John Higgins match fixing claims

MagicMarker · 02-05-2010 03:36PM

FlawedGenius wrote: »

What was caught on camera?????????????

Eh, you might want to read the thread.

brick tamland · 02-05-2010 03:37PM

I've a feeling the sport is riddeled with it, i've heard rumours before and once watched a match were i was told to back a certain player as other player was throwing it, and by the shots he missed i'm sure he did. one of the top men in the sport too.

FlawedGenius · 02-05-2010 03:41PM

What about O Sullivan in China missing ridiculous shots and leaving the ball over the pocket for the nobody Chinese player last month??? Has he ever done well in China in the last few years?
Is it really the end of Johns career?? Can snooker afford to lose him at the moment???

Inquitus · 02-05-2010 03:43PM

Aye the problem is Snooker is one of the easiest Sports to manipulate. Players miss shots all the time, players can implode inexplicably. It only takes one mistake to hand someone a frame. The sport is custom made for fixing, sadly.

Herbal Deity · 02-05-2010 03:45PM

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I must say, it doesn't sit comfortably with me at all...

I mean, a tabloid plotted to tempt a guy to accept an offer that would ruin his career.

Again, not defending Higgins, I just dislike this kind of "journalism".

IvySlayer · 02-05-2010 03:46PM

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

If he wasn't comfortable, he should've walked out, maybe? In the video, he was talking about a house is Spain, he was spending the money there and then!

Penisland · 02-05-2010 03:52PM

Inquitus wrote: »

Aye the problem is Snooker is one of the easiest Sports to manipulate. Players miss shots all the time, players can implode inexplicably. It only takes one mistake to hand someone a frame. The sport is custom made for fixing, sadly.

John?

ArmaniJeanss · 02-05-2010 03:57PM

Herbal Deity wrote: »

I must say, it doesn't sit comfortably with me at all...

I mean, a tabloid plotted to tempt a guy to accept an offer that would ruin his career.

I'm guessing it doesn't just happen out of the blue though. Its expensive to set up this sort of sting so they probably just didn't pick him randomly - they would have had some prior knowledge/information that he was likely to accept.

Permabear · 02-05-2010 03:59PM

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ArmaniJeanss · 02-05-2010 03:59PM

JohnHiggins wrote:

In all honesty I became very worried at the way the conversation developed in Kiev. When it was suggested that I throw frames in return for large sums of money, I was really spooked. I just wanted to get out of the hotel and on to the plane home.

"I didn't know if this was the Russian mafia or who we were dealing with. At that stage I felt the best course of action was just to play along with these guys and get out of Russia

Part of his defence could be that he was so confused by what was going on that he didn't even know what country he was in.

aDeener · 02-05-2010 04:06PM

could john higgins use an entrapment defense?

im angry at him but just wondering how will be put his spin on this..

Exclamation Marc · 02-05-2010 04:26PM

aDeener wrote: »

could john higgins use an entrapment defense?

im angry at him but just wondering how will be put his spin on this..

It would be outweighed by the public policy involved. Yeah, he had his privacy invaded by being unlawfully recorded, but the paper will argue it was in the public interest, and win.

Mugser · 02-05-2010 04:27PM

What would have happened if he had got to the final?

yermandan · 02-05-2010 04:33PM

Mugser wrote: »

What would have happened if he had got to the final?

He wouldnt have flown to Kiev on Friday

userod · 02-05-2010 05:03PM

I'm standing by Higgins for the meanwhile. I'm a big fan of his, I think he is a gentleman not to mention a fantastic snooker player. This appears to be very out of character, and something stinks about the whole thing. I hope I'm right and I hope it develops in his favour.

And if he is guilty... we all make mistakes, and everyone has a price.

Chin up John, hang in there.

Herbal Deity · 02-05-2010 05:06PM

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

The last sentence of my post would indicate that I do. I'm puzzled as to why you're being so confrontational...

I mean, what's done is done. I just don't like the idea of a tabloid fabricating a scenario to catch someone out.

Permabear · 02-05-2010 05:19PM

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userod · 02-05-2010 05:20PM

Herbal Deity wrote: »

I just don't like the idea of a tabloid fabricating a scenario to catch someone out.

Either do I, it's sick. I will never buy the News of the World again.

mickdw · 02-05-2010 05:21PM

I thought this entrapment crap has no usefullness in law?

take everything · 02-05-2010 06:07PM

IvySlayer wrote: »

He was one of my most favourite players. I always considered him an absolute professional.

This is what makes it so damaging.
You kinda think- if a guy who seemed whiter than white can do it, what about the others?

Incredible.

Myrddin · 02-05-2010 06:12PM

John Higgins MAY very well be telling the truth here. He was over there for some promotional work etc and ended up feeling pushed into agreeing to this. There may have been 5/6 bald bulldogs off camera giving an impression that the "businessman" wouldnt take no for an answer. Nobody knows at the moment, thats my point.

Regardless of that however, Higgins is on camera agreeing to fix frames/matches. He agreed to it on camera, there is nothing more to say here, his career is over.

The comment about his Spanish property was to try find a way to account for the 300k. He was asking would it work if he re-mortgaged his Spanish home, got a cheque from the bank for 300k, then use the match fixing money to pay off new mortgage. The undercover lad then told him that wouldnt work, as the bank would be wondering where the money came from that he's paying off the loan with.

Permabear · 02-05-2010 06:25PM

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Exclamation Marc · 02-05-2010 06:45PM

Herbal Deity wrote: »

I just don't like the idea of a tabloid fabricating a scenario to catch someone out.

Well in fairness, I doubt it's the first time he's been bribed if he was so open to it as he seemed to be and so assured of what he was doing. The first time any professional is offered a bribe, I'd imagine they'd refuse it flat out.

It's not entrapment either, I wish people would stop saying it was, he wasn't FORCED into taking a bribe. He was put in a situation where a bribe was offered to him yes but he was in that situation and had that convesation by choice, he easily could have said "no, I have too much credibility and respect for the sport" it's not as if they had his family hostage or anything like that. I was a huge John Higgins fan, and I'd love to get behind him and offer up some defence for this, but what defence is there?? If he was induced against his will, he, as a smart guy that he appears to be, would have contacted the police.

My view; not the first time he's done this, if he was that open to it.

ArmaniJeanss · 02-05-2010 06:47PM

mickdw wrote: »

I thought this entrapment crap has no usefullness in law?

You're confusing 'sports law' and 'criminal law'. Agreed there are loads of problems with a criminal case based on entrapment, but when a sporting organisation wants you ejected they don't have to prove any criminal wrong.

For example I could drink 2 bottles of cough medicine and the law of the land won't have a problem, but the athletic federation can still label me a cheat when I win the 100metres and give me a lifetime ban.

Exclamation Marc · 02-05-2010 06:49PM

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

You're confusing 'sports law' and 'criminal law'. Agreed there are loads of problems with a criminal case based on entrapment, but when a sporting organisation wants you ejected they don't have to prove any criminal wrong.

For example I could drink 2 bottles of cough medicine and the law of the land won't have a problem, but the athletic federation can still label me a cheat when I win the 100metres and give me a lifetime ban.

Plus, entrapment has to be commited by someone in an official capacity (ie police), not by some Joe Soap journalist or gangster.

antomadness · 02-05-2010 06:56PM

2 things.

First is that Higgins could have been offered hundreds of bribes in his career and this could be the first time he ever agreed to it. Conversely he could have done it loads of times, there is no way of knowing.

Secondly, who is more at fault here, NOTW or Higgins?

Yes its not a very nice thing to try to "trap" someone, but maybe the next time someone is offered a bribe they will think twice about accepting it, which cant be a bad thing.

antomadness · 02-05-2010 07:05PM

EnterNow wrote: »

John Higgins MAY very well be telling the truth here. He was over there for some promotional work etc and ended up feeling pushed into agreeing to this. There may have been 5/6 bald bulldogs off camera giving an impression that the "businessman" wouldnt take no for an answer. Nobody knows at the moment, thats my point.

Regardless of that however, Higgins is on camera agreeing to fix frames/matches. He agreed to it on camera, there is nothing more to say here, his career is over.

The comment about his Spanish property was to try find a way to account for the 300k. He was asking would it work if he re-mortgaged his Spanish home, got a cheque from the bank for 300k, then use the match fixing money to pay off new mortgage. The undercover lad then told him that wouldnt work, as the bank would be wondering where the money came from that he's paying off the loan with.

If he is telling the truth, why didnt he go straight to the police when he arrived home and file a report, saying he was intimidated into agreeing to lose specific frames as part of an international illegal betting ring.

argosy2006 · 02-05-2010 07:09PM

john higgins could have been saying ''yea yea i'll do that no problem '' agreed to do it as not to offend anyone, then once out of room thought to himself what a couple of chancers and walked away never to contact them again,

Ghost Train · 02-05-2010 07:10PM

Sounds like there was a build up the meeting in Kiev and they weren't backed into agreeing to the deal, not that I trust NOTW completely. Bad day for snooker, very bad day for John. Hope he can play again but can't see it being any time soon

Exclamation Marc · 02-05-2010 07:12PM

antomadness wrote: »

Secondly, who is more at fault here, NOTW or Higgins?

It really is a case of weighing up which is the worse of the two evils, and in my opinion taking a bribe is much worse than tempting someone into a bribe. I doubt this is the first snooker player or sportsperson they've tried to sting, but clearly the ones who turn it down don't make the news.

EDIT, I do have to say that I'd love to be wrong about John and that his claims are true; if they are, I take it all back. And I really hope that happens.

John Higgins match fixing claims

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