about, I'd be very surprised if it wasn't significantly cheaper, and just as well taught, in the UK. What was your point, then? You just keep changing it, as far as I can see.

yawn, again no i didnt say that i said i didnt know about other degrees besides business because i was researching business courses, what i said was based on my research just like i said it was

i think your deliberately getting think about this for no good reason i believe my points are perfectly valid you either are misunderstanding them or simply disagree with them either of which is fine as far as im concerned so i will conclude

the top schools can be afforded weather they are american or otherwise by anyone who gets in

the top schools are better then our schools

if a trinity education helps you reach your goals thats fine if you think going to one of the other schools helps you better thats also fine and assuming you are smart enough to get in you will have no problem affording the education if you move out of the irish mindset of education should be free

i find it dissapointing that we have to go abroad for a top class education and i see the re-introduction of fees as a first step to being able to compete properly with the likes of the top 50 in the world

im done

06-05-2010 01:08PM

PeakOutput wrote: »

again your just making things up i specifically said i have great respect for trinity

So why did you say there are alternatives providing a far better education?

thats completely fine all i said was anyone who is accepted into harvard can afford it and you blew up. i didnt say it was for everyone or anything else you just made that up yet again.

I didn't blow up. I said that my idea of 'affordable' is not taking out a six figure student loan and living off ramen noodles for 4 years. It isn't affordable for most people. Have you ever had a student loan? Mine is £16,000 and it's so unpleasant to finish college and have that hanging over your head before you've had time to get on your feet at all. Saying that Harvard is affordable is just totally unrealistic. I got accepted into several American colleges and I couldn't afford them, full stop. Even with the very generous financial aid they offer, you still end up paying a fortune.

if a trinity education helps you reach your goals thats fine if you think going to one of the other schools helps you better thats also fine and assuming you are smart enough to get in you will have no problem affording the education if you move out of the irish mindset of education should be free

i find it dissapointing that we have to go abroad for a top class education and i see the re-introduction of fees as a first step to being able to compete properly with the likes of the top 50 in the world

im done

Spoken like someone who isn't crippled with debt at the age of 22. I don't necessarily believe education should be free, but it really seems to me that the Irish people who say they'd have no problem with paying tens of thousands a year for their college education are people who haven't done it. I don't know why you're saying we have to go abroad for a top class education. Trinity is FINE. It's every bit as well respected as Oxbridge and Yale, especially in the UK. It IS around number 50 in the world. It's much, much better than many institution charging the big bucks. I'm not sure why you think expensive = good.

Sugar Free · 06-05-2010 01:46PM

I don't have much to add only to say that my company (pharmaceutical services) ignores the vast majority of graduate applicants with degrees from IT's.

It's not necessarily fair but I guess they have to filter down the numbers somehow.

I'd also agree with the comment about your network of classmates being more important than your degree - certainly while you're a recent graduate who needs to gain experience first.

melekalikimaka · 06-05-2010 02:18PM

250k fees for degree in harvard in business
0k fees in trinity

look at the starting wages for a harvard grad
look at the starting wages for a trinity grad

they get very different job prospects
with highly different wages

ya dont see too many harvard grads on the aib/boi grad program now do you

Pittens · 06-05-2010 02:20PM

and again im talking about post grad stuff here in the main not undergrads who matter little in the grand scheme of things

In terms of world rankings, yes. However this thread is about undergrad degrees, as I read it.

I can guarantee you you're wrong. Two of my classmates were hired straight out of 4th year. Marketing in UL, for the record.

Unless UL has really grade inflated in the ten years since I left i would be surprised if it was in Google's list of undesirables, in general it is quite the opposite.

Does anyone have a link to what Joe Herlihy actually said, and what colleges he actually dismissed? We seem to be guessing.

Pittens · 06-05-2010 02:23PM

they get very different job prospects
with highly different wages

If the harvard graduate starts on 90K but goes no further then its a definite loss. That is not a great american salary, and would be medicore in the areas where they have to work - expensive urban areas.

I have worked with graduates from harvard on the same wages ( I assume) so that seems like a loss, right? I am pretty sure the management wasnt harvard up the ladder either - that might be the case in law firms but not in the famous computer multinational I worked in. Drop outs at the top.

Anyway, it seems that for engineering Stanford - which is not Ivy league - is preferred in or around silicon valley.

06-05-2010 02:26PM

melekalikimaka wrote: »

250k fees for degree in harvard in business
0k fees in trinity

look at the starting wages for a harvard grad
look at the starting wages for a trinity grad

they get very different job prospects
with highly different wages

ya dont see too many harvard grads on the aib/boi grad program now do you

What stops people from going outside Ireland after completing their no-fees degree? Trinity is internationally recognised, there's no need to stay in Ireland unless you want to.

If the harvard graduate starts on 90K but goes no further then its a definite loss. That is not a great american salary, and would be medicore in the kind of places where they have to work.

I have worked with graduates from harvard on the same wages ( I assume) so that seems like a loss, right? I am pretty sure the management wasnt harvard up the ladder either - that might be the case in law firms but not in the famous computer multinational I worked in. Drop outs at the top.

Anyway, it seems that for engineering Stanford - which is not Ivy league - is preferred in or around silicon valley.

Exactly. It doesn't really matter if the starting salary is good, you're still a quarter of a million dollars in debt. I mean, is it really worth it? Sure, the starting salaries from UK and Irish universities are lower but doesn't the fact you're not paying back thousands every month for years not sort of even it out a bit?

melekalikimaka · 06-05-2010 02:29PM

[quote=[Deleted User];65753772]What stops people from going outside Ireland after completing their no-fees degree?[/QUOTE]

i have friends who transferred to america, same job same company- double pay.

the fees are so much, the wages reflect that...

one was from ucd one was from trinity. both transferred, dunno how common it is. but i dont think it is.

06-05-2010 02:34PM

Pittens wrote: »

In terms of world rankings, yes. However this thread is about undergrad degrees, as I read it.

Unless UL has really grade inflated in the ten years since I left i would be surprised if it was in Google's list of undesirables, in general it is quite the opposite.

Does anyone have a link to what Joe Herlihy actually said, and what colleges he actually dismissed? We seem to be guessing.

My mistake, this is what he actually said:

Asked about Google’s recruitment policies in Ireland he said: “We recruit from all seven universities but we recruit principally from three universities – UCD, UCC and Trinity. All three are producing outstanding graduates across the range.’’

Link: http://info-wars.org/2010/03/05/the-dumbing-down-of-irish-third-level-colleges/

opinion guy · 06-05-2010 07:03PM

So much fighting......

WON'T SOMEBODY PLEASE THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!!!!!!!

Are all degrees created equal?

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