Gardaí - Cut our pay and we will become corrupt

PCPhoto · 27-04-2010 01:04PM

vodafoneproblem wrote: »

Got the exact same PM, RoverJames. Someone's doing a lot of undercover PR work! No mention of the incremental scale, I notice...

I got a similar PM - some of the same sentences....but my PM also said the person only earns €350 a week and pays a mortgage of €1000 a month.

I havent responded to the person but if he/she is reading .... I couldnt afford to get a mortgage during the last 10years of my working existence (I've been working for over 15yrs but wouldnt even dream of applying for a mortgage until I had some money to back it up...even now I couldnt afford a mortgage)

so boo fúckin hoo !!

And while I'm at it ....A mortgage of €1000 a month means you got approx €200,000 from the bank - given the repayment amount I can guess that you purchased in the late 90's early 2000's and your property is still worth more or less the same if not slightly more than what you originally paid.

The Maverick · 27-04-2010 02:07PM

RoverJames wrote: »

I wouldn't be surprised if a uniform annoys me over the coming weeks after this to be honest.

All Gardai are going to be on the look out for "RoverJames" for the next while because of his comments on an internet forum? Wow,they must be incredibly well resourced if they can track you down with this to go on.

27-04-2010 02:14PM

The Maverick wrote: »

All Gardai are going to be on the look out for "RoverJames" for the next while because of his comments on an internet forum? Wow,they must be incredibly well resourced if they can track you down with this to go on.

That was a tongue in cheek comment, however as I have posted pictures of my car in recent posts it would take a Garda about 2 minutes to find my address

The Gardai are not as thick as you seem to be.

Liam Byrne · 27-04-2010 02:20PM

kodute wrote: »

Its a pretty ****ty job separating drunken, fighting shams outside supermacs at 2 in the morning. Give them a fair wage.

+1

In addition, isn't the same bull**** line used by politicians to justify their sickening, self-interested salaries, pensions and perks ?

What goes around comes around.......no harm to give the clueless asses a taste of their own bull****.

paraletic · 27-04-2010 02:20PM

should a mod not move this to the emergency service forum - and let the gardai reply?

nah-they'd only get rowdy!

27-04-2010 02:32PM

The Gardai are already PM ing us

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 27-04-2010 02:34PM

SlabMurphy, you haven't the slighest idea of anything. Get yourself a job as a teacher, a PDF personel or a guard, and then come back to us. I bet you'll talk less crap then.

Obviously nobody here is a guard, or a member of the defense forces.

"They are over payed" "They get too many extras" "Too much time off"...

The amount of crap said in this thread is simply amazing. Yet have any of ye experienced these jobs? No you haven't. Come back to us when you have to pull a dead body out of a river, or arrive on the scene of a high speed collision, when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where, ye haven't a fcuking clue, so stop with the bullcrap assumptions. Good people...

The Maverick · 27-04-2010 02:46PM

RoverJames wrote: »

That was a tongue in cheek comment, however as I have posted pictures of my car in recent posts it would take a Garda about 2 minutes to find my address The Gardai are not as thick as you seem to be.

Yet you're the one who is giving out personal information on a highly trafficked website?

27-04-2010 02:46PM

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

SlabMurphy, you haven't the slighest idea of anything. Get yourself a job as a teacher, a PDF personel or a guard, and then come back to us. I bet you'll talk less crap then.

Obviously nobody here is a guard, or a member of the defense forces.

"They are over payed" "They get too many extras" "Too much time off"...

The amount of crap said in this thread is simply amazing. Yet have any of ye experienced these jobs? No you haven't. Come back to us when you have to pull a dead body out of a river, or arrive on the scene of a high speed collision, when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where, ye haven't a fcuking clue, so stop with the bullcrap assumptions. Good people...

Applying your "logic" (I use the term very loosely) if the Publi S is so bad why didn't ye all leave it at the height of the boom ? Or now even. As you mention stopping with assumptions, isn't the point of this thread a chap implying / assuming / suggesting that the pay may encourage Gardai to be corrupt ?

27-04-2010 02:48PM

The Maverick wrote: »

Yet you're the one who is giving out personal information on a highly trafficked website?

I don't give a rats sh1t who looks at this site to be honest, or who deduces where I live. My point was in reply to a suggestion that it would take substantial Garda resources to identify me.

Sofa King Great · 27-04-2010 02:56PM

RoverJames wrote: »

Applying your "logic" (I use the term very loosely) if the Publi S is so bad why didn't ye all leave it at the height of the boom ?

It was a guaranteed income, pay was lower but certain. Risk was higher in the private sector but return was higher.

Public Sector: Higher Certainty/Lower Return
Private Sector: Lower Certainty/Higher Return

RoverJames wrote: »

Or now even. As you mention stopping with assumptions, isn't the point of this thread a chap implying / assuming / suggesting that the pay may encourage Gardai to be corrupt ?

It is more that the burden of debt (as a result of pay cuts & restrictions on second jobs) may cause one or two vulnerable people to be turned by the lure of cash from criminals.

PCPhoto · 27-04-2010 03:08PM

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

Come back to us when you have to pull a dead body out of a river,

- havent been pulling the body out - but have been at the scene of plenty of dead bodies - with the eyes staring blankly at me.

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

or arrive on the scene of a high speed collision,

- been there done that ...loads of times, seen my share thank you very much

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where,

.... strange .... I have 2 answers for that one ..... 1) ....are you talking about a murder scene or do you just have some fascination with childrens body parts - and figuring out which part goes where ?
2) ... I have yet to experience a childs body torn apart - please tell me when you have seen this - I cant find any record online of a dismembered child body found in the state.

Have you personally experienced any of these things ?

The gardai do work hard - but they are paid a LOT more than any other person who might expect to work in a similar fashion.....personally I would prefer if the government hired loads more gardai - and put them on the street, this would mean paying out less in overtime and have an increased presence on the roads which could in theory lead to more criminals caught..... and of course remove the excessive allowances.

I would also accept less tolerance by gardai - rules of the road are ignored by a lot of motorists, even today I saw a guy with no rear licence plate and on the phone while driving ....all this AFTER he was before the courts in contempt of court orders (he's a car dealer).

Rookster · 27-04-2010 04:29PM

RoverJames wrote: »

Applying your "logic" (I use the term very loosely)

if the Publi S is so bad why didn't ye all leave it at the height of the boom ?

Or now even. As you mention stopping with assumptions, isn't the point of this thread a chap implying / assuming / suggesting that the pay may encourage Gardai to be corrupt ?

Because they are too thick to work in the private sector.

danbohan · 27-04-2010 05:23PM

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

SlabMurphy, you haven't the slighest idea of anything. Get yourself a job as a teacher, a PDF personel or a guard, and then come back to us. I bet you'll talk less crap then.

Obviously nobody here is a guard, or a member of the defense forces.

"They are over payed" "They get too many extras" "Too much time off"...

The amount of crap said in this thread is simply amazing. Yet have any of ye experienced these jobs? No you haven't. Come back to us when you have to pull a dead body out of a river, or arrive on the scene of a high speed collision, when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where, ye haven't a fcuking clue, so stop with the bullcrap assumptions. Good people...

when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where,

yea i can see how that would be very difficult for the average garda

Sofa King Great · 27-04-2010 05:26PM

Rookster wrote: »

Because they are too thick to work in the private sector.

Says the fella who can't seem to use the quote function....

OutlawPete · 27-04-2010 05:33PM

danbohan wrote: »

yea i can see how that would be very difficult for the average garda

You're taking him up wrong.

On an average day most Guards will have to tackle something like this:

*NSFW* ...

Donkey Oaty · 27-04-2010 05:45PM

When I reassemble corpses from fragments I find the following song useful:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVoPG9HtYF8

twowheelsonly · 27-04-2010 05:55PM

Firstly, I'm not a Guard and neither am I related to any Guards.
I do however recognise that they have a tough job and deserve to be well paid for it. Most of them are decent enough individuals doing a job that many others either have no interest in doing or don't have the b alls to do. Allowances and time off (they're technically never off duty once they're in this country) are supposedly perks of the job. Does nobody else get time off from their jobs?? Allowances are exactly that - allowances to cover working unsocial hours, weekends, plain clothes, shoes/boots etc.
I would have more respect from some of the critics on here if they first declared what they do for a living and how much they earn so we could make a fair comparison.

Back on topic - The bottom line is that you have to pay for honesty regardless of what business you're in. This is especially true of any of the security services. You don't pay for honesty then you don't get it. Simple. Imagine that you own a shop/pub/restaurant or any cash business and you're paying somebody €5 an hour to work there. Do you honestly think that they're coming in to work for the €5 ? No, they're coming in to rob you!!!
If somebody in the Guards/Prison/Army etc can't meet their living expenses in a Private Sector driven economy then they will be wide open to corruption and human nature dictates that there will be those that succumb to temptation. A lot of that temptation is eliminated if they don't have to worry whether or not they can pay the mortgage next month.

paraletic · 27-04-2010 06:50PM

SlabMurphy wrote: »

God love them - and the rest of our public ' servants ' ( or the public circus as i8 call it ) and semi state employees. Agood proportion of them are driving taxi's, just like the army, porters and ambulance and fire brigade crews etc in hospitals ( reguliar shift hours ,plenty of time off ), and the very hard working teachers ( do around 25 hours a week, off 4/5 months of the year ).

Also Gurads, Army and prison officers retire early, 55 or what ever. A full decade to do offical nixers. Some neck :mad:

waffle!

you don't know my hours, roster conditions etc, because even i don't.
i only find out a week in advance, so do lots of nurses in hospitals, and other paramedics and other public servants,

and what is "a good proportion"? is that an exact figure or just crap?

there are enough anti public service threads on this site, with out adding to it with bull like this.

i know you should be allowed say what you like on the internet, but sometimes, the following rule should apply:
- if you don't know what you are talking about, then, keep it to yourself!

PCPhoto · 27-04-2010 07:58PM

twowheelsonly wrote: »

Firstly, I'm not a Guard and neither am I related to any Guards.
I do however recognise that they have a tough job and deserve to be well paid for it. Most of them are decent enough individuals doing a job that many others either have no interest in doing or don't have the b alls to do. Allowances and time off (they're technically never off duty once they're in this country) are supposedly perks of the job. Does nobody else get time off from their jobs?? Allowances are exactly that - allowances to cover working unsocial hours, weekends, plain clothes, shoes/boots etc.
I would have more respect from some of the critics on here if they first declared what they do for a living and how much they earn so we could make a fair comparison.

Back on topic - The bottom line is that you have to pay for honesty regardless of what business you're in. This is especially true of any of the security services. You don't pay for honesty then you don't get it. Simple. Imagine that you own a shop/pub/restaurant or any cash business and you're paying somebody €5 an hour to work there. Do you honestly think that they're coming in to work for the €5 ? No, they're coming in to rob you!!!
If somebody in the Guards/Prison/Army etc can't meet their living expenses in a Private Sector driven economy then they will be wide open to corruption and human nature dictates that there will be those that succumb to temptation. A lot of that temptation is eliminated if they don't have to worry whether or not they can pay the mortgage next month.

do you know that they have a lot of allowances which simply dont make sense. my main example is the "lanzarotte allowance"

which means they get an allowance to give them money for the overtime they missed while they were on holidays !!!!

I dont understand the "Plain Clothes" allowance .... they get paid to buy ordinary clothes which they can wear as part of work if they are required to not use their uniform - whats wrong with using their normal clothes - why do they have to get money to compensate them for not wearing their uniform....apologies to gardai but in my opinion the allowances are too much.

(how many people remember bringing money to school for charity so instead of wearing your uniform you could wear your ordinary clothes)

I agree that the gardai need to be paid accordingly for the fact that they deal with the scummiest of scum on the streets - but they have a core salary ....overtime ...and then allowance after allowance....I suppose the general population want transparency - when you look at politicians you cant see what they earn due to their "allowances" - the general public is annoyed with the higher section of society giving themselves bonuses/allowances while the rest of us are taxed through the hole.

I'm self employed and have to work 7 days a week to make sure I can pay my bills and cover my debts - I dont own any property....so with regards to garda allowances for anti social hours .... if you dont want to work shiftwork ...get an office job !! ..... I work whenever I get a call asking if Im available - this sometimes means changing my plans within minutes of receiving a phonecall .......... in my line of work - if you want work you make yourself available at ANY time. (infact I just got a call a few mins ago asking if I'm available for the next 3hrs .... so... thats me outta here.)

MagicSean · 27-04-2010 08:15PM

PCPhoto wrote: »

do you know that they have a lot of allowances which simply dont make sense. my main example is the "lanzarotte allowance"

which means they get an allowance to give them money for the overtime they missed while they were on holidays !!!!

You clearly don't know what you are talking about. It's not for overtime missed. It's a partial payment towards the shift allowance they missed while they were on annual leave. It doesn't add up to much at all. It has nothing to do with overtime.

PCPhoto wrote: »

I dont understand the "Plain Clothes" allowance .... they get paid to buy ordinary clothes which they can wear as part of work if they are required to not use their uniform - whats wrong with using their normal clothes - why do they have to get money to compensate them for not wearing their uniform....apologies to gardai but in my opinion the allowances are too much.

(how many people remember bringing money to school for charity so instead of wearing your uniform you could wear your ordinary clothes)

Because plain clothes doesn't mean "wear anything". They have to dress according to the code.

PCPhoto wrote: »

I agree that the gardai need to be paid accordingly for the fact that they deal with the scummiest of scum on the streets - but they have a core salary ....overtime ...and then allowance after allowance....I suppose the general population want transparency - when you look at politicians you cant see what they earn due to their "allowances" - the general public is annoyed with the higher section of society giving themselves bonuses/allowances while the rest of us are taxed through the hole.

Again you show you know nothing but what you have read in the papers. Gardaí get a weekly rent allowance to take account of the fact that they have no say over where they are required to work and can be moved accross the country at 4 weeks notice. This means that Gardaí who have a house already will be required to rent in another area until they can get a transfer back to where their house is. They also get a weekly allowance for maintaining their uniform as there is no facility available in the station for this. Gardaí who work weekends and nights get a monthly allowance for this. As is the norm in every job.

I posted the actual figures in another thread but I will repost it here. The gross pay for a garda with 2 years service and no overtime is €650 a week including all weekly allowances. Monthly shift allowances work out at about €65 a week and pension deductions are about €60. Income levy is around €15.

PCPhoto wrote: »

I'm self employed and have to work 7 days a week to make sure I can pay my bills and cover my debts - I dont own any property.

Gardaí cannot work extra days as there is very little overtime and they are not allowed work in any job where their skills would be useful to them. Most Gardaí are mortgaged up to the gills with their first property. A lot of them are in negative equity and struggle to pay due to the loss of at least 15% of their income in 2 years.

Sofa King Great · 27-04-2010 09:10PM

PCPhoto wrote: »

I dont understand the "Plain Clothes" allowance .... they get paid to buy ordinary clothes which they can wear as part of work if they are required to not use their uniform - whats wrong with using their normal clothes - why do they have to get money to compensate them for not wearing their uniform....apologies to gardai but in my opinion the allowances are too much.

Well they need clothes for day to day wear, suits for court etc, clothes for searches. Also it is possible for them to have junkies spitting at them and to have to go climbing walls, running through fields etc. Not your normal day to day wear of clothes

questioner · 27-04-2010 09:21PM

is there such a thing as a desk duty allowance which entitles you to x amount each year because you are working 9 to 5 and precluded from earning overtime unsoc hours etc?

questioner · 27-04-2010 09:23PM

Sofa King Great wrote: »

climbing walls, running through fields etc.

sure thats great craic altogether

MagicSean · 27-04-2010 09:27PM

questioner wrote: »

is there such a thing as a desk duty allowance which entitles you to x amount each year because you are working 9 to 5 and precluded from earning overtime unsoc hours etc?

Not that I know of.

Paddy Samurai · 27-04-2010 09:28PM

PCPhoto wrote: »

I'm self employed and have to work 7 days a week to make sure I can pay my bills and cover my debts - I dont own any property....so with regards to garda allowances for anti social hours .... if you dont want to work shiftwork ...get an office job !! ..... I work whenever I get a call asking if Im available - this sometimes means changing my plans within minutes of receiving a phonecall .......... in my line of work - if you want work you make yourself available at ANY time. (infact I just got a call a few mins ago asking if I'm available for the next 3hrs .... so... thats me outta here.)

You on the Game?.

questioner · 27-04-2010 09:37PM

"Officers engaged in full-time policing administration are paid €5,203 per year to compensate for the loss of other allowances, particularly unsocial working hour allowances"

this is what i was talking about, its about 3/4 the way down the page

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2009/1112/1224258653768.html

MagicSean · 27-04-2010 09:43PM

questioner wrote: »

"Officers engaged in full-time policing administration are paid €5,203 per year to compensate for the loss of other allowances, particularly unsocial working hour allowances"

this is what i was talking about, its about 3/4 the way down the page

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2009/1112/1224258653768.html

Well if the Times says its true it must be. :rolleyes: It'd be news to me if it did exist. Some desk workers are entitled to allowances but these aren't full time desk workers. Their job generally requires them to do a lot of travel around the district or division. Positions such as the crime scene examiners and psv inspectors.

27-04-2010 11:21PM

twowheelsonly wrote: »

A lot of that temptation is eliminated if they don't have to worry whether or not they can pay the mortgage next month.

Who doesn't worry about paying bills, that's called life tbh. If you don't want to worry about you either have a sh1t standard of living or you earn f loads and have a very modest one.

jonsnow · 28-04-2010 12:11AM

Madilynn Chubby Jeans wrote: »

SlabMurphy, you haven't the slighest idea of anything. Get yourself a job as a teacher, a PDF personel or a guard, and then come back to us. I bet you'll talk less crap then.

Obviously nobody here is a guard, or a member of the defense forces.

"They are over payed" "They get too many extras" "Too much time off"...

The amount of crap said in this thread is simply amazing. Yet have any of ye experienced these jobs? No you haven't. Come back to us when you have to pull a dead body out of a river, or arrive on the scene of a high speed collision, when you are looking at a childs different body parts and trying to figure out what goes where, ye haven't a fcuking clue, so stop with the bullcrap assumptions. Good people...

Madilynn Chubby Jeans, you haven't the slighest idea of anything. Get yourself a job as a taoiseach, a Minister for Finance or a TD, and then come back to us. I bet you'll talk less crap then.

Obviously nobody here is a taoiseach, or a Minister for Finance.

"They are over payed" "They get too many extras" "Too much time off"...

The amount of crap said in this thread is simply amazing. Yet have any of ye experienced these jobs? No you haven't. Come back to us when you have to run a country, or formulate a national budget in the teeth of a recession, when you are looking at a complex and controversial piece of legislation and trying to figure out what goes where, ye haven't a fcuking clue, so stop with the bullcrap assumptions. Good people..

See what I did there.Maybe we should stop putting people who work in certain professions ie.guards/,nurses/ teachers/whoever up on pedestals.Nobody is beyond criticism and its that kind of thinking that says certain groups of people are beyond criticism that has got us into the mess we are in today as a country.

Gardaí - Cut our pay and we will become corrupt

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