Loner looking for another loner

santana75 · 05-01-2010 08:53PM

Denerick wrote: »

They are only arrogant because they are uncomfertable to you. I find your persecutory attitude to be rather arrogant, if I'm being honest. I fully agree with Kiera, I find the judgementalism here sickening.

+1. Im pretty shocked at some of the responses here. Why is everybody so threatened by what this chap is saying? Why is everybody taking it so personally? He's looking for help, not for people to have a go at him behind the veil of "being helpful." Youre not being helpful, youre getting defensive.

hawkmoon269 · 05-01-2010 08:57PM

Denerick wrote: »

I think there is a bit of groupthink going on here, ignoring what the OP is actually saying and assuming the worst. The OP sounds intelligent and sincere, albeit lacking in social skills (Which are pretty obvious and the cause of your own destruction IMO)

I personally like introverted, thoughtful people, and the OPs response came right out of leftfield. I wasn't expecting that.

He does no harm to anyone, he just feels the myopia of 21st century existance, a vain, judgemental and altogether exhausting social rat race. Fair play to him for deciding to remain aloof from it. If anyone is behaving like judgemental huffers here its everyone else. Sometimes everyone else is wrong.

Add me to those that were, quite honestly, stunned and shocked by the first few responses. Nietzsche's epithet about the bovine mediocrity of the herd springs to mind. I will give my own response to the OP later on when I put my thoughts together.

jimmycrackcorm · 05-01-2010 09:22PM

santana75 wrote: »

+1. Im pretty shocked at some of the responses here. Why is everybody so threatened by what this chap is saying? Why is everybody taking it so personally? He's looking for help, not for people to have a go at him behind the veil of "being helpful." Youre not being helpful, youre getting defensive.

The OP said that 90% of what I and 90% of the population is futile. Pretty arrogant I think too.

Denerick · 05-01-2010 09:45PM

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

The OP said that 90% of what I and 90% of the population is futile. Pretty arrogant I think too.

Personally I think around 100% of the population is futile. And I include myself in that also. Am I wrong? The fact that he see's himself in an elite 10% grouping doesn't make much difference. We all tend to box ourselves away like this. Just take a run through your personality traits; do you not think that there are only around 10% of the population who might in any way resemble you?

And he's right about the idle chatter in the pub, even if he's being a bad sport about it. I'm usually the first to lament the most recent shannigans of Mary Stu when I've a couple of pints in me. I still think the whole process is a load of cock though.

Anyway, this is entirely irrelevant and its only intended to show you that we all judge the world all the time, often unconsciously. Big deal if the OP is arrogant. At least he keeps to himself and doesn't impose his arrogance on other people, like some people here have done (Telling him he 'doesn't live the right way and should completely change his personality/get counselling/lighten up) He didn't ask for a personality disorder diagnosis, he wanted advice on how to meet someone special. Even loners deserve to be in love. So get off your arrogant high horse and give the OP a break.

Kimia · 05-01-2010 09:47PM

hawkmoon269 wrote: »

Add me to those that were, quite honestly, stunned and shocked by the first few responses. Nietzsche's epithet about the bovine mediocrity of the herd springs to mind. I will give my own response to the OP later on when I put my thoughts together.

Well this entire thread is a real relevation. I don't agree with any of you! Both sides are attacking the other - the first '3 responses' were apparently mean and judgemental (and to be honest, I don't think they were, I think they were genuinely trying to help) and the others like the above are also mean and judgemental to the first 3 responses - bovine mediocrity of the herd my eye. You sound just as elitist as the responses you profess to be 'stunned and shocked' by.

What ever happened to embracing the individual? I absolutely love my wacky friends and the more different and interesting your view on the world the more I love hearing it. Who cares if the OP lives in his own little world - he obviously enjoys it there!

OP i do think though that both sides here have given you food for thought. I too love philosophy (have an undergrad in it) and have found myself loving solitude at times too, but I also think it's important to have some social outlet. I'm not sure it's realistic or healthy to be alone too much and I'm not sure how you would interact with another person in a relationship without having any social experience (if you continue to cut yourself off).

I think that a lot of people feel introverted - I don't agree with the response that said most people are extroverts. I think we are a little more complex than that. But OP there is something to be said for looking inward too to see if perhaps some of the ways people seem to react to you could be as a response to how you present yourself to people. For example, if someone assumed that you were ignorant because you didn't like to talk much you would be insulted? If you are to assume that 90% of the population are stupid and arrogant you are insulting people and as such they will reject you not surprisingly.

Embrace the fact that you love your own company - I think it's wonderful that you have a strong and developed sense of self worth. But don't assume that other people are not worthy of your company because if you give people a chance they may surprise you. Experience as much of life as you can and this includes interacting with other people - how would you know so much about philosophy if you did not meditate on other people's views before you? (e.g., Aristotle, Kant, Descartes, etc)

And also for what it's worth, I think a lot of people are trying to help you on here so it would be worth not assuming that they mean illwill. Best of luck.

Sorry · 05-01-2010 09:58PM

OP, it's understandable that people get defensive when you criticise their way of life/the general consensus. In my opinion, a lot of what you said is absolutely true. You need to get involved in activities that actually interest you. Find a club or society you find stimulating and join. Try to get into groups that provide you with more chance of meeting people of a similar mindframe.

booksale · 05-01-2010 09:58PM

OP, I was just talking about 'fitting in' with a friend yesterday. We both are actually a quiet type but then we learned how to talk, how to make other people feeling easier about ourselves. We joke... and then we totally forget we once learn how to behave 'properly'. We are cheerful most of the time, joyful... and no, we are not pretending.

Not until later, some crisis, or stress, or something... made us realised a part of us is missing and some part of us is still here...

I can really understand how you feel.

I guess, most of the people may have the same feelings sometimes in their lives, that's why literature, philosophy, relgion... are still here.

I guess even the most extrovent person would have a moment of that thoughts that you once have. But they don't usually let the thoughts stay.

As human, we are quite complicated.

I have no answers and I would still try to fit in, because well, um, I want to make life a bit easier for me and people surround me. I never expect there would be one person in the world can accept me and understand completely with passion. Most of the time, there are compromise. We are in a group.

I am sure there are people out there that suit you. Yeah, internet maybe a good place. I would reply your email if I read this profiile of yours. I think you maybe able to understand me. And internet world is a world of words which can carry deeper thoughts more easier than in real life pub chit chat.

But as a 'MODIFIED' version of loner, I would also be scared away if a new friend of mine shares with me all his pours all this thing to me at the very very beginning stage in real life. People do forget that they are also a loner.

Zascar · 05-01-2010 10:12PM

Op would you give internet dating a try? I think if you wrote a profile like what you wrote above, but focused more on the positives, you might find girls with similar viewpoints. I'm sure there are girls that do just like the quiet life but maybe do the normal thing just to fit in etc. Might be worth a try, I'm not saying there are going to be loads, but you only need to find one.

Liam Byrne · 05-01-2010 10:22PM

My main concern would be the OP's focus on the differences, to the point where he/she isn't even remotely cognisant of the possibility of any similarities.

Yes, I can see similarities between myself and the OP, if there's a conversation about so-called "celebs", or the latest Big Brother or X-factor stuff, or an obsession with trivialities and pointless waffle, or irrelevant tabloid gossip and sensationalism instead of news or discussion, or the horrible obsession with commercialism and looking successful and rich.

All that can get on my wick, but I'll tune out of the conversation for a bit, or go to the loo, or whatever....I might slag off the conversation, but I won't get too in-their-face about it because if I did I'd miss out on any other conversations and companionship that said-same friends were having.

Likewise, many friends of mine have now settled down with kids, and those kids form a large part of their conversations and news.......I hang in there through those (some stories are great to hear, others are typical parents' trivialities) because the remainder is worthwhile and part of being a friend to anyone is listening to their news.

So instead of focusing on the differences, check to see if there are any similarities.

05-01-2010 10:25PM

santana75 wrote: »

+1. Im pretty shocked at some of the responses here. Why is everybody so threatened by what this chap is saying? Why is everybody taking it so personally? He's looking for help, not for people to have a go at him behind the veil of "being helpful." Youre not being helpful, youre getting defensive.

Perhaps people do see themselves in the OP. It would be one thing if he were happy being isolated, but he isn't. He's asking for advice about finding a girlfriend - he's not going to find one shut in his room. Nobody is saying he should take the plunge and start going clubbing every night, but I strongly believe that all humans need some level of social interaction. It is not healthy to spend all your time alone. He has said he's tried doing the pub thing but it doesn't look to me as if he's given it much of a chance at all. I think he is missing out on a lot of potential friends and romances by writing off 90% of the population as vacuous idiots with nothing to say. I think a person's world view largely depends on how they see themselves and how they feel in themselves. He sees himself as a loner and an introvert, he acts like one and people treat him like one. As I said, some people are just rude and mean but there is no way that 90% of people are nasty towards the OP for no reason. There is no way that 90% of people reject anyone who isn't just like them. It just isn't true. I'm quite the misanthrope myself sometimes, but I do realise that when everyone seems to have a problem with you, the problem is likely to be YOU. Sometimes the best advice is the hardest to take. We could all say 'OP, we understand, you're different and special and you see things differently to other people, you shouldn't change just to conform to society's norms and expectations', but how is that helping in any way?

tommmy1979 · 05-01-2010 11:21PM

Denerick wrote: »

I think there is a bit of groupthink going on here, ignoring what the OP is actually saying and assuming the worst. The OP sounds intelligent and sincere, albeit lacking in social skills (Which are pretty obvious and the cause of your own destruction IMO)

I personally like introverted, thoughtful people, and the OPs response came right out of leftfield. I wasn't expecting that.

He does no harm to anyone, he just feels the myopia of 21st century existance, a vain, judgemental and altogether exhausting social rat race. Fair play to him for deciding to remain aloof from it. If anyone is behaving like judgemental huffers here its everyone else. Sometimes everyone else is wrong.

Ya but... we're here for a good time not a long time.

Denerick · 05-01-2010 11:27PM

tommmy1979 wrote: »

Ya but... we're here for a good time not a long time.

Who gave you the idea that we're here for a good time? Its reckless thinking like that which has created an unequal world. Clearly, logically, rationally, not everybody can have a good time all at once. Some people have to clean the sewers. Some have to inherit fabulous wealth. Try telling the toilet cleaner to lighten up when he's busy taking care of the rich heiress' **** for the minimum wage.

lynsalot · 05-01-2010 11:58PM

I have to say I'm a little alarmed by the responses the op has received here.
Of course it's natural for ppl to be defensive but the fact that the OP has posted in personal issues forum means he's looking for support.

I would strongly recommend joining societies or clubs you're interested in. Perhaps a philosophy club to meet ppl with the same interests.

I'm sorry OP that you're finding it hard to meet ppl. Most ppl find the initial meet n greet daunting and it's easier to find common ground by talking about the generic x factor/ nights out banter. Of course the more approachable someone seems the easier it is for them to be approached

I hope you'll listen to some of the helpful responses u've received. Let us know what u think and if you will take them on board

All the best
Lindsay

06-01-2010 12:18AM

Denerick wrote: »

Who gave you the idea that we're here for a good time? Its reckless thinking like that which has created an unequal world. Clearly, logically, rationally, not everybody can have a good time all at once. Some people have to clean the sewers. Some have to inherit fabulous wealth. Try telling the toilet cleaner to lighten up when he's busy taking care of the rich heiress' **** for the minimum wage.

What one earth are you talking about? Someone's position in the world doesn't dictate how happy or miserable they are. Plenty of people have a happy and fulfilling life doing minimum wage jobs. You might think someone saying 'we're here for a good time' sounds flippant and shallow, but isn't it the truth? Who wants to waste their life away worrying and thinking and complaining? Life IS short, it's not a dress rehearsal. There's nothing silly or reckless about thinking people should make the best of their situation.

LegacyUser · 06-01-2010 12:40AM

OP, don't think that you are unusual in being naturally introverted. In my experience, true extroverts are far less common than introverts. Being inward looking and inhibited in social situations is easy; most people you see in college, niteclubs etc. who appear confident and outgoing are exerting an effort to be like this.

Also, that philosophy stuff you're reading...I'd stop if I was you! You might think that we humans should be able to think about and answer the big philosophical questions but seriously, our brains didn't evolve in an enviroment where there was a need to ponder deeply and constantly about the state of humanity, nihilism, existentialism and so on. When I left school I found myself reading books on evolution, philosophy, psychology and believe me, I wish I never did. I don't agree with those that say all philosophy is liberating; alot of it dampens a persons ability to enjoy life as we humans were meant to enjoy it....raw sensations of love, happiness, anger, hope.....not an objective understanding of neuroscience and the non-existence of free-will.

Man, you're young. Put down the books and enjoy life!!!

Nadaur · 06-01-2010 01:57AM

Peggypeg wrote: »

Hey Sweetie,

I'm sorry but I didn't say you just want sex I asked if that's what you want. Nothing to be ashamed of by the way. However, look at your reaction to my question:

Of course the guaranteed answer pops up in the first response, oh, you just want sex. To hell with you, what the hell do you know about what I want or don't want?

I asked a simple question and look at how you responded. You really do come across as arrogant and elitist etc but maybe as you say you are kind and nice underneath. Have a think about it though sweetie, if the face you present to the world says to all "I'm better than you, I'm cleverer than you" why would anyone want to know you better or engage with you? How old are you I wonder?

I knew a guy once (about 44) that had the exact same outlook, everyone was a 'monkey' and an 'idiot', he lived in his tiny apartment and didn't have anyone he saw regularly, he was way too smart to sit in pubs etc and had better things to do. I was young when I knew him and thought he was the bees knees, it wasn't until a couple of years later that I found out he had huge mental problems and would sit in his house for a week at a time riddled with depression.

Sweetie I think the arrogance you display is a defence mechanism, and I understand why you do it even if you don't. You really could do with a little councelling or even read some self help books on confidence etc.

I think even if you do find a girl that fits into your little world you might not be lonely but you'd still be hurt and resentful and therefore continue to come across as arrogant, which will make people reject you more and so the cycle will continue. You need to break the cycle and get out there, surely not everything people do is beneath you? Maybe something high brow would make you more comfortable? Like a debating club or something along those lines.

Honestly sweetie try your hardest to be honest with yourself, that's the first step to changing the life your not happy with.

The people here really are trying to help you, by being honest with you.

The very best of luck to you OP and I honestly mean that, I really hope you find the courage to have a long hard look at yourself and get some help with the confidence.

Big Squishy HUGS.

OP,
as a 35 yr old man who has worn through those boots your wearing....listen to the lady above....she's a well of wisdom and I'd suggest you drink deep.
good luck with it.........as Hendrix sang 'Lonliness is such a drag'
Nadaur

Denerick · 06-01-2010 02:04AM

rtyuiop wrote: »

OP, don't think that you are unusual in being naturally introverted. In my experience, true extroverts are far less common than introverts. Being inward looking and inhibited in social situations is easy; most people you see in college, niteclubs etc. who appear confident and outgoing are exerting an effort to be like this.

Also, that philosophy stuff you're reading...I'd stop if I was you! You might think that we humans should be able to think about and answer the big philosophical questions but seriously, our brains didn't evolve in an enviroment where there was a need to ponder deeply and constantly about the state of humanity, nihilism, existentialism and so on. When I left school I found myself reading books on evolution, philosophy, psychology and believe me, I wish I never did. I don't agree with those that say all philosophy is liberating; alot of it dampens a persons ability to enjoy life as we humans were meant to enjoy it....raw sensations of love, happiness, anger, hope.....not an objective understanding of neuroscience and the non-existence of free-will.

Man, you're young. Put down the books and enjoy life!!!

:rolleyes:

OP, DON'T take that advice. That is by far the most absurd thing I've ever read on boards.ie.

Virginia Woolf (One of the greatest writers of the 20th century, and I'm not alone in that opinion) was so weighed down by her demons after a life of crippling introspection, filled her coat with stones and threw herself off a cliff. Sylvia Plath put her head in an oven, and this wasn't her first suicide attempt. Hunter S.Thompson, the man who gave us the memorable 'Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas', shot himself. Kurt Cobain shot himself. A lot of extremely intelligent and insightful people have killed themselves. But this doesn't mean that high levels of intelligence are naturally related to depression or other dystopian traits.

I for one would rather know the truth and be unhappy than live blissfully in ignorance.

OP, you are your own person, do whatever you think is right. But this idea that people should stop thinking about themselves and the universe, if it were actually followed through, is so adverse to human curiosity that it verges on the most hysterical kind of philistinism.

We wouldn't be using the internet, at the very least.

Denerick · 06-01-2010 02:06AM

[quote=[Deleted User];63816209]What one earth are you talking about? Someone's position in the world doesn't dictate how happy or miserable they are. Plenty of people have a happy and fulfilling life doing minimum wage jobs. You might think someone saying 'we're here for a good time' sounds flippant and shallow, but isn't it the truth? Who wants to waste their life away worrying and thinking and complaining? Life IS short, it's not a dress rehearsal. There's nothing silly or reckless about thinking people should make the best of their situation.[/quote]

Admittedly you are right, and that was a rather silly point for me to make.

nyarlothothep · 06-01-2010 02:13AM

Denerick wrote: »

Admittedly you are right, and that was a rather silly point for me to make.

Actually you make a good point. Circumstances have a huge influence on how happy an individual is, to disregard the effect of the environment someone lives in pertaining to happiness is illogical. The likelihood is that people born into poverty or forced to take minimum wage jobs will be more unhappy on average than those who don't. What I think you suggest though is that making the best out of a situation isn't always the best option long term as this can lead into an acceptance of circumstances which can be changed. Making the best out of ones situation as a peasant prior to the french revolution instead of revolting for example. But I think there is a danger in glamorizing cynicism about the human race. Its so easy but it only yields circular answers in my experience. Socializing isn't a bad thing, the op just needs to find his niche methinks.

06-01-2010 03:56AM

OP, I understand absolutely everything you said in your original post. Trust me, you're not alone.

Danniboo · 06-01-2010 09:50AM

Denerick wrote: »

Why is the OP wrong? For judging 90% of the world? What is a world without judgement? The problem is that while he may judge 90% of others, he tends to lament their situation rather than get actively angry at them, like you lot seem to be doing with him. This is what seperates the judgementalism.

The fellow is not sociable, prefers his own company, likes to think, and doesn't want to impose himself on anyone else. Why is this so galling exactly?

Because he wants to bring someone else into his world

Denerick · 06-01-2010 02:15PM

Danniboo wrote: »

[/b]

Because he wants to bring someone else into his world

He shouldn't have to change every aspect about him to do this. Your opinion on women must be very small indeed if you think all they want to do is go down to the pub 24/7, talking about X factor and get irritated by 'clever' talk, such as philosophy etc!

Danniboo · 06-01-2010 02:20PM

Denerick wrote: »

He shouldn't have to change every aspect about him to do this. Your opinion on women must be very small indeed if you think all they want to do is go down to the pub 24/7, talking about X factor and get irritated by 'clever' talk, such as philosophy etc!

What the hell are you on about, where did I say any of the above anwhere in any of my posts. I enjoy intelligent conversation and delving deep into my own thoughts. But everyone needs to let there hair down once in a while. I never once said he needs to change every aspect of himself. Please try not to twist my words.

LegacyUser · 06-01-2010 02:49PM

OP people reject YOU, YOU think they are morons etc
Clearly the problem is with YOU and how you relate to others, the whole world cant be Sh*te and life is what we make of it ourselves!!!!

I'd tend to agree most people are morons but I dont sit around worrying about them and the fate of humanity - thats a waste of MY life

Denerick · 06-01-2010 02:59PM

Danniboo wrote: »

What the hell are you on about, where did I say any of the above anwhere in any of my posts. I enjoy intelligent conversation and delving deep into my own thoughts. But everyone needs to let there hair down once in a while. I never once said he needs to change every aspect of himself. Please try not to twist my words.

Well you basically told him to stop moping around. As far as I can see he never said he was unhappy moping around. 'Letting their hair down' is very subjective, a lot of people hate the whole pub/club buzz.

Danniboo · 06-01-2010 03:27PM

Denerick wrote: »

Well you basically told him to stop moping around. As far as I can see he never said he was unhappy moping around. 'Letting their hair down' is very subjective, a lot of people hate the whole pub/club buzz.

Do you make this stuff up as you go along :rolleyes:

Peggypeg · 06-01-2010 03:34PM

This thread has gotten hilarious! We should probably stop quoting each other and nit picking coz at the end of the day the argument is futile:p

I think the general consensus is that the OP may be happier if he found a social outlet that he enjoyed, therefore meeting more people, therefore opening up the possibility of romance.

I wish you the best of luck OP, really I do.

Danniboo · 06-01-2010 03:53PM

Peggypeg wrote: »

This thread has gotten hilarious! We should probably stop quoting each other and nit picking coz at the end of the day the argument is futile:p

I think the general consensus is that the OP may be happier if he found a social outlet that he enjoyed, therefore meeting more people, therefore opening up the possibility of romance.

I wish you the best of luck OP, really I do.

+ 1

I better not say that though or i'll be accused of undermining women :rolleyes:

Peggypeg · 06-01-2010 04:05PM

:D:D:D

A quiet one · 06-01-2010 07:01PM

OP you sounds like a house cat snuggled up on the coach wishing there was another at the other end.
I don't see what's so wrong about that, except for the futility of wishing. And there are loads of people like you.

I can't make her appear and you haven't asked me to do so. However, I suggest that though she's not at the other end of your couch right now, she may well be at the other end of an internet connection.

But, here's the nub; You like thinking, which is fair enough, but what are it's fruits? What has it produced? What has it given you?
So far, it looks like the answer... in real terms... is not a lot.

The proof of that, as I see it, (with limited evidence) is that you hadn't managed to think about the internet connection, despite the fact that you are not only using one, but the very groups you need are accessible from this very page (under "soc" section);

What's more at no point in this 'debate' have you demonstrated the ability to think out a question such as, ;
Some here object to the projection of your thinking and you object to theirs, so which perceptive qualifies as acting as the Thought Police?

So, I wish you luck, but urge you to consider that your thinking methodology is flawed.

Loner looking for another loner

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