"Petty gossip" will not intimidate Catholic Church

Dionysus · 04-04-2010 03:35PM #1

And so it goes on.

Today, Easter Sunday 2010, yet another "leading" church figure, Cardinal Angelo Sodano, came out to tell the world that the "petty gossip" of the child abuse scandals across the world will not intimidate the Catholic Church.

Christ almighty, is there any hope for the Catholic Church when every day we have one arrogant git after another treating us all like infidels, circling the wagons and assuring the poor schmucks who blindly follow the utterances of Catholic Church "leaders" that the rest of the population of the world is just trying to attack the Church of Christ? Nothing, nothing it appears, to do with attacking the evil which that Church has covered up year after year and decade after decade. The Catholic Church leadership is, apparently like the Jews in WWII, the "victim".

Aside from Diarmuid Martin, an increasingly lonely, isolated and pitiable figure, I see no hope whatsoever for any redemption of the Catholic Church. There is not even a willingness to repent. After years of telling us what to do the hypocrisy of their current position is too much, and repeatedly so. Where is their courage: we were wrong; we are deeply ashamed; here is every abuse case we've covered up; we are motivated to create a new, healthier, more open and more honest church out of this shame?

Instead, all these "leaders" are doing is going into siege mentality mode and being as bigoted, intransigent, dishonest and unchristian as they could possibly be.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2010/0404/breaking1.html

http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0404/abuse.html

minidazzler · 04-04-2010 03:38PM

Some of them are living in the clouds, not realising that their fall from grace has already happened.

They are like Wild e Coyote, he will have to see he has already ran off the cliff before he actually falls.

corkcomp · 04-04-2010 03:41PM

Is anyone else sick of hearing about all the scandal within the church? Fair enough, some of the crimes committed were horrendous and people have a right to know, but people need to realise that some things never change (i.e. level of arrogance and lack of repentance from SOME quarters), on the other hand it is not fair to tar everybody within the institution with the same brush.

so the simple answer people is to vote with your feet .. if you dont attend mass then chances are you will have little other contact with the church.

df1985 · 04-04-2010 03:43PM

i believe in god or should i say i hope to feck theres something after this life, but my support for the catholic church has gone completely out the window after all this. ill pray at home thanks, and not give ye feckers money just to practice my faith.

PeterIanStaker · 04-04-2010 03:44PM

Some of them? I would argue that the RCC hierarchy, from Ratz down, are in an advanced state of denial, if not delusion.

Unfortuately they have their apologists in the laity and even more unfortunately, people are still going to mass.
The organisation is not capable of any kind of change because of its greed and hubris.

conno3001 · 04-04-2010 03:49PM

What can we expect from the same people that were in charge of making sure an atrocity like this didn't happen in this first place.

Dionysus · 04-04-2010 03:50PM

corkcomp wrote: »

Is anyone else sick of hearing about all the scandal within the church? Fair enough, some of the crimes committed were horrendous and people have a right to know, but people need to realise that some things never change (i.e. level of arrogance and lack of repentance from SOME quarters), on the other hand it is not fair to tar everybody within the institution with the same brush.

so the simple answer people is to vote with your feet .. if you dont attend mass then chances are you will have little other contact with the church.

We are not talking about the level of arrogance from merely "some" quarters. We are talking about it at the very top of the Church. Specifically, for instance, instructions to all Irish bishops from the Vatican to report all allegations of child abuse to the Vatican and wait for its instructions before informing the civil authorities in Ireland.

Today, there is no defensible reason for every single diocese in Ireland not having a Murphy-style investigation as suggested by Diarmuid Martin. Yet, the leadership of the Catholic Church refuses to accede to this basic and very justified request. Why?

corkcomp · 04-04-2010 03:52PM

Dionysus wrote: »

We are not talking about the level of arrogance from merely "some" quarters. We are talking about it at the very top of the Church. Specifically, for instance, instructions to all Irish bishops from the Vatican to report all allegations of child abuse to the Vatican and wait for its instructions before informing the civil authorities in Ireland.

Today, there is no defensible reason for every single diocese in Ireland not having a Murphy-style investigation as suggested by Diarmuid Martin. Yet, the leadership of the Catholic Church refuses to accede to this basic and very justified request. Why?

my comments remain the same, if you dont like it, dont buy into it .. like another poster mentioned, IF you want to pray you can do it at home. I dont understand why people dont just walk away if it bothers you, because hoping things will change is akin to banging your head on a brick wall.

My name is URL · 04-04-2010 03:54PM

I imagine he's talking about how the entire church (both priests and followers) are being targeted over what happened, regardless of whether they were involved or not.

If that's the case then he has a point. People go on as if anyone that admits to being a catholic is somehow involved in abusing children, which is stupid. Imo

I'm not religious in any way, but I also don't religiously attack anyone who is

PeterIanStaker · 04-04-2010 03:54PM

Dionysus wrote: »

We are not talking about the level of arrogance from merely "some" quarters. We are talking about it at the very top of the Church. Specifically, for instance, instructions to all Irish bishops from the Vatican to report all allegations of child abuse to the Vatican and wait for its instructions before informing the civil authorities in Ireland.

Today, there is no defensible reason for every single diocese in Ireland not having a Murphy-style investigation as suggested by Diarmuid Martin. Yet, the leadership of the Catholic Church refuses to accede to this basic and very justified request. Why?

Because of the organisations' total arrogance and superiority complex, as well as its unwillingness to give up the power and money it has accumulated. And they have a nice make - believe thing called Canon Law where they make up the rules as they go along.

Min · 04-04-2010 03:55PM

PeterIanStaker wrote: »

Some of them? I would argue that the RCC hierarchy, from Ratz down, are in an advanced state of denial, if not delusion.

Unfortuately they have their apologists in the laity and even more unfortunately, people are still going to mass.
The organisation is not capable of any kind of change because of its greed and hubris.

Nothing wrong with people going to mass, the people that go have more of a say in the future of the church than someone outside complaining about it.

Hagar · 04-04-2010 03:55PM

In a generation the Catholic Church in Ireland will be a distant memory. There are no vocations, we have black priests from foreign missionaries on the altars in Ireland. The young don't believe and the older people are losing faith. If Jesus didn't weep before, he will now.

Dionysus · 04-04-2010 03:56PM

df1985 wrote: »

i believe in god or should i say i hope to feck theres something after this life, but my support for the catholic church has gone completely out the window after all this. ill pray at home thanks, and not give ye feckers money just to practice my faith.

I'm sort of like that myself. I haven't been to mass in about five or six years for no other reason than I find it utterly boring and devoid of spirituality (the occasional sermon excepted). On the other hand, I see the value of having some spiritual tradition and religious presence in my local community. When it comes to funerals, for example, the Church is a great facilitator. So while I'm incensed at the ongoing child abuse cover-ups I wouldn't be in the vanguard of anti-religion atheist types who merely want to replace one belief system with their own belief system. Agnosticism sounds much more intelligent to my mind.

pikachucheeks · 04-04-2010 03:57PM

Does it count as gossip if it's true?

You can't expect people not to talk about such scandals. Something that newsworthy is going to be talked about, no matter how much you try and prevent it from happening.

PeterIanStaker · 04-04-2010 04:01PM

Min wrote: »

Nothing wrong with people going to mass, the people that go have more of a say in the future of the church than someone outside complaining about it.

And how do mass goers have a say in the future of the church?

I'm fairly sure they go to mass to get told what to do, dictated to by fear and guilt.

Every person in the door only props up the decadent RCC as if it were on life support.

Fear Uladh · 04-04-2010 04:03PM

http://news.ie.msn.com/article.aspx?cp-documentid=152901023

Packed house for easter mass, seems people are just as happy to go to mass as they ever were and want to forget about what happened. If this isn't rock solid evidence of the warped mindset of some people I don't know what is.

Dionysus · 04-04-2010 04:04PM

pikachucheeks wrote: »

Does it count as gossip if it's true?

Good point. This dictionary defines it as '1. idle talk or rumor, esp. about the personal or private affairs of others'.

Unless this cardinal has really lost the plot and is saying the child abuse scandals are the "personal or private affairs" of the Catholic Church?

michael999999 · 04-04-2010 04:04PM

how could any sane minded person go to mass and listen to sons of the devil preaching to us?

pikachucheeks · 04-04-2010 04:06PM

69 wrote: »

The young don't believe and the older people are losing faith. If Jesus didn't weep before, he will now.

Ah, he has other religions to mind, he might not be too gutted :pac:

Personally, I think that all this turning away from the Catholic church is for the good. Maybe they'll realise it's time for a change and reform the church. They can't ignore the voices of thousands of angry people! And if they chose to, it's at their own detriment.

My name is URL · 04-04-2010 04:07PM

michael999999 wrote: »

how could any sane minded person go to mass and listen to sons of the devil preaching to us?

How could any sane person make a comment about the sanity of others while suggesting that the devil fathered a load of priests?

InkSlinger67 · 04-04-2010 04:07PM

michael999999 wrote: »

how could any sane minded person go to mass and listen to sons of the devil preaching to us?

This looks like an undercover priest trying to infiltrate the masses via their popular media and bring down the resistance from the inside

Don't look directly into his eyes!!!!

PeterIanStaker · 04-04-2010 04:08PM

Dionysus wrote: »

Good point. This dictionary defines it as '1. idle talk or rumor, esp. about the personal or private affairs of others'.

Unless this cardinal has really lost the plot and is saying the child abuse scandals are the "personal or private affairs" of the Catholic Church?

Again the make believe Canon Law.

bnt · 04-04-2010 04:10PM

In all these statements from the Church, there's a common theme: it's all about the Church and its image. They have nothing at all to say about the people who have been affected by their actions. The closest they get is talking about "sin" - and all they need to do about that is go to "confession", say a few Hail Marys, and all is forgiven.

I know there are hard-working clergy in various parts of the world who care about people and do the right things. I'm not talking about them. When you live in cloud-cuckoo land (a.k.a. The Vatican), these things do not happen to real people; they are abstract "sins" that are to be forgiven, not crimes that are to be punished, and therefore there will be no repercussions for them in this world.

PeterIanStaker · 04-04-2010 04:11PM

pikachucheeks wrote: »

Ah, he has other religions to mind, he might not be too gutted :pac:

Personally, I think that all this turning away from the Catholic church is for the good. Maybe they'll realise it's time for a change and reform the church. They can't ignore the voices of thousands of angry people! And if they chose to, it's at their own detriment.

They'll ignore it like they ignore their abuse victims. And they'll never change one iota, I can sadly guarantee you that. Also they are indeed deaf to the voices of angry people, or more likely as I said in a "Downfall" like state of delusion.

Dionysus · 04-04-2010 04:13PM

pikachucheeks wrote: »

Personally, I think that all this turning away from the Catholic church is for the good. Maybe they'll realise it's time for a change and reform the church. They can't ignore the voices of thousands of angry people! And if they chose to, it's at their own detriment.

That's what I was hoping when this all started. It seems that I was naïve and that instead of ordering a full investigation they are circling the wagons to defend the indefensible and intimating to their blind followers that attacks on the Catholic Church's actions regarding child abuse are attacks on Christianity. Breathtaking.

bronte · 04-04-2010 04:15PM

Ego is one of that Church's biggest downfalls.

Agent J · 04-04-2010 04:15PM

Im not Christian but i really hope that Jesus hurries the hell up and comes back to sort out this lot.

PeterIanStaker · 04-04-2010 04:15PM

And sadly the sheeple will close ranks or so the RCC hopes.

anotherlostie · 04-04-2010 04:18PM

It would have been bad enough for some rogue bishop to make this statement from his pulpit. But it came at the easter mass at the Vatican in front of the pope. I should be shocked, but like with the banks, I'm past that point now.

pikachucheeks · 04-04-2010 04:23PM

PeterIanStaker wrote: »

They'll ignore it like they ignore their abuse victims. And they'll never change one iota, I can sadly guarantee you that. Also they are indeed deaf to the voices of angry people, or more likely as I said in a "Downfall" like state of delusion.

It's a shame, because one major result of their actions has been that many people have left the church, with no hope of returning.

I'd be interested to see the decrease in people calling themselves "catholic" in the next census. I reckon it'll be quite substantial, as a direct result of all the abuse scandals.

Dionysus wrote: »

It seems that I was naïve and that instead of ordering a full investigation they are circling the wagons to defend the indefensible and intimating to their blind followers that attacks on the Catholic Church's actions regarding child abuse are attacks on Christianity...

I think a lot of that comes down to the hierarchy in the church itself. The priests are often thought of as being 'special' in comparison to the regular people that attend Mass. 'Special' in the sense that they are preaching God's word to the people, they are 'closer' to God and are called upon to do his work.
So, when the scandals came out, the result was that these priests on pedestals were believed over the normal, every-day people accusing them.

NTMK · 04-04-2010 04:26PM

honestly is the vatican trying to bring down the RCC cause they're doin a great job

"Petty gossip" will not intimidate Catholic Church

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