Cash hit gardai want to work as bouncers

RMD · 26-04-2010 09:24PM

cson wrote: »

My heart bleeds.

Is there any other job in the world where you get paid to be a bollocks?

How hypocritical, tarring the entire bouncer community as bollockses, you don't come across as one yourself.

DublinWriter · 26-04-2010 09:24PM

Nijmegen wrote: »

I would daresay also that the police in the US have been involved, per capita, in more questionable incidents involving, you know, beating the hell out of people, than elsewhere.

Per capita, eh?

I'll see your Rodney King and raise you Donegal, The Battle of Temple Bar and Shell-to-Sea.

Maybe more members could work as taxi-drivers in lieu of doing the Advanced Driver Course?

El Siglo · 26-04-2010 09:40PM

DublinWriter wrote: »

Per capita, eh?

I'll see your Rodney King and raise you Donegal, The Battle of Temple Bar and Shell-to-Sea.

Maybe more members could work as taxi-drivers in lieu of doing the Advanced Driver Course?

The best of the Gardai: Landsdowne Road, 1995... never so proud to see a skull getting cracked in all my life!:D

Run_to_da_hills · 26-04-2010 09:58PM

IvySlayer wrote: »

Anyone can carry guns over there...

Not necessarly, any blemish on your record including many public order offenses could prevent you from holding a firearms license. Bouncers in particular would be screened and regulated.

smcgiff · 26-04-2010 10:11PM

Re conflict of interest - Assuming the Gardai work in their general locality, how can they be a bouncer one night and then check for the likes of after hours on another night at the same premises.

Run_to_da_hills · 26-04-2010 10:23PM

smcgiff wrote: »

Re conflict of interest - Assuming the Gardai work in their general locality, how can they be a bouncer one night and then check for the likes of after hours on another night at the same premises.

I know of one pub not too far from Ennis run by retired Garda detective, they fon't have any problem with security or dealing with after hours.

sdanseo · 26-04-2010 10:27PM

Not a good idea. If a Garda had to stop and arrest every single person they saw doing drugs in a club they'd be inundated and never have a chance to do their second job at all. Bouncers will simply kick you out and ignore the rest, Gardaí don't have that luxury, they're compelled to intervene if the need arises or at least report all illegalities.

stepbar · 26-04-2010 10:45PM

Oh come on.... it's quite obvious that the GRA are now scraping the barrel in order to provoke a responce from the Government.

RTE.ie wrote:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0426/garda.html
Delegates are demanding a reversal of the pay cuts and pension levies and the right to negotiate directly with their employer.

questioner · 27-04-2010 12:08AM

including allowances whats a young garda likely to take home in a year? and how much overtime are they allowed do?

starbelgrade · 27-04-2010 12:12AM

They could work as bouncers in some of the cities - but not in small towns that don't have 24 hour shops for them to get their sambos for breaktime.

dunleakelleher · 27-04-2010 04:25PM

questioner wrote: »

including allowances whats a young garda likely to take home in a year? and how much overtime are they allowed do?

The average garda wage in 2008 was €1,207.24.
So you can see how they are caught for a bob or two.

http://www.cso.ie/quicktables/GetQuickTables.aspx?FileName=PSA01.asp&TableName=Public+Sector+Average+Weekly+Earnings&StatisticalProduct=DB_PS

cson · 27-04-2010 04:43PM

RMD wrote: »

How hypocritical, tarring the entire bouncer community as bollockses, you don't come across as one yourself.

How is hypocritical? Or do they not teach the meaning of words in Bouncer College? I've conducted studies, and 95% of the time Bouncers are bollockses all the time. :cool:

Riddle101 · 27-04-2010 05:20PM

Leave the security to the prefessionals(Bouncers) I say. There's no need for the Gardai to be working the doors of nightclubs. let them do their real job and enforce the law. You wouldn't see bouncers arresting criminals, so the Gardai shouldn't be working as bouncers.

MagicSean · 27-04-2010 05:22PM

dunleakelleher wrote: »

The average garda wage in 2008 was €1,207.24.
So you can see how they are caught for a bob or two.

http://www.cso.ie/quicktables/GetQuickTables.aspx?FileName=PSA01.asp&TableName=Public+Sector+Average+Weekly+Earnings&StatisticalProduct=DB_PS

Thats a load of crap. Read the part about how those stats are found. Those stats include every rank from garda to commissioner. They include all overtime and do not incorporate the pension levy or pay cut.

questioner · 27-04-2010 05:39PM

k_mac wrote: »

They include all overtime .

wrong.

perhaps you might enlighten us as to what the median wage of a young garda is?

i think its disgraceful and bordering on extortion for the GRA to hang the threat of garda corruption over us in order to secure concessions. Additionally if i was a member i would be highly insulted at an insinuation of corruption. hard enough to gain the trust of the public as it is without morons destroying the organsitions reputation from within.

and people do too much ranting about the pension levy etc anyway, we live in deflationary times that and oh yeah - THE COUNTRYS BROKE

MagicSean · 27-04-2010 05:56PM

questioner wrote: »

wrong.

perhaps you might enlighten us as to what the median wage of a young garda is?

i think its disgraceful and bordering on extortion for the GRA to hang the threat of garda corruption over us in order to secure concessions. Additionally if i was a member i would be highly insulted at an insinuation of corruption. hard enough to gain the trust of the public as it is without morons destroying the organsitions reputation from within.

and people do too much ranting about the pension levy etc anyway, we live in deflationary times that and oh yeah - THE COUNTRYS BROKE

Actually I'm right. There's a second figure for non-overtime listed. I think its around €1050 or something. The gross pay for a garda with 2 years service and no overtime is €650 a week including all weekly allowances. Monthly shift allowances work out at about €65 a week and pension deductions are about €60. Income levy is around €15. So you can see why the figure on the CSO site is wrong. By about 100%. But hey, who wants the truth anyway? It's not as interesting.

questioner · 27-04-2010 06:16PM

k_mac wrote: »

Actually I'm right. .

you are, i was looking at the lower figure.

Im looking at the gra figures and i make someone on 2 years experience + rent allowance to be approx 730 gross not including misc allowances/ overtime. and not including levies.

Supplementary benefits have to play a big role as well, whats the rate of interest at the garda credit union? Medical ? dental?

do they pay for further education as well?

i guess what im trying to say is that the gardai have a good number, their job is tough but hey they knew that before they signed up and everyones job is tough. thats why its called work.

I reckon the gardai who want to be allowed work extra jobs are those who thought they might start their own private fiefdom and over exposed themselves in the property market. i know of about 5 members in my own time who have any amount of shoddy student houses.

If recruitment was to open tomorrow i can only imagine the surge of applications and you can be sure that none of them would complain about the pay or be looking to work extra jobs.

MagicSean · 27-04-2010 06:36PM

questioner wrote: »

Im looking at the gra figures and i make someone on 2 years experience + rent allowance to be approx 730 gross not including misc allowances/ overtime. and not including levies.

Supplementary benefits have to play a big role as well, whats the rate of interest at the garda credit union? Medical ? dental?

I'm looking at my payslip. I think it's more accurate.

Garda Medical is more expensive than VHI. In addition most Gardaí need to invest in various critical illness and injury schemes as there is a high risk of injury on the job.

Credit Union lending rates are good for car loans and students but nothing spectacular. I couldn't tell you the savings rates.

i71jskz5xu42pb · 27-04-2010 06:43PM

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Would this be a good idea?

If you've ever been in anywhere in the US where off duty cops act as bouncers (Houston is an example) you'll know what a terrible idea this is. Most uncomfortable feeling ever, made worse by the fact that they are in uniform and armed.

questioner · 27-04-2010 07:20PM

k_mac wrote: »

I'm looking at my payslip. I think it's more accurate.

i guess it would be, although you could have offered that info a couple of posts ago and saved me some fruitless searching.

I also see that you've made no remarks on :

1. whether gardai should be allowed moonlight

2. whether or not you think its acceptable for the GRA to hold the threat of corruption as a bargaining chip

3. whether or not you personally are insulted by the insinuation (by your own representative body) that you might be susceptible to corruption due to financial hardship

MagicSean · 27-04-2010 07:40PM

questioner wrote: »

i guess it would be, although you could have offered that info a couple of posts ago and saved me some fruitless searching.

I also see that you've made no remarks on :

1. whether gardai should be allowed moonlight

2. whether or not you think its acceptable for the GRA to hold the threat of corruption as a bargaining chip

3. whether or not you personally are insulted by the insinuation (by your own representative body) that you might be susceptible to corruption due to financial hardship

I did offer it. You just didn't believe me until I mentioned it was on a payslip.

1. Yes. I worked in a bookies before I joined. Now I can't. My girlfriend manages a bookies and they've been short staffed a few days during big festivals. It would have been very beneficial if I had been allowed work there the odd day.

2 Its not a threat. They are stating a fact. If you continue to cut wages gardaí who are struggling will become more succebtable to corruption. If it came to a choice they might choose their familys welfare over a job where they feel unappreciated.

3 Doesn't bother me because I wouldn't consider myself in that group of people who are at that stage of desperation. Although I understand why someone would do it I would have no sympathy for them at all if they did.

questioner · 27-04-2010 08:23PM

k_mac wrote: »

I did offer it. You just didn't believe me until I mentioned it was on a payslip.

1. Yes. I worked in a bookies before I joined. Now I can't. My girlfriend manages a bookies and they've been short staffed a few days during big festivals. It would have been very beneficial if I had been allowed work there the odd day.

2 Its not a threat. They are stating a fact. If you continue to cut wages gardaí who are struggling will become more succebtable to corruption. If it came to a choice they might choose their familys welfare over a job where they feel unappreciated.

3 Doesn't bother me because I wouldn't consider myself in that group of people who are at that stage of desperation. Although I understand why someone would do it I would have no sympathy for them at all if they did.

i meant offer that the information was on a payslip as i assumed you might be getting it from the same souces as i was (eg the GRA website.

1. beneficial to you yes, but to society in general? familiarity breeds contempt. what if a garda wanted to work in a head shop? do you think that society's interests would best be served by members of its police force engaging in work that many segments of society feel is inherently corrupt or open to abuse? e.g. doorwork?

2. there was a bully in my school who used to go around saying "..ill break your nose"
when asked was that a threat he'd respond "no, thats a fact."

i do not know anyone who does not feel unappreciated in work on occasion, that justifies nothing.
the fact that you are justifying potential garda corruption via the starving family argument is very worrying. what you are implying is that if the cirucmstances are exigent then corruption is inevitable and not only that but understandable. I am open to correction but it is my experience that those who become corrupt do so for their own gain and due to their own profligacy. i am thinking of the corruption in new south wales and donegal in particular.

3. you are a member of AGS, an entity which relies more so than any other on its reputation. the actions of every member reflect on the organsition and the publics perception of it.

Since the introduction of PULSE the potential for a corrupt member to do untold damage has increased exponentially. This has been highlighted recently in dublin(finglas i think), TBH if i had a complaint or information about the activities of a gangland or paramilitary figure i would be very slow to make that information known to the AGS and i must saw the more i hear the more i feel im justified in that stance.

27-04-2010 08:28PM

k_mac wrote: »

2 Its not a threat. They are stating a fact. If you continue to cut wages gardaí who are struggling will become more succebtable to corruption.

There's always someone with more money than their salary anyway so they're always susceptible if it's just a question of price

RMD · 27-04-2010 08:31PM

cson wrote: »

How is hypocritical? Or do they not teach the meaning of words in Bouncer College? I've conducted studies, and 95% of the time Bouncers are bollockses all the time. :cool:

English isn't my first language so excuse me for confusing the meaning of the word. I'm not a bouncer so I'm not biased in this argument, from my own personal experience, a bouncer will only be a bollocks if the customer is being a bollocks themselves.

MagicSean · 27-04-2010 09:08PM

questioner wrote: »

i meant offer that the information was on a payslip as i assumed you might be getting it from the same souces as i was (eg the GRA website.

1. beneficial to you yes, but to society in general? familiarity breeds contempt. what if a garda wanted to work in a head shop? do you think that society's interests would best be served by members of its police force engaging in work that many segments of society feel is inherently corrupt or open to abuse? e.g. doorwork?

2. there was a bully in my school who used to go around saying "..ill break your nose"
when asked was that a threat he'd respond "no, thats a fact."

i do not know anyone who does not feel unappreciated in work on occasion, that justifies nothing.
the fact that you are justifying potential garda corruption via the starving family argument is very worrying. what you are implying is that if the cirucmstances are exigent then corruption is inevitable and not only that but understandable. I am open to correction but it is my experience that those who become corrupt do so for their own gain and due to their own profligacy. i am thinking of the corruption in new south wales and donegal in particular.

3. you are a member of AGS, an entity which relies more so than any other on its reputation. the actions of every member reflect on the organsition and the publics perception of it.

Since the introduction of PULSE the potential for a corrupt member to do untold damage has increased exponentially. This has been highlighted recently in dublin(finglas i think), TBH if i had a complaint or information about the activities of a gangland or paramilitary figure i would be very slow to make that information known to the AGS and i must saw the more i hear the more i feel im justified in that stance.

1. So Gardaí should have no seperate life outside their work? If it's just a job and Gardaí are just public servants why can they not have a seperate personal life? This is the reason police are paid well in general. Because of what they are expected to give up.

2. I didn't try and justify anything. I'd have no problem turning a corrupt garda in. I just gave the reasoning behind the statement of the GRA.

3. Since the Donegal incident confidential information is treated very differently in the Gardaí. Nothing of importance to a criminal is accessable on pulse.

questioner · 27-04-2010 09:13PM

1. never said that,it is impossible not to have a personal life, it is not impossible to not have another job. Things can already get complicated enough via conflict of interest, why muddy the waters even further?

2. accepted.

3. Dunne must have been wasting his money so. http://www.herald.ie/national-news/3-gardai-on-gang-payroll-1911855.html

Bob Z · 27-04-2010 09:51PM

Whats the official reason for the Guyardai not being allowed to do Security work? They arent allowed to do other types of work either

dunleakelleher · 28-04-2010 08:06PM

questioner wrote: »

Im looking at the gra figures and i make someone on 2 years experience + rent allowance to be approx 730 gross not including misc allowances/ overtime. and not including levies.

Wow, that is unbelievable money for somebody in the job for only two years. And it only goes up from there. That must be one of the best paying jobs in the country.
The CSO figure are well conservative so concerning they are an average from all ranks (suppose the would be, government office give figures on government jobs).
That is fantastic money they are on. Wouldn't mind that job. Are they recruiting at the moment. wouldn't mind a piece of that lushes pie.

Teddy Daniels · 28-04-2010 10:42PM

work out the teachers wages per week worked.

questioner · 28-04-2010 11:24PM

prison officers best paid entry level civil servants in the country, i dont begrudge them that at all though - there is no way i could see myself going to work day in day out with nothing but scumbags around me. not as if you can threaten them with going to jail either. At least gardai are in public and deal with ordinary people as well.

Cash hit gardai want to work as bouncers

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