At what point do you call the gardai?

g'em · 02-02-2010 10:39AM

Onkle wrote: »

Gardai won't say where the call came from. Fair play OP

Exactly. My ex assaulted me in my home last year. I tried to call the guards myself but he took my phone from me and wouldn't let me leave. I was scared out of my wits. There was obviously a lot of noise coming from my apartment, my neighbours called the guards and reported a domestic situation and I'm so thankful to them for it - I don't know which neighbours it was, I have people in an apartment above and behind me, but the Guards didn't tell me who it was.

BluesBerry wrote: »

If anyone male/female is stupid enough to stay in a relationship like that whats the point in putting yourself into danger in trying to help when they always turn on the person that steps in and tries to help

sbsquarepants wrote: »

My attitude is, if she's prepared to put up with it thats her choice. If he raised his hand to me or mine i'd take the head off his shoulders, but this is a grown woman, well capable of making her own choices, however stupid those choices may seem. Jesus i'm glad i moved from that kip!

Someone in an abusive relationship is stupid and prepared to put up with it?? Try manipulated, controlled and bullied into staying. A lot of people who are in those kinds of relationships are scared to leave, the abuser (male or female) will have physically and/ or mentally beaten their victim down to a shadow of a their former self, so much so that they don't feel worthy of better treatment. It's not stupidity or a conscious choice to be there, it's the result of a lot of mental anguish.

I agree that getting involved in disputes openly can lead to trouble (personally I'd never come between a couple who were laying into each other on the street) but in a situation like the OPs I'd have no hesitation getting the guards involved when I thought that something dangerous was going on behind closed doors.

Joey the lips · 02-02-2010 10:44AM

The laws regarding domestic violence in this country are very poor. The gards are also poorly skilled in dealing with it. The solution they only have is to remove the man.

and so what with him.......

It makes no sense. Its only rational that the man will come back to the house for a place to stay.

As regards you and your neighbours.... Nothing wrong with reporting it. Even if not in a careing sense. Its techanically breach of the peace and you deserve to live in comfort.

AudreyHepburn · 02-02-2010 10:46AM

I'm shocked at the amount of people here who would be willing to sit back and do nothing while there's a potential domestic violence incedent taking place above them!

Ok it's not unusal for couples to have arguments but there's arguing and then there's getting dangerously violent.

Supposing whatever was being thrown around had it one of the couple and seriously hurt them?

Or worse suppose it hit the baby? Or one of them got so heated up they took it out on the child?

If there is a child involved I'd say call the Gardai immeadiatly. If the woman involved chooses to stay with a violent man or vice aversa that's their business but that little baby shouldn't be in the middle of it.

we'llallhavetea_old · 02-02-2010 11:19AM

if i was one of the couple upstairs having the row, i'd be grateful that someone called the guard. but of course not everyone would think like that, i think you were right op.

Dudess · 02-02-2010 02:07PM

BluesBerry wrote: »

If anyone male/female is stupid enough to stay in a relationship like that

sbsquarepants wrote: »

My attitude is, if she's prepared to put up with it thats her choice. If he raised his hand to me or mine i'd take the head off his shoulders, but this is a grown woman, well capable of making her own choices

Jesus...

humberklog · 02-02-2010 02:36PM

Well there was quite a lot of jumping around re the telling of the story. Original Post indicated a kerfuffle and Kumates concerns over a "domestic" (his words). In post #6 his concerns grow to perhaps being able to prevent a murder. In post #8 it moves to the prevention of "tiffs" (again his words) and concern over his neighbours' sleep being disturbed and then post #31 concerns over infanticide.

Not great way to explain a story that asks the question "when is the right time to call the gardai?" I would have started with infanticide at the top and disturbance of the peace at the lower end.

Big concerns to be quickly posting on the internet and quite a change in description of what was supposed to be heard from post #1 to post #31 and then a run through a whole gamut of worthy concerns.

With such worthy and possibly disastrous concerns Kumate I would suggest you approach your neighbour and ask if she and the baby are ok. Explain what you did and why and ask if this was the correct thing to do. As in your response on post #39 to another poster's suggestion that you "trust your instincts" I would also recommend this when reading her body language and tone of her response to you.
In approaching the situation in this manly manner you could be giving some comfort and reassurance to the person or if it was just a "tiff" then at least you'll know the next time not to call out the gards. Unless of course you are ringing them because they're simply disturbing your sleep.
It may also come close to answering your original question of when is the right time to ring the police. After it's well considered would be my answer.

Mr Benevolent · 02-02-2010 03:34PM

humberklog wrote: »

Well there was quite a lot of jumping around re the telling of the story. Original Post indicated a kerfuffle and Kumates concerns over a "domestic" (his words). In post #6 his concerns grow to perhaps being able to prevent a murder. In post #8 it moves to the prevention of "tiffs" (again his words) and concern over his neighbours' sleep being disturbed and then post #31 concerns over infanticide.

Not great way to explain a story that asks the question "when is the right time to call the gardai?" I would have started with infanticide at the top and disturbance of the peace at the lower end.

Big concerns to be quickly posting on the internet and quite a change in description of what was supposed to be heard from post #1 to post #31 and then a run through a whole gamut of worthy concerns.

With such worthy and possibly disastrous concerns Kumate I would suggest you approach your neighbour and ask if she and the baby are ok. Explain what you did and why and ask if this was the correct thing to do. As in your response on post #39 to another poster's suggestion that you "trust your instincts" I would also recommend this when reading her body language and tone of her response to you.
In approaching the situation in this manly manner you could be giving some comfort and reassurance to the person or if it was just a "tiff" then at least you'll know the next time not to call out the gards. Unless of course you are ringing them because they're simply disturbing your sleep.
It may also come close to answering your original question of when is the right time to ring the police. After it's well considered would be my answer.

In other words, just ignore the screaming and pleading, then go to bed? Lovely.

Overheal · 02-02-2010 03:54PM

humberklog wrote: »

Well there was quite a lot of jumping around re the telling of the story. Original Post indicated a kerfuffle and Kumates concerns over a "domestic" (his words). In post #6 his concerns grow to perhaps being able to prevent a murder. In post #8 it moves to the prevention of "tiffs" (again his words) and concern over his neighbours' sleep being disturbed and then post #31 concerns over infanticide.

Schrödinger's cat

kumate_champ07 · 02-02-2010 05:23PM

humberklog wrote: »

Well there was quite a lot of jumping around re the telling of the story. Original Post indicated a kerfuffle and Kumates concerns over a "domestic" (his words). In post #6 his concerns grow to perhaps being able to prevent a murder. In post #8 it moves to the prevention of "tiffs" (again his words) and concern over his neighbours' sleep being disturbed and then post #31 concerns over infanticide.

Not great way to explain a story that asks the question "when is the right time to call the gardai?" I would have started with infanticide at the top and disturbance of the peace at the lower end.

Big concerns to be quickly posting on the internet and quite a change in description of what was supposed to be heard from post #1 to post #31 and then a run through a whole gamut of worthy concerns.

With such worthy and possibly disastrous concerns Kumate I would suggest you approach your neighbour and ask if she and the baby are ok. Explain what you did and why and ask if this was the correct thing to do. As in your response on post #39 to another poster's suggestion that you "trust your instincts" I would also recommend this when reading her body language and tone of her response to you.
In approaching the situation in this manly manner you could be giving some comfort and reassurance to the person or if it was just a "tiff" then at least you'll know the next time not to call out the gards. Unless of course you are ringing them because they're simply disturbing your sleep.
It may also come close to answering your original question of when is the right time to ring the police. After it's well considered would be my answer.

Whats your problem with me?

Did someone call the guards on you?

Whyno · 02-02-2010 05:31PM

Why didnt you bang on the ceiling and roar up at them and say "If your going to kill her fcuking do it already if not keep that fcuking racket down".
That should put a stop to it.

kumate_champ07 · 02-02-2010 05:34PM

humberklog wrote: »

Well there was quite a lot of jumping around re the telling of the story. Original Post indicated a kerfuffle and Kumates concerns over a "domestic" (his words). In post #6 his concerns grow to perhaps being able to prevent a murder. In post #8 it moves to the prevention of "tiffs" (again his words) and concern over his neighbours' sleep being disturbed and then post #31 concerns over infanticide.

Not great way to explain a story that asks the question "when is the right time to call the gardai?" I would have started with infanticide at the top and disturbance of the peace at the lower end.

Big concerns to be quickly posting on the internet and quite a change in description of what was supposed to be heard from post #1 to post #31 and then a run through a whole gamut of worthy concerns.

With such worthy and possibly disastrous concerns Kumate I would suggest you approach your neighbour and ask if she and the baby are ok. Explain what you did and why and ask if this was the correct thing to do. As in your response on post #39 to another poster's suggestion that you "trust your instincts" I would also recommend this when reading her body language and tone of her response to you.
In approaching the situation in this manly manner you could be giving some comfort and reassurance to the person or if it was just a "tiff" then at least you'll know the next time not to call out the gards. Unless of course you are ringing them because they're simply disturbing your sleep.
It may also come close to answering your original question of when is the right time to ring the police. After it's well considered would be my answer.

Choke wrote: »

every tiff can't involve the Gardaí.

I was responding to chokes viewpoint

theres something not quite right with your attitude, I sense anger that previously had nowhere to vent and now you see me as a person to unload it on

sexdwarf · 02-02-2010 05:48PM

Op you were dead right to call the Gardaí. So what if it turns out to be nothing. I'm sure a lot of neighbours in Josef Fritzl's neighbourhood had wished that they had kept their eyes open.

And to anyone spouting the 'oh if she's stupid enough to stay with him' line, obviously have no concept of the reality of domestic abuse.

humberklog · 02-02-2010 06:27PM

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

Whats your problem with me?

Did someone call the guards on you?

I've no problem with you at all KC, I'm just responding to the posts and not trying to get at the poster.

Nobody has ever called the police on me. Never gave anyone reason to.

I just think that the desrciption of events that you gave in your first post were vague and not enough information in it to warrant people agreeing that you should have called the police.

Couples can row and should be allowed to (even door slamming and baby waking ones) without having the police called. Sure if it is a regular occurance or if the sounds coming from the flat are worrying then by all means do you what you think is right. But that's just it: doing what you think is right shouldn't need a consensus on line immediately after the event.

I've no anger in me at all, sure today I'm celebrating my birthday (40) and am only glowing with surprise I've made it so far.

But, and here's my but, what if it was a relationship that is developing a violent side and that is what you heard? Surely touching base with the victim would be the right move also on the flip side: what if it was just a nark? Surely getting that sorted out in your head would also be the right thing as it would save you from calling the police out unnecessarily if it did flare up again?

The police aren't there to sort relationship issues out, that's with family guidance and councelling is for. Imagine if the police were called to each and every loud domestic row every time? It doesn't work like that and shouldn't.

KC you heard what you heard and I think that's very hard to convey on line. An issue popped up and you dealt with it as you saw fit but no-one else here can, hand on heart, agree with what you did because they weren't witness to what you heard. But there is an easy way for you to figure out for yourself when the police should be called again on this couple and that is by asking who you think was getting the hiding what their feelings are about how you reacted.

I must point out that my terser and more flippant posts were posted when only your original description was up, which, as I've said and stand by, was very vague and not very desriptive.

humberklog · 02-02-2010 06:33PM

Overheal wrote: »

Schrödinger's cat

I lived for many year in 65 Merrion Sq. The residence of Irwin when here in Dublin. Indeed he was a family friend of the grandparents.

g'em · 02-02-2010 06:44PM

humberklog wrote: »

But, and here's my but, what if it was a relationship that is developing a violent side and that is what you heard? Surely touching base with the victim would be the right move .

Unless you are close to or a confidante of the victim then this might not be the best move. The shame, humiliation and embarrassment (that is perceived by the victim) of being involved in a violently troubled relationship doesn't lend itself well to chatting to strangers about it.

humberklog · 02-02-2010 06:48PM

g'em wrote: »

Unless you are close to or a confidante of the victim then this might not be the best move. The shame, humiliation and embarrassment (that is perceived by the victim) of being involved in a violently troubled relationship doesn't lend itself well to chatting to strangers about it.

I'd imagine that there would be quite a bit of that though just by having the bizzies on your doorstep in the middle of the night. Then the embarassment of knowing a neighbour called them and then the insecurity of not knowing which one and why.

Overheal · 02-02-2010 06:59PM

humberklog wrote: »

I lived for many year in 65 Merrion Sq. The residence of Irwin when here in Dublin. Indeed he was a family friend of the grandparents.

That wasnt the point I was trying to make, ever so vaguely. The point being Kumate had no way of knowing what was going on up in that apartment. Henceforth, it could have been Anything.

But, and here's my but, what if it was a relationship that is developing a violent side and that is what you heard? Surely touching base with the victim would be the right move also on the flip side: what if it was just a nark? Surely getting that sorted out in your head would also be the right thing as it would save you from calling the police out unnecessarily if it did flare up again?

What happened to Not Getting Involved. You don't want him calling in an impartial mediator (AGS) You just want him knocking on the door and shoving his nose in their business altogether.

Theres a terrible misconception that Police Forces are there purely for drug busts and scumbags. They're also there to Serve the Public Trust and Keep the Peace.

humberklog · 02-02-2010 07:03PM

Overheal wrote: »

That wasnt the point I was trying to make, ever so vaguely. The point being Kumate had no way of knowing what was going on up in that apartment. Henceforth, it could have been Anything.

Twister?

Overheal · 02-02-2010 07:04PM

humberklog wrote: »

Twister?

Helen Hunt. But we're getting off topic.

T runner · 02-02-2010 07:09PM

kumate_champ07 wrote: »

This just happened

I was sitting in my flat on the computer, heard some noise upstairs. a man and a woman shouting, door being banged, some loud thud sounds like something heavy being dropped, theres also been the sound of a newborn baby crying for the past couple of days but I wasnt sure if that was from the same place.

I didnt call them straight away as couples tend to have fights every so often but after a while of hearing the commotion above me on a Sunday night I wasnt taking any chances

they guards came quickly and went up, talked to them, she's staying there with the guy now and didnt want to leave.

was I wrong calling the gardai over a domestic? hearing loud noises with the shouting had me worried. I had a neighbour almost killed right across from me in a flat before.

at what point to you decide a situation is dangerous enough to get the police involved?

You were right. At worst its a wake up call to the couple to respect their neighbours.

If it is a case of domestic violence the fact that the guards have been called will give them more power later if things deteriorate.

If you feel something is wrong ring the guards. Legally and morally the best things to do.

Sasquashie · 02-02-2010 07:12PM

ALways calls the Gardai ... and ask them to swing by a pizza place on the way.

Overheal · 02-02-2010 07:19PM

Getting off of Kumate's Specific Incident, how do you view your Police Force?

When I see Police Officers in the United States - You don't really think of them as an Oppressive Force when they're on the beat. They carry Guns but they aren't just there to stop Convenience Store Robberies and pull over Speeders and Drunk Drivers. A lot of what they do is interact with the Public; on a Saturday night you would see a ton of them directing crowds in front of the clubs but also chatting away with the bouncers and people in the queues.

I wouldn't think too hard about phoning one up if I heard a worrying amount of noise coming out of my neighbor's place. Ever watch Cops? Thats pretty much Half of their entire Job, getting called up for 'Domestic Disturbances'

I mean I've seen the videos of Police Brutality but in Practice its not something that makes me Fearful of my Police Force.

humberklog · 02-02-2010 07:22PM

Overheal wrote: »

Getting off of Kumate's Specific Incident, how do you view your Police Force?

It is a bit!!:pac:

@Kumate....have this couple any previous?

Overheal · 02-02-2010 07:24PM

humberklog wrote: »

It is a bit!!:pac:

Well I mean when thinking of reasons why you Wouldnt call the Police in for domestic disturbance - it begs the question "Why" and leads itself to the question of what your preconceptions are about An Garda Síochána and why you think calling them in would Not be a proportional response.

ForeverYoung90 · 02-02-2010 07:35PM

..when theres something wrong in the neighbourhood..who you gonna call?..

Gary ITR · 02-02-2010 08:29PM

Stephen_2010 wrote: »

I will, I promise. So, you too agree that people who call the Gardai when they fear domestic abuse is in full swing and that a crying child might indicate a minor is also at risk, are just....snitches?

Cool! Enjoy the attachment!

Where did I say that? If you can read you will be able to see that I applauded the op for calling the Guards. The problem I have with you is that you expect moderators to have a certain opinion.

Edit: And here's an image for you

CrazyRabbit · 02-02-2010 09:30PM

I was in the same situation a few years ago in my old apartment block. Some bloke beating the crap out of his misses upstairs.

Called the Guards but the woman refused to make a statement and the beatings went on for a few more days.

A few other concerned residents cornered the guy as he was leaving the building. He was politely but firmly warned that there would be consequences if he laid a hand on the wife again. Of course, the guys were about to head outside for a game of baseball, and the bats might have accidentally intimidated him.

There wasn't a sound out of that apartment for weeks after. They moved somewhere else about 3 months later. I guess he went back to using her as a punchbag.

Overheal · 09-02-2010 04:35AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSRIncPV63o

/thread

Junco Partner · 10-02-2010 12:16AM

bout two years ago i heard my neighbour arguing it sounded pretty fierce i i went outside for a better listen as any nose fecker would when everything went quiet the door opened and my neighbour came out walking up the path iu says to him eamonn is everyting alrite with you and celine he says i had to get out of there before i smashed a brick off her face

we all know how that ended up dont we

dresden8 · 10-02-2010 12:24AM

Onkle wrote: »

Gardai won't say where the call came from. Fair play OP

Unfortunately this is not true.

Still, fair play, better safe than sorry.

I have called the guards and, in hindsight, been wrong, but sometimes you are the person on the spot and only you have to decide, right or wrong, what to do.

Fear of making the wrong decision is entirely the wrong decision.

At what point do you call the gardai?

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