were The Clash punk? what were they?

lee_baby_simms · 13-03-2005 03:56AM #1

this is a thought that i've never really worked out.

ok they started out as a punk group what exactly did they end up as?

any ideas?

Redleslie2 · 13-03-2005 05:26AM

They were artists who created the music they wanted to make regardless of commercial or cred pressures. If people liked it, good, if they didn't, so what. That is punk.

I am MAN · 13-03-2005 04:27PM

Of course the Clash where punk thats just a dumb question.

melekalikimaka · 18-03-2005 02:22PM

second wave ska if the truth be told

Jim · 18-03-2005 02:25PM

I think hes asking the question in regard to the idealogy of Punk.
You might be able to define some of The Clash's music as second wave ska, but alot of it you can't. They spanned a ridiculos number of genres.

melekalikimaka · 18-03-2005 02:43PM

good point...but i think alot of punk stems from ska,it was the closest to punk before punk

lee_baby_simms · 20-03-2005 05:33AM

Jimeatsmenu wrote:

They spanned a ridiculos number of genres.

yeah exactly.
i think they seemed to always retain a punk attitude but the only really punk music album they made was their first one.
i like the way they took gambles and tried loads of styles especially the sandinsta monster that they made. it really has its moments as well as the odd clanger.

i'll go with rock'n'roll.

Ro: maaan! · 20-03-2005 12:13PM

Give 'Em Enough Rope isn't too far off punk.

Googe · 20-03-2005 08:52PM

They were an amazing rock and roll band with punk ideals imo.

Johnny Jukebox · 21-03-2005 09:53AM

No, they were not 'punk' in todays accepted sense of the word because they pushed the envelope early on and then moved off quickly while all the copycats figured out how to be as 'punk' as the Clash.

And no, they were not a ska band either, although they wrote and played some great ska songs.

Lets just say that for a couple of years they were the greatest rock'n'roll band in the world and live, on their night, were unbeatable. There is a generation of 40-somethings out there who will carry this band in their hearts until they die.

i_dont_do_names · 29-03-2005 10:35AM

lee_baby_simms wrote:

this is a thought that i've never really worked out.

ok they started out as a punk group what exactly did they end up as?

any ideas?

who really cares, they were the best ****in band ever and thats all that matters

but anyway of course they are, punk is all about freedom and being non-commercial

i_dont_do_names · 29-03-2005 10:36AM

melekalikimaka wrote:

good point...but i think alot of punk stems from ska,it was the closest to punk before punk

punk stems from a mixture of pub-rock and reggae, but without 1st wave ska(like prince buster, the ethiopians etc.) there would be no reggae

i_dont_do_names · 29-03-2005 10:40AM

melekalikimaka wrote:

second wave ska if the truth be told

how?

i can only think of two clash ska songs, rudie cant fail and pressure drop(which was a cover anyway)

i really dont see how you could call them a second-wave ska/two-tone or whatever band.

and second wave ska/two-tone was groups like the selecter, the specials, bad manners, the bodysnatchers, the beat etc. mixing ska reggae and punk

lee_baby_simms · 04-04-2005 08:24PM

i_dont_do_names wrote:

i can only think of two clash ska songs, rudie cant fail and pressure drop(which was a cover anyway)

wrong em boyo

fish-head · 05-04-2005 10:20PM

That's a cover too. And how could you possibly forget (White Man) In Hammersmith Palais), arguably their best song!

Course the clash were punk. They did what they wanted to do. I think they recorded the first white rap tracks in The Magnificent Seven and Lightning Strikes.

Sandinista! is the punkest album on earth. Next to WHY?.

bildo · 06-03-2010 05:10PM

I maintain the Clash were a reggae band.
Most of their albums are very bass heavy and the beat emphasis is on the 3rd beat which is a reggae trait. Punk is strictly on the 2s and 4s. Just listen to the drums.
All their later albums are littered with guitar upstrokes inna reggae man style and they covered a hell of a lot more reggae songs then punk songs.
Their roots are punk but I think punk is more of an attitude then a style of music. Punk rock is a branch of rock as I see it.

God I love the clash.

dregin · 06-03-2010 05:23PM

Noone gives a ****.

The clash didn't give a ****.

Punk.

anti-venom · 07-03-2010 11:53AM

i_dont_do_names wrote: »

who really cares, they were the best ****in band ever and thats all that matters

but anyway of course they are, punk is all about freedom and being non-commercial

Have you read Pat Gilbert's Passion is a Fashion: The Real Story of the Clash? According to Gilbert, and many others besides, The Clash were primarily concerned with commercial success, cultivating a false image of themselves and generally getting on with being rock stars. Mick Jones's little temper tantrums and love of the rock star image and antics were legendary. Joe Strummer, while probably being genuinely concerned with social justice, was nothing more than a reconstituted old hippie piggybacking on the punk explosion. Preaching about injustice and oppression from the ivory tower.

Contrast The Clash with Crass and you'll get the true measure of how punk they were.

Brunteaphile · 07-03-2010 04:21PM

Who the **** cares?!

I like the Clash, they played good music. Who gives a **** if they were rock, ska, reggae.
Is it really goin to change your shallow minded opinions?

AnimalRights · 08-03-2010 06:38PM

bildo wrote: »

I maintain the Clash were a reggae band.
Most of their albums are very bass heavy and the beat emphasis is on the 3rd beat which is a reggae trait. Punk is strictly on the 2s and 4s. Just listen to the drums.
All their later albums are littered with guitar upstrokes inna reggae man style and they covered a hell of a lot more reggae songs then punk songs.
Their roots are punk but I think punk is more of an attitude then a style of music. Punk rock is a branch of rock as I see it.

God I love the clash.

Bildo it was more Dub then Reggae..
The Clash started of as Punk rock of course.....I was there!
They invented such great Punk clothes too!!
Then as Jim pointed out they progressed to many things.

AnimalRights · 08-03-2010 06:41PM

anti-venom wrote: »

Contrast The Clash with Crass and you'll get the true measure of how punk they were.

I'll go a step further.....
Contrast Crass with Special Duties and you'll get the true measure of how Punk they were.

Put simply Crass were an anarcho Punk band who were just one part of the Punk movement wether they like it or not.
I was a big Crass fan back in the day but these days I see most of it as hippy preaching ****, gimmie pure Punk rock plain 3 riff guitar chords and less of the hippy politics, Conflict did political Punk far better anyway.

AnimalRights · 08-03-2010 06:49PM

Here anti venom, here's your precious anti commercial Crass, well Stevie Ignorant anyway and his 'backing' band from a few years back in London.
T-shirts were going at 17 sterling :eek:

http://www.youtube.com/user/JANER64#p/search/5/_2J41GWf-wM
Excuse wonky camera at start, I was pissed.

http://www.youtube.com/user/JANER64#p/search/4/AFKLN-Mp01c
and one more, not Eve Libertine btw, IMO it was their best song of the night!

bitzzyfitz · 08-03-2010 06:51PM

i agree with what anti-venom and animal rights say. i saw the clash in trinity college and that was punk as we knew it. punk died when the pistols split.

bitzy

Junco Partner · 08-03-2010 06:53PM

they started out as punk with the first and most of the second but they moved on from the narrow mindedness of punk to play many genres reggae and ska mostly with some rockabilly dub funk early rap rock and roll jazz and even a gospel song they did all this but kept the polictical message in all their songs

dregin · 08-03-2010 08:28PM

Confining punk to one genre of music is the definition of narrow-mindedness.

maccored · 09-03-2010 02:01PM

... plus many of the musicians of the era who where in what would be referred to as punk bands (up til around 1978 anyway) laugh at the term 'punk'

smurke · 10-03-2010 11:43PM

Redleslie2 wrote: »

"It will always remain the undying, historic achievement of Adolf Hitler and his followers that they dared to take the first trail blazing and decisive steps towards such brilliant race-hygienic achievement in and for the German people. He and his followers were concerned with putting into practice the theories and advances of Nordic race conceptions...the fight against parasitic alien races such as Jews and Gypsies...and preventing the breeding of those with hereditary diseases and those of inferior stock.” - Prof Ernst Rudin

"They [The Gypsies] represent a culture that is endemically parasitic." - The Corinthian

Is this a joke?

dregin · 11-03-2010 01:00AM

wtf are you on about?

smurke · 11-03-2010 09:50AM

dregin wrote: »

wtf are you on about?

I'm asking that other person a question, what's your problem?

dregin · 11-03-2010 04:06PM

My problem is with the fact that that quote you're using doesn't appear in this thread so has nothing to do with it.

AnimalRights · 11-03-2010 09:15PM

bitzzyfitz wrote: »

i agree with what anti-venom and animal rights say. i saw the clash in trinity college and that was punk as we knew it. punk died when the pistols split.

bitzy

Punk is most certainly not dead, I photograph/Video about 50 gigs a year.
It's mostly underground, DIY.
Of course it's not as big as it's hey day of the late 70s.

Tell me Punk is dead after looking at The World's biggest Punk festival held in the Winter gardens in Blackpool.
http://pix.ie/punkrock/album/350678

were The Clash punk? what were they?

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