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Ryanair ups baggage charges for holidays

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,684 ✭✭✭JHMEG


    MYOB wrote: »
    Ryanair precipitated European-wide deregulation?
    Who mentioned Europe? But now that you did, you might be right. Maybe they did. They certainly did in Ireland...

    ....Well documented how in the 1980s Ryanair had to indirectly seek permission from Aer Lingus to open a new route. Search old Dail debates.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,479 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    JHMEG wrote: »
    Who mentioned Europe? But now that you did, you might be right. Maybe they did. They certainly did in Ireland...

    ....Well documented how in the 1980s Ryanair had to indirectly seek permission from Aer Lingus to open a new route. Search old Dail debates.

    There wasn't deregulation in Ireland, there was a move to a two-airline regulated system vs. a one-airline one as had existed before.

    Deregulation was European wide and had absolutely nothing to do with a then tiny, almost bankrupt airline which Michael O'Leary had actually recommended closing as a dead loss.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,684 ✭✭✭JHMEG


    MYOB wrote: »
    There wasn't deregulation in Ireland, there was a move to a two-airline regulated system vs. a one-airline one as had existed before.

    Deregulation was European wide and had absolutely nothing to do with a then tiny, almost bankrupt airline which Michael O'Leary had actually recommended closing as a dead loss.

    Ah right, you can carry on with that line. The rest of us know what really happened ;)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,479 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    JHMEG wrote: »
    Ah right, you can carry on with that line. The rest of us know what really happened ;)

    Except you don't, at all.

    Ignore list modified, not worth wasting my time, again.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,684 ✭✭✭JHMEG


    MYOB wrote: »
    Except you don't, at all.

    Ignore list modified...

    Still unable to get your point across I see ;)


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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,146 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    MYOB wrote: »
    From my experience, Airline A would be €40 for the flight, before the added charges; unless I was willing to fly at 6 in the morning the day before I actually wanted to go...

    I have a problem with businesses who do not give you full costs up-front in any sector. Airlines and ticket sales agents are about the only people who still do this.

    I rarely find the flight prices as much as that, and the 6am flight are actually going to be the most sought after ones as they then get you wherever it is your going in time for a 9am start. Even if the flight was €40 though, depending on the purpose of your trip and how you pay, all of the other charges are optional, except for the airport fees. and the costs would still be fairly similar in that example.

    As for the charges, Ryanair are quite clear about what you'll be charged for, they can't tell you what the flight will cost you in the end though until you've selected which parts of their service you wish to make use of. The other proper airlines will tell you the total cost, and not give you the option of not paying for the things you don't need.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,479 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    I don't see how a card 'handling' charge that applies to everyone that has a physical card issued by any bank in this country can become a "don't need". Its absolutely not for a spontaneous booking, but then again, Ryanair are almost never cheaper for the kind of flights you have to book on the spur of the moment.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,146 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    MYOB wrote: »
    I don't see how a card 'handling' charge that applies to everyone that has a physical card issued by any bank in this country can become a "don't need". Its absolutely not for a spontaneous booking, but then again, Ryanair are almost never cheaper for the kind of flights you have to book on the spur of the moment.

    Perfectly possible to get around the card charge, although I've not got as far as doing it myself yet due to laziness.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,643 ✭✭✭✭cson


    MYOB wrote: »
    They were. They went out of business. Relevance? Plenty of pissant low cost operators have gone under or ceased to exist under their own branding too - more of them than full-service airlines in fact.

    But how could a proper airline possibly fail? This will be my final point on the matter regarding the description as it is obvious you are unable to understand the logic being applied; The IAA give out the licences under which the likes of Ryanair fly, to put it simply: I'm pretty sure you have to be a proper airline to get one ;)

    MYOB wrote: »
    Un-broken-down "taxes and charges". Travel insurance added by default. One particularly obscure and not issued by any bank in Ireland card without a surcharge. Baggage charges being hiked for peak season without any other (e.g. fuel) justification - the entire point of this thread. Priority boarding charges. I could continue...

    Charges are broken down initially and further again when you proceed with the booking by choosing your method of payment. There are no hidden surcharges; you don't choose a flight, pay for it and then get hit with a price you never knew about. If one isn't able to navigate the Ryanair website to avoid the travel insurance and priority boarding then perhaps one's naivety is better served by another airline. Although I'm struggling to think of one that doesn't operate in a similar way to Ryanair. Furthermore, the credit card charges are easily avoided as witnessed by the huge thread on it it bargain alerts. Check it out if you can bring yourself to.

    The fact of the matter is that Ryanair is a successful Irish business that offers a certain product that quite obviously appeals to a an awful lot of people [the figures speak for themselves and I'm sure you're able to use google]. Unfortunately for Ryanair, their product doesn't appeal to you. All well and good but it would make for a better argument from yourself if you avoided using hyperbole and ignorant statements. I'll leave it at that for the purposes of this thread.

    Back on topic; In reality this should not affect anyone who is going on short <3/4 day breaks. Longer than that and I'd say that along with carry on, a bag between two should suffice. In any case it just means factoring in that extra €5 each way when calculating which carrier is the best value for money which I'm sure every boardsie is savvy enough to do.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,479 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    robinph wrote: »
    Perfectly possible to get around the card charge, although I've not got as far as doing it myself yet due to laziness.

    Possible, yes. Simple and easy to sort out, no. It also doesn't avoid 100% of the charge

    Its an entire un-needed extra layer of complexity, designed to make people pay the charge. Ryanair are still having to pay a % transaction charge on the one anointed card, anyway - so its well worth their while to make sure its as hard as possible to avoid.

    They won't give you a discount on the handling fee for using Laser where the transaction fee is ~15c no matter what the amount; yet others in the industry (ebookers, who aren't even Irish ffs) can. Yet more cash-grabbing.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,479 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    cson wrote: »
    But how could a proper airline possibly fail? This will be my final point on the matter regarding the description as it is obvious you are unable to understand the logic being applied; The IAA give out the licences under which the likes of Ryanair fly, to put it simply: I'm pretty sure you have to be a proper airline to get one ;)

    You have to be an airline to get a licence - you don't need to be a proper one.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,146 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    MYOB wrote: »
    You have to be an airline to get a licence - you don't need to be a proper one.

    They have planes. They fly people to places. What else is needed to become a proper airline?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,479 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    robinph wrote: »
    They have planes. They fly people to places. What else is needed to become a proper airline?

    A modicum of respect for the idea of being an airline, rather than a particularly limited bus service.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,146 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    MYOB wrote: »
    A modicum of respect for the idea of being an airline, rather than a particularly limited bus service.

    I thought an airline was a business, not an idea that you have to believe in.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,479 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    robinph wrote: »
    I thought an airline was a business, not an idea that you have to believe in.

    Its probably the only business where you can still somehow survive without any care for customers or ethics, though. Even the fast food joints have had to change the way they do things of late...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,279 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Ahh the old Ryanair just a glorified bus service again. When I first came to Glasgow in 1993, a flight would set me back the best part of £200 every time. Along came Ryanair and introduced competition that gradually went to a basic option plus optional extras for those who wanted it.

    Travelling over to Dublin from Prestwick tomorrow with my wife and 2 kids for a weeks break... £8 return each thats £32 all in. The flight lasts 35 minutes therfore a glorified bus will do me thank you very much.

    Other than some grumpy check in staff at Dublin Airport about 6 years ago, I have had no issue with Ryanair and they have always been on time.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,967 ✭✭✭Terrontress


    MYOB wrote: »
    A modicum of respect for the idea of being an airline, rather than a particularly limited bus service.

    Fly places, take people on board and make money to pay the bills to do so.

    Sabena and Globespan only did two of those so to consider them to have been a proper airline but Ryanair not to have been is wrong in my mind.

    My favourite flight out of Dublin that competes with FR is AF into LCY, I like the better service, the bags, the drink, the sandwich, the location of LCY. But both have their place.

    And a final thought, Ryanair are by far more punctual than AF, EI, BA, BD without doubt. Do you think punctuality is a measurement of 'proper' airline?


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,146 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    MYOB wrote: »
    Its probably the only business where you can still somehow survive without any care for customers or ethics, though. Even the fast food joints have had to change the way they do things of late...

    What did they do to you? It must have been horrific. Did they push you down the stairs on landing or something because you didn't buy a coffee from them in flight?

    What lack of care for customers, or problem with their ethics is it exactly that you have a problem with? They don't go out of their way to make your day better, but they also don't go out of their way to abuse you or piss you off.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,479 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    robinph wrote: »
    What did they do to you? It must have been horrific. Did they push you down the stairs on landing or something because you didn't buy a coffee from them in flight?

    What lack of care for customers, or problem with their ethics is it exactly that you have a problem with? They don't go out of their way to make your day better, but they also don't go out of their way to abuse you or piss you off.

    I've just generally found them the least pleasant business entity I've ever dealt with, including the Garda Fixed Penalty Office.

    If O'Leary ran any other form of business with the same customer-facing attitudes as FR has, it wouldn't be in business.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,684 ✭✭✭JHMEG


    MOL has built the biggest international airline in the world: Ryanair, by any standard, is a roaring success. MOL is the cream of the cream when it comes to building a successful business. There is no reason to believe he could not repeat that success when it comes to any other business. Feel free to tell him what he's doing wrong when you are doing something better than he is.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,643 ✭✭✭✭cson


    And a final thought, Ryanair are by far more punctual than AF, EI, BA, BD without doubt. Do you think punctuality is a measurement of 'proper' airline?

    Agree 100% with that. Despite that annoying jingle they play at flight end all bar one of the flights I've taken with them [touching the 100 mark I'd estimate] was delayed. Contrast that with BMI who I've had two delays in excess of 1 hour with and EI who left me over 3hrs delayed heading to MCO before - both caused by the actions of the airlines themselves and not external factors.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,967 ✭✭✭Terrontress


    MYOB wrote: »
    I've just generally found them the least pleasant business entity I've ever dealt with, including the Garda Fixed Penalty Office.

    If O'Leary ran any other form of business with the same customer-facing attitudes as FR has, it wouldn't be in business.

    I love them but I have flown with them quite a bit and know all the rules to do it cheaply.

    On board, they are very friendly and I find their flight crew to be a lot nicer than those in traditional airlines who think they have a bit more status than they do.

    I have seen so much of Europe and visited so many friends that I otherwise wouldn't have but for Ryanair.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,480 ✭✭✭Rawr


    I don't feel there's any denying that Ryanair is a successful airline, or reasons why.

    I have never seen Ryanair for anything more than what they are, a Dublin Bus of the sky, and when it comes to air-travel, I've never really needed anything more than that. All I've ever wanted, is to get from A to B, in a timely manner, while still having some money in my pocket.

    Ryanair has always fulfilled this need for me, and for years I had been somewhat fond of them.

    But lately, this has changed. I no longer like the airline like I once did. No one thing has made me feel this way, but for the most part I think it's me noticing the rather devious nature in which Ryanair add charges to their main flight product.

    The credit card charge is particularly nasty. For a single transaction, you can be charged a handling fee, per passenger, per flight. Thus, if I fly somewhere with the OH, for example, I am charged 4 times for one card transaction. Ryanair need only pay the card company once for that transaction, the rest is pure profit.

    Their 'insurance' began as an optional extra product, to something the website would select by default for you, and then something that became difficult to de-select.

    Their compulsory 'wheelchair' charge, which I believe came about as a result of a fight they had with BAA, is emposed upon all. Even if there are no wheelchair users on the flight.

    Their baggage practices have begun to make taking one of their flights un-necessarily painful. You are charged plenty for checking in luggage, apparently to discourage you from doing so. However, Ryanair's tightly regulated cabin baggage policy mean that unless you are traveling very light, you will need to check something in. There seems that there is a definite effort by Ryanair to get a baggage tarrif off the customer, right up to the moment of boarding.

    Finally, the prices themselves. Ryanair regularly claim to sell low-cost or nearly free flights to their customers. They are certainly cheaper, however you will never actually pay only 1 Euro for your travel. As a consumer, I am not interested in the cost of the 'flight'. I am however interested in what the final cost of the air-travel is to me. It would be much better if they would say for example, 'Flights from 20 Euro...' That is still cheap, and close to the truth.

    Despite all this, I do still regard Ryanair as proper airline like any other, and I do understand that they are trying their best to make cash where ever they can. However, from beginning to end, the simple task of paying them for Air-transit becomes a gauntlet of trying to avoid unwanted charges and dealing with bag-nazis. I miss the Ryanair of only 2 years ago, somehow back then, it seemed so much easier.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,684 ✭✭✭JHMEG


    Rawr wrote: »
    however you will never actually pay only 1 Euro for your travel.
    I have travelled Ryanair to the UK for 1 cent. They paid the taxes, and it was paid for on debit card.

    There was a young lad on the BBC who has seen all of Europe via Ryanair and has never paid more than £10 per journey.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,279 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Rawr wrote: »

    The credit card charge is particularly nasty. For a single transaction, you can be charged a handling fee, per passenger, per flight. Thus, if I fly somewhere with the OH, for example, I am charged 4 times for one card transaction. Ryanair need only pay the card company once for that transaction, the rest is pure profit.

    http://www.moneyguideireland.com/prepaid-mastercard-and-ryanair.html

    I got the Neteller one and it is great for avoiding the fee
    you will never actually pay only 1 Euro for your travel.

    You are wrong, I have regularly got the headline price whether it is 1p, £1 or £10. In fact, I am flying tomorrow evening with my family and I paid the headline £8 return each.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,098 ✭✭✭Stinicker


    I can't see why people get is such a tizzy over a €5 increase, it is for two months and if you plan ahead and schedule right Ryanair will still be quite cheap. The same people gripe about this are the same ones who could p1ss away €100 on ripoff drink in a crappy nightclub or pay €5 for a tasteless cup of coffee. No one is forcing people to fly Ryanair and there is nearly always an alternative to them.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 91 ✭✭bluenose1956


    I saw on CNN last night that a US carrier called Spirit will start charging to put bags in the overhead lockers effective from 1st August. They will only allow one bag that fits under the seat in front of you. Will Ryanair copy that one?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,480 ✭✭✭Rawr


    I saw on CNN last night that a US carrier called Spirit will start charging to put bags in the overhead lockers effective from 1st August. They will only allow one bag that fits under the seat in front of you. Will Ryanair copy that one?

    They probably would. However, I'm wondering how they could enforce it.
    Restrict the hand-baggage dimensions even further?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,708 ✭✭✭serfboard


    I saw on CNN last night that a US carrier called Spirit will start charging to put bags in the overhead lockers effective from 1st August. They will only allow one bag that fits under the seat in front of you. Will Ryanair copy that one?

    Probably will eventually. Ryanair's goal is to make the flight price itself technically free, but to charge you for everything and try and sell as much to you as they can. ("Sell everything that's not nailed down", according to MOL).

    "Free flights all the time" would certainly pull the punters in, even if it was technically never true.


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