12 yr old being prosectued for murder as an adult

PeakOutput · 10-02-2010 04:31PM #1

so here is the story in full

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/02/10/pennsylvania.young.murder.defendant/index.html?eref=igoogle_cnn

important part

On a chilly morning in February 2009, state police found 26-year-old Kenzie Houk in her bed with a bullet though her head. She was eight months pregnant.

The search for her killer ended with the most surprising murder suspect residents of Wampum, Pennsylvania, had even seen: 11-year-old Jordan Brown, the son of the victim's fiancé.

He is one of the youngest suspects in the country to be charged with homicide, legal experts say. There are two counts of homicide, one covering the fetus.

He pleaded not guilty to the charges in May.

what do people think about this? i have mixed feelings. clearly he is a child and i believe could be completely rehabilitated so i hope the sentence isnt mandatory life without parole if convicted. but i do believe he is old enough to know right from wrong and im not sure if the children courts are up to handling something this serious

thoughts?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 10-02-2010 04:38PM

PeakOutput wrote: »

so here is the story in full

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/02/10/pennsylvania.young.murder.defendant/index.html?eref=igoogle_cnn

important part

what do people think about this? i have mixed feelings. clearly he is a child and i believe could be completely rehabilitated so i hope the sentence isnt mandatory life without parole if convicted. but i do believe he is old enough to know right from wrong and im not sure if the children courts are up to handling something this serious

thoughts?

While I think an 11-year-old is knowledgeable enough to know what he's doing, I don't know enough about this case to comment. Was there a reason as to why the kid shot her? Was she abusive? Or did he just plain not like her?

That said, sentencing someone to life for something they did as an 11yo (unless their psychotically* dangerous) is bizarre

. * not sure if this is the right word, but you know what I mean

My name is URL · 10-02-2010 04:39PM

Most murderers have the mental capacity of a 12 year old anyway

Blazer · 10-02-2010 04:39PM

Absolutely not....in fact I'd argue for it so children this young are more aware of the consequences.

Regardless of age this kid killed a pregnant mother and her baby...

Slugs · 10-02-2010 04:41PM

What were the motives? Though this is cnn, so I'm not expecting any coverage of that.

ballsymchugh · 10-02-2010 04:41PM

hmmm... he's been named. over here he wouldn't be named for legal reasons. why is that?? even someone up to 16 i think? surely if they've killed someone suspiciously then the name should be known

AnonoBoy · 10-02-2010 04:41PM

Has someone thought to blame video games yet?

That could be the answer to ensuring this never happens again.

inforfun · 10-02-2010 04:42PM

My name is URL wrote: »

Most murderers have the mental capacity of a 12 year old anyway

Make that: Most adults.

Capable of an headshot when 11.
Wouldnt like meeting the kid when he is 20.

abouttobebanned · 10-02-2010 04:46PM

My name is URL wrote: »

Most murderers have the mental capacity of a 12 year old anyway

That's a pretty inaccurate attempt at thanks whoring. (You can always depend on "My name is Url" to be there and ready at the start of the thread with some stupid "witty" comment)

As someone else said, it's hard to comment in more depth without knowing the full details of the case. 11 year olds know what they're doing but they're definitely more susceptible to TV and computer games than an adult.

It's a tragic case, and the child should be punished, but after about 2 years in court he'll be shocked himself at what he did.

petes · 10-02-2010 04:46PM

AnonoBoy wrote: »

Has someone thought to blame video games yet?

They will. Without knowing a bit more detail its hard to comment.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 10-02-2010 04:47PM

inforfun wrote: »

Make that: Most adults.

Capable of an headshot when 11.
Wouldnt like meeting the kid when he is 20.

I failed to read in the report where this was in character and a psychologist report had condemned him already? Oh wait... AH... Right.... Sorry, carry on.

seamus · 10-02-2010 04:47PM

Scar_L wrote: »

Absolutely not....in fact I'd argue for it so children this young are more aware of the consequences.

Long-term I don't think they are, in fact they don't even have a proper understanding of the concept of "long-term".
Children are far more impulsive than adults though, so while an adult might experience rage and frustration, they will be able to exercise control over it and bite their tongue. A child and even a teenager however is more likely to be overcome by their emotion and lash out.

It seems bizarre that there's so much support for the child when the evidence really does seem to put him there. Though theoretically, he could have been framed, and that would take a sick puppy to do.

It's a weird one. If it was an adult, it would be considered cold and calculated, but to a child it may simply have been a means to an end without fully appreciating the consequences of death.

Particularly if they were very religious, the child may have believed that it was a lesser of two evils - that she and her baby would go to heaven and stop bothering him here on earth - using an aspect of fantasy as a basis for real-life decisions. Which children do all the time.

I think they're right to go ahead with the trial to determine what happened, but sentencing need to consider that this is a child who is likely to respond very well to proper rehabilitation.

Morlar · 10-02-2010 04:48PM

Scar_L wrote: »

Regardless of age this kid killed a pregnant mother and her baby...

I think he should be charged as an adult. The sentencing would be one of the very, very rare cases to deserve the possibility of parole though.

Lawros Tache · 10-02-2010 04:48PM

My name is URL wrote: »

Most murderers have the mental capacity of a 12 year old anyway

Source?

inforfun · 10-02-2010 04:50PM

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

I failed to read in the report where this was in character and a psychologist report had condemned him already? Oh wait... AH... Right.... Sorry, carry on.

Yeah sure there is nothing wrong with a kid that blows the head of his fathers fiance, his stepmother.

Gone Drinking · 10-02-2010 04:51PM

AnonoBoy wrote: »

Has someone thought to blame video games yet?

If only he'd done it with a brick.. he'd have gotten tetris banned!

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 10-02-2010 04:52PM

inforfun wrote: »

Yeah sure there is nothing wrong with a kid that blows the head of his fathers fiance, his stepmother.

You do know he's pleaded not guilty, don't you?

Morlar · 10-02-2010 04:52PM

Lawros Tache wrote: »

Source?

I think it was more of an opinion than a 'CSO-Study certifiable fact' don't you ?

epgc3fyqirnbsx · 10-02-2010 04:55PM

A child is a child, try to think back to being that age yourself, hadn't even hit puberty and as such, haven't really started to understand your own individuality.
As such you are basically a creature of impulse, although rightly expected to be smarter than an animal. The child obviously has deep deep problems, and could very well be a danger to the public for the rest of his life. Or not, we don't know. The best thing for him is observation and diagnosis in an institution after doing something that serious.

But as for being named and being charged as an adult, this is something that can be seen in the US from time to time. Seems the more serious the crime or the more out-raged the public, the greater the chance of being tried as an adult.

Should this be relevant?? I don't think so, the only thing that is relevant is justice.
I don't think there's much justice in trying an obvious child as an adult just to satisfy the moorally outraged

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 10-02-2010 04:59PM

That's nuts...

Bonavox · 10-02-2010 05:00PM

abouttobebanned wrote: »

That's a pretty inaccurate attempt at thanks whoring. (You can always depend on "My name is Url" to be there and ready at the start of the thread with some stupid "witty" comment)

As someone else said, it's hard to comment in more depth without knowing the full details of the case. 11 year olds know what they're doing but they're definitely more susceptible to TV and computer games than an adult.

It's a tragic case, and the child should be punished, but after about 2 years in court he'll be shocked himself at what he did.

That's a very unfair and inaccurate comment in itself. Maybe it's his opinion, have you ever considered that? To be honest I agree with him, and I'm definitely not thanks whoring.

docdolittle · 10-02-2010 05:01PM

AnonoBoy wrote: »

Has someone thought to blame video games yet?

That could be the answer to ensuring this never happens again.

Dam... was just about to post this!

My name is URL · 10-02-2010 05:03PM

abouttobebanned wrote: »

That's a pretty inaccurate attempt at thanks whoring. (You can always depend on "My name is Url" to be there and ready at the start of the thread with some stupid "witty" comment)

As someone else said, it's hard to comment in more depth without knowing the full details of the case. 11 year olds know what they're doing but they're definitely more susceptible to TV and computer games than an adult.

It's a tragic case, and the child should be punished, but after about 2 years in court he'll be shocked himself at what he did.

It's hard to comment without more details but yet you know that he'll be shocked at what he done in 2 years.. yeah makes perfect sense

and how observant of you to notice that I'm ready at the start of threads to say something "witty".. just like how you wait around for someone to post something you can insult them about

Beruthiel · 10-02-2010 05:07PM

I have two questions,
How does any right minded parent miss this kind of hate towards thier new partner?
How does an 11 year old get his hands on a gun?

Great parenting, something tells me his up bringing wasn't exactly top notch.

OrangeDagger · 10-02-2010 05:08PM

Scar_L wrote: »

Absolutely not....in fact I'd argue for it so children this young are more aware of the consequences.

Regardless of age this kid killed a pregnant mother and her baby...

I'd love to see the curve on this. Where's the peak? What age is most aware? If peak is 11 years old, is 5 year old less aware than 11 but more aware than 15. Highly confused.

p.s. you could be joking and I could be merely exhibiting my lack of awareness (I'm somewhere down the curve).

Barracudaincork · 10-02-2010 05:08PM

Beruthiel wrote: »

How does an 11 year old get his hands on a gun?

.

My thoughts exactly! How did he A: get hold of a gun and B: knew how to use it?

HalloweenJack · 10-02-2010 05:08PM

Tbh, I'm split on this.

It is an horrific crime, undoubtedly. Two lives ended and numerous others destroyed. I imagine his father is distraught over this.

However, on the other hand, he's a pre-pubescent boy. Trying him as an adult is ridiculous, imo.

It's impossible for us to regress to that age and truly understand what's going on in his mind. We can't judge him by our adult standards. And I don't think we can say: "When I was 11, I knew the difference", etc..

It is impossible to delete everything that you've experienced since you were 11 and be able to genuinely state you remember exactly what you thought back then.

I think a thorough psychiatric evaluation should be conducted on the child before the courts can decide how to try him. Unless he's experienced a death in the family or in life, I'm guessing the only deaths he's come into contact with are fictional ones and, more often than not, fiction merely covers the act of death. It rarely deals with the subsequent consequences.

HalloweenJack · 10-02-2010 05:10PM

Barracudaincork wrote: »

My thoughts exactly! How did he A: get hold of a gun and B: knew how to use it?

Read the link.

On weekends, Jordan hunted alongside his father, Chris Brown, who purchased the youth-sized 20-gauge shotgun state police believe was the murder weapon. The gun was given to Jordan as a present for Easter, and the boy's lawyers say he only used it for hunting.

Shocking stuff.

allisbleak · 10-02-2010 05:10PM

No real difference to some of the 11 and 12 year olds running around our rougher areas. Do the crime and get caught do the time.

trevosaur · 10-02-2010 05:13PM

well only in america does this happen but yer wan prob deserved a hiding as im sure he did it for a reason but I think he should be locked up for also killing an unborn child. Whats a life sentence in america? Isnt it 25 years or is he in there until the day he dies from old age?

Overheal · 10-02-2010 05:21PM

trevosaur wrote: »

well only in america does this happen

Which part, does this only happen in America?

12 yr old being prosectued for murder as an adult

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