Vegetarian problems

epgc3fyqirnbsx · 20-04-2010 12:52AM #1

Nothing against the veggies (thick eejits :rolleyes:) but this is just one dilemma that popped into my head today for no particular reason and I couldn't find a more suitable thread

I think I would be safe in assuming that a lot of vegetarians have pets, cats and dogs etc.
But what about the pet food, do they have to be veggies then or can they even be veggies?
You can have the argument that we, as humans, are above it now and can get our protein off tofu and cardboard etc
But petfood comes from the same processes as what us filthy carnivores eat off??

Not trying to stir **** but if there's any veggies out there I'd like to hear an opinion

DazMarz · 20-04-2010 12:53AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0W5x5kugnbs

we'llallhavetea_old · 20-04-2010 12:53AM

jaysus, i never thought of that...

hypocrites!!!! :mad:

kraggy · 20-04-2010 12:55AM

1. Yes, it is possible to raise a cat or dog on a vegetarian diet. Many people do so.

2. A person not eating meat is still reducing the amount of animals killed over their lifetime even if their dog/cat eats meat.

It's difficult at times being vegetarian, but you try to have some effect rather than none at all (but not all vegetarians abstain from eating meat for animal rights issues).

orourkeda · 20-04-2010 12:56AM

Life just wouldnt be worth living if we couldnt eat dead animals.

we'llallhavetea_old · 20-04-2010 12:57AM

this has got me thinking... vegans mustn't swallow. :eek:

Gummy Panda · 20-04-2010 12:59AM

we'llallhavetea wrote: »

this has got me thinking... vegans mustn't swallow. :eek:

You've got a dirty mind

The_Minister · 20-04-2010 01:01AM

kraggy wrote: »

1. Yes, it is possible to raise a cat or dog on a vegetarian diet. Many people do so.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRSLQu-d6ZQ

orourkeda · 20-04-2010 01:01AM

we'llallhavetea wrote: »

this has got me thinking... vegans mustn't swallow. :eek:

Especially the animal juice

we'llallhavetea_old · 20-04-2010 01:03AM

Gummy Panda wrote: »

You've got a dirty mind

i mean, ye know... any animal by products, what you talkin bout?

recylingbin · 20-04-2010 01:07AM

If God didn't want us eating animals, why did he make them out of meat?

epgc3fyqirnbsx · 20-04-2010 01:10AM

recylingbin wrote: »

If God didn't want us eating animals, why did he make them out of meat?

exactly

--LOS-- · 20-04-2010 01:10AM

sure cats will hunt and eat birds, rabbits, mice anyways

bronte · 20-04-2010 01:12AM

Vincenzo CoolS Spat wrote: »

Nothing against the veggies (thick eejits :rolleyes:) but this is just one dilemma that popped into my head today for no particular reason and I couldn't find a more suitable thread

I think I would be safe in assuming that a lot of vegetarians have pets, cats and dogs etc.
But what about the pet food, do they have to be veggies then or can they even be veggies?
You can have the argument that we, as humans, are above it now and can get our protein off tofu and cardboard etc
But petfood comes from the same processes as what us filthy carnivores eat off??

Not trying to stir **** but if there's any veggies out there I'd like to hear an opinion

I have been vegetarian for 17 years.
My pet cat eats whiskas.
Believe it or not , a lot of vegetarians prefer not to push their beliefs on their pets and/or children.

That'd be like inflicting your religion on them or some other such nonsense...which of course nobody does , right?

we'llallhavetea_old · 20-04-2010 01:13AM

--LOS-- wrote: »

sure cats will hunt and eat birds, rabbits, mice anyways

yeah they will. if they're allowed outside. i think its a bit mean forcing your pet to be a veggie, they naturally want meat, s'not fair.

orourkeda · 20-04-2010 01:15AM

bronte wrote: »

I have been vegetarian for 17 years.
My pet cat eats whiskas.
Believe it or not , a lot of vegetarians prefer not to push their beliefs on their pets and/or children.

That'd be like inflicting your religion on them or some other such nonsense...which of course nobody does , right?

They'll inflict them on their children though.

bronte · 20-04-2010 01:17AM

orourkeda wrote: »

They'll inflict them on their children though.

Vegetarians will?

Each to their own, but I'd never make children of mine be vegetarian.

recylingbin · 20-04-2010 01:18AM

The pets can probably overpower their veggie overlords anyway, so it's not an issue for them.

m@cc@ · 20-04-2010 01:19AM

recylingbin wrote: »

If God didn't want us eating animals, why did he make them out of meat?

Palin for President!

bronte · 20-04-2010 01:19AM

recylingbin wrote: »

The pets can probably overpower their veggie overlords anyway, so it's not an issue for them.

This is true. :pac:

Evil kitten. :eek:

epgc3fyqirnbsx · 20-04-2010 01:22AM

bronte wrote: »

Vegetarians will?

Each to their own, but I'd never make children of mine be vegetarian.

Thanks for your post and I wasn't having any digs just a random thought
I'm sure most are like you, you have your beliefs and will stick with them and fair play for that.
Just wondering what some over-zealous types might think
Kinda like religion really, let everyone make up their own mind.
But I would think, and I dont know, that if I had kids and I was a veggie, well the paternal insticnt is so strong, I would like to see them get fed with milk and meat and grow strong. But I'm sure there are plenty of veggies who say that isn't necessary.
But, imo, bring them up as nature intended, once thery're strong they can make up there own mind

yerayeah · 20-04-2010 01:22AM

Why, oh why would you not eat meat?:eek: Genuinely, any vegetarians here, why?

Once this year, I was getting dinner in the canteen and asked for vol-au-vonts thinking they were chicken and mushroom. They were only mushroom. I still regret not just getting the roast beef.

OutlawPete · 20-04-2010 01:23AM

bronte wrote: »

Believe it or not , a lot of vegetarians prefer not to push their beliefs on their pets and/or children.

Vegetarians get a tough press.

I'm not a vegan or anything but I would like to be.

I eat in a Vegan restaurant when in town though, have done since I was 16.

Love the place.

There are many happy vegans, living quite happily and healthily without meat.

m@cc@ · 20-04-2010 01:23AM

Vincenzo CoolS Spat wrote: »

But, imo, bring them up as nature intended, once thery're strong they can make up there own mind

How do you know what nature intended?

Are human beings anatomically more similar to natural carnivores or to natural herbivores? Let’s find out….

•Intestinal tract length. Carnivorous animals have intestinal tracts that are 3-6x their body length, while herbivores have intestinal tracts 10-12x their body length. Human beings have the same intestinal tract ratio as herbivores.
•Stomach acidity. Carnivores’ stomachs are 20x more acidic than the stomachs of herbivores. Human stomach acidity matches that of herbivores.
•Saliva. The saliva of carnivores is acidic. The saliva of herbivores is alkaline, which helps pre-digest plant foods. Human saliva is alkaline.
•Shape of intestines. Carnivore bowels are smooth, shaped like a pipe, so meat passes through quickly — they don’t have bumps or pockets. Herbivore bowels are bumpy and pouch-like with lots of pockets, like a windy mountain road, so plant foods pass through slowly for optimal nutrient absorption. Human bowels have the same characteristics as those of herbivores.
•Fibre. Carnivores don’t require fiber to help move food through their short and smooth digestive tracts. Herbivores require dietary fiber to move food through their long and bumpy digestive tracts, to prevent the bowels from becoming clogged with rotting food. Humans have the same requirement as herbivores.
•Cholesterol. Cholesterol is not a problem for a carnivore’s digestive system. A carnivore such as a cat can handle a high-cholesterol diet without negative health consequences. A human cannot. Humans have zero dietary need for cholesterol because our bodies manufacture all we need. Cholesterol is only found in animal foods, never in plant foods. A plant-based diet is by definition cholesterol-free.
•Claws and teeth. Carnivores have claws, sharp front teeth capable of subduing prey, and no flat molars for chewing. Herbivores have no claws or sharp front teeth capable of subduing prey, but they have flat molars for chewing. Humans have the same characteristics as herbivores

epgc3fyqirnbsx · 20-04-2010 01:24AM

recylingbin wrote: »

The pets can probably overpower their veggie overlords anyway, so it's not an issue for them.

Had to post this

Dogs Diary
8:00 am - OH BOY! DOG FOOD! MY FAVORITE!
9:30 am - OH BOY! A CAR RIDE! MY FAVORITE!
9:40 am - OH BOY! A WALK! MY FAVORITE!
10:30 am - OH BOY! A CAR RIDE! MY FAVORITE!
11:30 am - OH BOY! DOG FOOD! MY FAVORITE!
12:00 noon - OH BOY! THE KIDS! MY FAVORITE!
1:00 pm OH BOY! THE YARD! MY FAVORITE!
1:30 pm - ooooooo. bath. bummer.
4:00 pm - OH BOY! THE KIDS! MY FAVORITE!
5:00 PM - OH BOY! DOG FOOD! MY FAVORITE!
5:30 PM - OH BOY! MOM! MY FAVORITE

EXCERPTS FROM A CAT'S DIARY

DAY 752 - My captors continue to taunt me with bizarre little dangling objects. They dine lavishly on fresh meat, while I am forced to eat dry cereal. The only thing that keeps me going is the hope of escape, and the mild satisfaction I get from ruining the occasional piece of furniture...Tomorrow I may eat another houseplant.

DAY 761 - Today my attempt to kill my captors by weaving around their feet while they were walking almost succeeded, must try this at the top of the stairs. In an attempt to disgust and repulse these vile oppressors,I once again induced myself to vomit on their favorite chair...must try this On their bed.

DAY 765 - Decapitated a mouse and brought them the headless body in attempt to make them aware of what I am capable of, and to try to strike fear into their hearts. They only cooed and condescended about what a good little cat I was... Not working according to plan.

DAY 768 - I am finally aware of how sadistic they are. For no good reason I was chosen for the water torture. This time however it included a burning foamy chemical called "shampoo." What sick minds could invent such a liquid. My only consolation is the piece of thumb still LODGED between my teeth.

DAY 771 - There was some sort of gathering of their accomplices. I was placed in solitary throughout the event, however, I could hear the noise and smell the foul odor of the glass tubes they call "beer." More importantly I overheard that my confinement was due to MY power of "allergies." Must learn what this is and how to use it to my advantage.

DAY 774 - I am convinced the other captives are flunkies and maybe snitches. The dog is routinely released and seems more than happy to return. He is obviously a half-wit. The bird on the other hand has got to be an informant, and he speaks with them regularly. I am certain he reports my activities. Due to his current placement in the metal room his safety is assured. But I can wait, it is only a matter of time...

If anyone likes dogs over cats can you please let me know so I can ignore your posts in future

recylingbin · 20-04-2010 01:24AM

OutlawPete wrote: »

Vegetarians get a tough press.

I'm not a vegan or anything but I would like to be.

I eat in a Vegan restaurant when in town though, have done since I was 16.

Love the place.

There are many happy vegans.

You're thinking of vulcan.

And they're not happy. That would be illogical.

bronte · 20-04-2010 01:28AM

Vincenzo CoolS Spat wrote: »

Thanks for your post and I wasn't having any digs just a random thought
I'm sure most are like you, you have your beliefs and will stick with them and fair play for that.
Just wondering what some over-zealous types might think
Kinda like religion really, let everyone make up their own mind.
But I would think, and I dont know, that if I had kids and I was a veggie, well the paternal insticnt is so strong, I would like to see them get fed with milk and meat and grow strong. But I'm sure there are plenty of veggies who say that isn't necessary.
But, imo, bring them up as nature intended, once thery're strong they can make up there own mind

Well I was brought up eating meat, and when I was 9 I decided it wasn't for me anymore. My parents were naturally concerned, but respected my wishes and I'm grateful for that.
Never did me any disservice.
I'm the member of my family who never really gets sick at all.

yerayeah wrote: »

Why, oh why would you not eat meat?:eek: Genuinely, any vegetarians here, why?

Honestly? I was never really that into it, and when I started feeling guilty at the age of 9, I just gave it up completely.
I will admit that the smell of crispy bacon does funny things to me still, but no!
Willpower!

recylingbin · 20-04-2010 01:32AM

Vincenzo CoolS Spat wrote: »

diaries

You do know that neither dogs nor cats actually keep diaries.

I can't stand cats fwiw.

bronte · 20-04-2010 01:34AM

OutlawPete wrote: »

Vegetarians get a tough press.

I'm not a vegan or anything but I would like to be.

I eat in a Vegan restaurant when in town though, have done since I was 16.

Love the place.

There are many happy vegans, living quite happily and healthily without meat.

Aye, I never really even mention it to be honest!
Only if someone comments that I'm not eating meat.
I still have (older) family members say "Are you still not eating properly?" :pac:
You just have to smile and let it go.

Wish I had the discipline to be vegan alright.

OutlawPete · 20-04-2010 01:35AM

bronte wrote: »

I will admit that the smell of crispy bacon does funny things to me still ..

You'll that a lot of what people crave meat for is from the addiction of cooked meats.

Someone that craves meat will snap a breast of chicken out of your hands and suck the bones dry, finger licking good.

Would that same person the same sized portion of raw chicken and feel the same satisfaction?

Yet, if it was the protein that was satisfying, both ways should satisfy similarly as they contain the same level of Amino Acids.

epgc3fyqirnbsx · 20-04-2010 01:36AM

m@cc@ wrote: »

How do you know what nature intended?

Are human beings anatomically more similar to natural carnivores or to natural herbivores? Let’s find out….

•Intestinal tract length. Carnivorous animals have intestinal tracts that are 3-6x their body length, while herbivores have intestinal tracts 10-12x their body length. Human beings have the same intestinal tract ratio as herbivores.
•Stomach acidity. Carnivores’ stomachs are 20x more acidic than the stomachs of herbivores. Human stomach acidity matches that of herbivores.
•Saliva. The saliva of carnivores is acidic. The saliva of herbivores is alkaline, which helps pre-digest plant foods. Human saliva is alkaline.
•Shape of intestines. Carnivore bowels are smooth, shaped like a pipe, so meat passes through quickly — they don’t have bumps or pockets. Herbivore bowels are bumpy and pouch-like with lots of pockets, like a windy mountain road, so plant foods pass through slowly for optimal nutrient absorption. Human bowels have the same characteristics as those of herbivores.
•Fibre. Carnivores don’t require fiber to help move food through their short and smooth digestive tracts. Herbivores require dietary fiber to move food through their long and bumpy digestive tracts, to prevent the bowels from becoming clogged with rotting food. Humans have the same requirement as herbivores.
•Cholesterol. Cholesterol is not a problem for a carnivore’s digestive system. A carnivore such as a cat can handle a high-cholesterol diet without negative health consequences. A human cannot. Humans have zero dietary need for cholesterol because our bodies manufacture all we need. Cholesterol is only found in animal foods, never in plant foods. A plant-based diet is by definition cholesterol-free.
•Claws and teeth. Carnivores have claws, sharp front teeth capable of subduing prey, and no flat molars for chewing. Herbivores have no claws or sharp front teeth capable of subduing prey, but they have flat molars for chewing. Humans have the same characteristics as herbivores

Ok, well said.
I was gonna suggest the obvious answer of canines, then thought better cos I'm pretty sure I saw gorillas with them too.
I suppose when you look at our hunter gatherer history there has been meat eating for a hell of a long time. I dunno when it becomes a requirement and in any case it probably isnt.
But, and I'm a drunken rambler here, really thinking about what I'm about to type I am, but you have dogs that have all descended from wolves or something like them. They now range from chihuahuas to gret danes and Irish wolfhounds and are completely domesticated. In a very short space of time. Even if you look at pictures of cows from the 1800s they look completely different (though I suppose thats just looks).
But if we have a few thousand years of eating meat, it must be instinctual at this satge, not saying we aren't above it and can't change, but its probably instinct.

But in response to yourself m@cc@, nature may not really require it

Vegetarian problems

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