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Irish Open 2010 - Structure

245

Comments

  • #32
    ITT-Pat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭ITT-Pat


    RichieLawlor wrote: »
    Less chips longer clock means more play when it matters. It's that simple.

    Who cares about the numptys who want 20k so they can sit for ten hours and say they went deep in the Irish open. The best tournaments I've played have been in Vegas where almost all are small stack long clock.

    I agree with all of this


  • #33
    robinblinds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 754 ✭✭✭robinblinds


    The Irish Open reminds me of the Volkswagen Golf.


  • #34
    sickpuppy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 955 ✭✭✭sickpuppy


    10k with that clock is plenty of chips no harm in playing a few fcuking pots instead of waiting for kk aa for 12 hours.
    There comes a time tournament when you have too gamble

    last 10k chip event i played in galway was card dead for day 1 1010 being my best cards and i still had average stack having 5k extra chips wouldnt have made a differnece


  • #35
    roleynoley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 111 ✭✭roleynoley


    If thats the case and its "set in stone"why are ye changing the structure atall then.Ill tell you why...because yere moving with the times which we all have to do.I can see what Richie is saying about the vegas tourneys etc.and its a good point.ie the better player will prob shine through.But if you change the time structure why not the stack??Wasnt the ME in vegas 30k this year??Was it always 30k??If that can change so can the IO.


  • #36
    robinblinds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 754 ✭✭✭robinblinds


    Rocky! Rocky! Rocky!


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  • #37
    BigCityBanker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,751 ✭✭✭BigCityBanker


    tensevensuited wrote: »
    u posted this up 2 get feedback and now ur getting ur feedback.do ur customers feedback not matter or are u just being totaly ignorant to what
    the customer has 2 say.basicaly this should be a 15k tournie,but ur basically telling us 2 fck off and mind ur our own business.do u not like
    the feedback ur getting..

    im not for a moment saying that I dont like the feedback I am getting - dont worry - il be printign this thread and putting it under peoples noses and making sure they read it.
    tensevensuited wrote: »
    another point i find a little funny is u can post a structure for the io nearly 9 months in advance yet u only finalised the structre last week 4 the winter fest which happens in 2 months..

    I dont get your humor here? go ahead and explain it to me though. I stated a month ago that we were meeting to agree structures - both structures were agreed at the same meeting. I published the IWF structures the same afternoon and said the IO one would follow. I hadnt intended in releasing this structure for a while yet but I had to do something to stop the PM's, phone calls, text messages and public inquisition I was getting when I stepped into either the SE or the Fitzwilliam.

    The information was to hand and agreed upon by those concerned - I thought it was a reasonable step to make it public knowledge. I am open to suggestions to the contrary though?
    tensevensuited wrote: »
    noel its about time u take customers seriously coz we r not fools.

    people should not for a minute think that I dont take this serious - I wish I could open up and tell the whole world just how serious I feel about this whole situation. Im not taking anyone for fools either.

    Richie Lawlor touched on it above - more chips does not equal more play. There are games in Ireland that start with 15k or more chips and they quickly descend into a crapshoot.


  • #38
    kakak1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,612 ✭✭✭kakak1


    robinblinds wrote: »
    The Irish Open reminds me of the Volkswagen Golf.


    the 1981 Golf or a 2009 Golf cos there's some hell of a difference between the two.

    You see V/W had the sense to move with the times.

    Not too many 1981 Golf's running around is there ???


  • #39
    Russh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 490 ✭✭Russh


    It's great to see these improvements for the IO....Well done....Those levels are coming in at just the right time...

    As I saw it last year the avg stack with roughly 66 players left was approx. 15big blinds...(horrible)

    Why not run a 75 min clock from the beginning.....


  • #40
    roleynoley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 111 ✭✭roleynoley


    There are games in Ireland that start with 15k or more chips and they quickly descend into a crapshoot
    Thats bull****!!+


  • #41
    kakak1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,612 ✭✭✭kakak1


    BigCityBanker wrote: »
    your missing the point completely.

    Would you care to explain it to me then.




    This is a little like "they are all out of step except my Johnny"


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  • #42
    BigCityBanker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,751 ✭✭✭BigCityBanker


    Russh wrote: »
    It's great to see these improvements for the IO....Well done....Those levels are coming in at just the right time...

    As I saw it last year the avg stack with roughly 66 players left was approx. 15big blinds...(horrible)

    Why not run a 75 min clock from the beginning.....

    Chris,

    The avg stack at the bubble of a tournament is not a fair reflection of any tournament. This the most serious inflection point in the tournament and given the number of players the avg stack will always go south and correct itself quickly in the level afterwards as all the shorties and hangers on push their short stacks - the starting stack will not change this. (if it was like the wsop where 700 players were trying to burst the bubble then the effect of the inflection point is not as severe)


  • #43
    roleynoley
    Closed Accounts Posts: 111 ✭✭roleynoley


    sickpuppy wrote: »
    10k with that clock is plenty of chips no harm in playing a few fcuking pots instead of waiting for kk aa for 12 hours.
    There comes a time tournament when you have too gamble

    last 10k chip event i played in galway was card dead for day 1 1010 being my best cards and i still had average stack having 5k extra chips wouldnt have made a differnece
    Yore a rock!!!:))


  • #44
    Russh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 490 ✭✭Russh


    BigCityBanker wrote: »
    Chris,

    The avg stack at the bubble of a tournament is not a fair reflection of any tournament. This the most serious inflection point in the tournament and given the number of players the avg stack will always go south and correct itself quickly in the level afterwards as all the shorties and hangers on push their short stacks - the starting stack will not change this. (if it was like the wsop where 700 players were trying to burst the bubble then the effect of the inflection point is not as severe)

    Dont' mention bubbles to me...!:(


  • #45
    BigCityBanker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,751 ✭✭✭BigCityBanker


    Russh wrote: »
    Dont' mention bubbles to me...!:(

    sorry Chris :)


  • #46
    hf4z6sqo7vjngi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,454 ✭✭✭hf4z6sqo7vjngi


    Glad to see some improvements coming through and it should help towards the business end of things.
    I too am in the 15k/20k starting stack camp but I think it is more to do with punters being accustomed to bigger starting stacks and to some extent we have been spoilt with the tournament structures in Ireland over the last few years.
    If you look at the annual tourneys at the €500 €1000 buyin level such as The Irish Masters, Deepstack, Macau, IPC and Killarney all these tourneys provide better structures than the IO provides us with. Simple fact is for a €3,500 buyin into a prestigious tourney such as the IO people expect a similar if not better structure than what they are accustomed to.
    It would be great to see the starting stack increased!!


  • #47
    corkie123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,048 ✭✭✭corkie123


    robinblinds wrote: »
    The real crux of this issue is that the tournament has been alive since 1981 and therefore it is VERY difficult to change things that have been around and set in stone for a long time.

    Please remember that other tournaments can be changed at the drop of a hat...a few hours notice in some cases.

    This is an institutional tournament and its very being means it is very hard to change it, even though we all want it to change and improve for the better.

    Dave (kakak1), believe me, the amount of work that has been done and will continue to be done on this is huge and never ending.

    Maybe we need to somehow communicate this to the to the paying players a bit better.

    My two cents is (as a player, if I was allowed to play in the event) that I would rather the IO 2010 structure to the new IWF structure.

    the wsop is a institutional tournement and they changed not one but twice in the last few years there structures to stop them becoming crap shoots 10k starting stacks for MAJOR TOURIES ARE LONG GONE get with it paddy powers and give your punters what they are asking for its called VALUE FOR THERE MONEY .


  • #48
    max_power
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,083 ✭✭✭max_power


    Yeah fair enough if they have whatever reasons for not wanting to make it a 15/20k starting stack, but using the fact that it's an "institutional tournament" for not changing the starting stack is a major cop out imo. It's not as if people would be outraged with the break in "tradition".


  • #49
    Ollieboy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,070 ✭✭✭Ollieboy


    Massive improvement as the extra levels will make a big difference at a key time of the tourney, the extra 15 mins is great but it really should be from the start as this is where the skillful players benefit when deeper stack.

    I think a 10k stack is a massive mistake, the extra levels and time will give more play, but a extra 5k for each player will give a lot more chips in play at the bubble stages all the way to the final table.

    I'm not really sure why Noel post this structure as he knew what sort of feedback he was going to get before posting it and how this forum was going to re-act.

    In comparision to the IWF I always rather a longer clock.

    I'm hoping this is the start of changes to the IO and in 2011 we'll see a 15k stack with a 20k in 2012. If that was the case I would be delight with the above changes and the direction that PPP and partners are taken the IO.


  • #50
    The_Chopper
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,049 ✭✭✭The_Chopper


    Guys I echo what you're saying about the larger starting stack.

    However read between the lines about what Noel is saying


  • #51
    pgodkin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 650 ✭✭✭pgodkin


    Noel, please put startin stacks at a 100k this year and 20 min blind levels!!, simple given the fact that people dont understand tournies at all from what i can see!


    great work lads will work hard on playin this year

    Edit: please everyone stop shouting at PP and Noel hayes they have fck all power to change the IO really, dont forget there only payin for the event its the merrion that owns the rights to the IO


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  • #52
    BloodyDeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 119 ✭✭BloodyDeath


    pgodkin wrote: »
    Noel, please put startin stacks at a 100k this year and 20 min blind levels!!, simple given the fact that people dont understand tournies at all from what i can see!


    great work lads will work hard on playin this year

    funny as fook


  • #53
    kakak1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,612 ✭✭✭kakak1


    pgodkin wrote: »
    Noel, please put startin stacks at a 100k this year and 20 min blind levels!!, simple given the fact that people dont understand tournies at all from what i can see!


    great work lads will work hard on playin this year

    Edit: please everyone stop shouting at PP and Noel hayes they have fck all power to change the IO really, dont forget there only payin for the event its the merrion that owns the rights to the IO

    Oh sh1t, my apologies, myself & most here on boards together with EPT & WSOP organisers & most other main event operators don't understand tournaments. PP & Philip know it fcuking all.

    So the sponsor has no power so no say in the running of this event............ God I never knew that..................thanks for informing me. I'm starting to feel sorry now for all I said about PPP.

    Oh and Philip when are you going back to whatever planet you live on cos you certainly don't live in the real world............. such utter sh1te you talk


  • #54
    mormank
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,769 ✭✭✭mormank


    never played the IO and probably never will but fair play for the structure changes. will improve the tournie. and remember guys, Rome wasnt built in a day. sometimes these changes will take longer.

    also why do you suppose the starting stacks have gone up in major tournies in the past few years? why not before? poker has been around alot longer than since moneymaker won the main event. players werent complaining about starting stacks years ago..(or maybe they were, i dont know actualy)


  • #55
    corkie123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,048 ✭✭✭corkie123


    pgodkin wrote: »
    Noel, please put startin stacks at a 100k this year and 20 min blind levels!!, simple given the fact that people dont understand tournies at all from what i can see!


    great work lads will work hard on playin this year

    Edit: please everyone stop shouting at PP and Noel hayes they have fck all power to change the IO really, dont forget there only payin for the event its the merrion that owns the rights to the IO

    own what rights merrion still trading is it ? dont think there any copy right to the irish open ?

    could be wrong but i think who ever bankrolls the irish open could call the shots as well


  • #56
    mdwexford
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,303 ✭✭✭✭mdwexford


    robinblinds wrote: »
    The real crux of this issue is that the tournament has been alive since 1981 and therefore it is VERY difficult to change things that have been around and set in stone for a long time.

    Please remember that other tournaments can be changed at the drop of a hat...a few hours notice in some cases.

    This is an institutional tournament and its very being means it is very hard to change it, even though we all want it to change and improve for the better.

    I dont understand how the history of the tournament thing is an issue, surely roll with the times etc and when whoever's in charge looks at the WSOP and EPT tournaments and sees how they are changing their structures for the better they would follow suit no??

    I think its close between this structure and the winter festival one as to which is better, think this just shades it though imo.


  • #57
    D.C.C
    Closed Accounts Posts: 72 ✭✭D.C.C


    Noel,
    I think it's a huge improvement and refreshing to see that you have got the levels added and time was the only issue at hand...
    People who say they would prefer 15k and a 60 min clock just don't understand how to construct a tournament....And the same as always players think they know better.Now i wasn't a big fan of the Irish Open having worked at it and played it,but with these improvements the IO finally has come in line with some of the biggest European tournaments.

    Well done Noel and to be honest i don't think you have to come on here and justify something that most poker players can't even understand.


  • #58
    Jayminator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,071 ✭✭✭Jayminator


    Increased stack would be better but we have all played 10k tourneys for years and delighted to do so. I would prefer the higher starting stack and its obvious that Noel will show this thread to the powers that be so hopefully they too might see the light. I dont think Noel is disagreeing with an increased starting stack.


  • #59
    pgodkin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 650 ✭✭✭pgodkin


    corkie123 wrote: »
    own what rights merrion still trading is it ? dont think there any copy right to the irish open ?

    could be wrong but i think who ever bankrolls the irish open could call the shots as well

    no, i think it could be the full tilt irish open in 2011, although dont know how long PP has the contract to sponsor the IO


  • #60
    tm2204
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 991 ✭✭✭tm2204


    This new structure with a 15k starting stack would be a perfect IO ME tournament IMO.

    Maybe too much to ask for in 1 year (although I don't really see why) but possibly we might see this structure & a 15k starting stack next year.

    The Premier League of Irish tournies should really have a structure to match and not have people complaining about it IMO.


    :D


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  • #61
    CHD
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,956 ✭✭✭CHD


    Any chance of a 2k earlybird


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