Do you have to give a Garda your date of birth if asked?

Shield · 07-07-2009 09:53PM

Bond-007 wrote: »

The fact that it is not enshrined in statute law, people will use it to their advantage to cause mischief.

...which in turn gives Gardai reasonable grounds to suspect the person might not be the person they claim to be.

All Gardai are trying to do is establish to their satisfaction who the person is they are talking to. People forget they can be detained if the Garda has reasonable grounds to suspect the person is lying about their identity... and that's all that's needed to detain the person - reasonable grounds.

So, knowing this, what reasonable person wouldn't give a Garda their details on request? If the person is causing mischief, there's reasonable grounds right there IMHO.

Our man in Havana · 07-07-2009 09:58PM

..which in turn gives Gardai reasonable grounds to suspect the person might not be the person they claim to be.

All Gardai are trying to do is establish to their satisfaction who the person is they are talking to. People forget they can be detained if the Garda has reasonable grounds to suspect the person is lying about their identity... and that's all that's needed to detain the person - reasonable grounds.

So, knowing this, what reasonable person wouldn't give a Garda their details on request? If the person is causing mischief, there's reasonable grounds right there IMHO.

I agree totally with you.

There are too many smart arses out there that think they can get one over on the police.

brazilicious · 08-07-2009 12:43AM

donvito99 wrote: »

i do not understand peoples atitudes towards this matter.

Give them your date of birth.

do you think they would take it badly if one responded :

" id rather not... but how would you like my phone number instead?"

Hooch · 08-07-2009 02:21AM

brazilicious wrote: »

do you think they would take it badly if one responded :

" id rather not... but how would you like my phone number instead?"

That would depend on three things.....

A. Your female

B. Your good looking

C. Your female

:pac::D:pac::D:pac::D:pac:

seanybiker · 08-07-2009 02:27AM

15/3/83

Lads its only a DOB. Why would ya not give it to the guards if they ask. It only takes two seconds to say it.
Ah jaysus the guards are outside me house now because I gave out me DOB. tut tut

Ruen · 14-07-2009 05:27AM

Check out this citizens information site http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/justice/arrests/questioning_and_surveillance if you're unsure about anything raised here it might clarify things for you regarding Garda powers to demand certain details.

It doesnt mention any power to demand DOB so it seems to be personal choice if you want to give that to them or not. Name and address is a different thing and they have the power to demand them details if you are suspected of having committed an offence or under certain statutory powers within road traffic act for instance.
Personally I'd just give my details, but it is important that people who arent suspected of anything can refuse and not co operate if they so wish, some posters here should respect that freedom even if it's being exercised just for the sake of it....nobody needs a reason or an excuse to exercise a right.

source · 14-07-2009 07:12AM

true nobody needs a reason, but if you've been stopped by a member of AGS then the member probably believes you've been involved in some form of wrongdoing, by refusing to give a basic detail like your dob, even if the Gardai don't have a statutory power to demand it, only raises the members suspicion.

The only reason that a Garda asks for DOB is because in this country there are probably thousands of people with the same name, but probably only one or 2 with the same dob.

Lets for example say that Gardai are looking for a Joe bloggs, DOB 1/1/80, and you rock up to a checkpoint and are asked for your name, you give Joe Bloggs, and refuse to give your DOB, put yourself in that garda#s shoes.
what is the member going to think?

Our man in Havana · 14-07-2009 09:44AM

The member can make a lawful demand for a driving licence which contains the required info.

TheNog · 14-07-2009 06:19PM

Bond-007 wrote: »

The member can make a lawful demand for a driving licence which contains the required info.

Foinse's post is relevant when a driving licence cannot be produced at the roadside which does happen quite a bit. Obviously if a licence was produced then there would be no need to ask for DOB.

So with no licence to look at we are back to the same question, Which Joe Bloggs are you?

Our man in Havana · 14-07-2009 09:41PM

I forgot about when they have no licence or no id.
I am sure there are powers of arrest to ascertain identity?

brazilicious · 14-07-2009 10:54PM

nice guy always wrote: »

That would depend on three things.....

A. Your female

B. Your good looking

C. Your female

:pac::D:pac::D:pac::D:pac:

in the right light i can tick at least two of those boxes....

:D

im goin out gettin me a summons tonight :P

Ruen · 15-07-2009 10:30AM

foinse wrote: »

true nobody needs a reason, but if you've been stopped by a member of AGS then the member probably believes you've been involved in some form of wrongdoing, by refusing to give a basic detail like your dob, even if the Gardai don't have a statutory power to demand it, only raises the members suspicion.

They can stop people without having a particular reason, like you're generally acting suspicious in area with a lot of crime, which is not an offence by the way so in those circumstances a person can give their name and address and just walk off, they dont have to answer any other questions like DOB or personal info like where are they going to or coming from, the Guard has no right to detain them in those cases so they can have their raised suspicions all they like but free citizen is going about their business.
You can be arrested if you are suspected of having committed an offence though which is a different situation, the Guard would have to know of an offence that was committed and then suspect you.

TheNog wrote: »

Foinse's post is relevant when a driving licence cannot be produced at the roadside which does happen quite a bit. Obviously if a licence was produced then there would be no need to ask for DOB.

So with no licence to look at we are back to the same question, Which Joe Bloggs are you?

When you're just stopping someone walking on the street though because they're acting suspiciously for instance you're still only entitled to ask for their name and address, anything further than that they dont have to answer and can just walk away, so if thats not sufficient information needed by a Guard then that's an issue for them.
Anyway I doubt if you suspect this "Joe Bloggs b.01/01/1970" of having committed an offence then all the guy has to do is tell you some random DOB and you let him away.

It would be great for Gardai if everyone had to carry photo I.D. cards like some mainland European countries wouldnt it

snubbleste · 25-07-2010 07:43AM

I had an opportunity to check this out recently when winningly selected on a street. I was asked for my name and address and then dob. Gave name and address, asked if i was required to give my dob and i was told 'yes you are' by the first garda and 'yes' by the second garda.

Has anything changed in the last year to allow this?

Shield · 25-07-2010 07:56AM

snubbleste wrote: »

I had an opportunity to check this out recently when winningly selected on a street. I was asked for my name and address and then dob. Gave name and address, asked if i was required to give my dob and i was told 'yes you are' by the first garda and 'yes' by the second garda.

Has anything changed in the last year to allow this?

I don't believe so, but it's really unusual for Gardai to randomly select someone on a street, so I do believe you were entitled to ask them why you won the experience.

MagicSean · 25-07-2010 12:05PM

This kind of attitude really annoys me. Everyone at some stage will require the help of the Gardaí or their family will. Everyone wants the Gardaí to stop crime and make the streets cleaner but they expect us to have some kind of psychic powers to identify criminals on sight. Then when they get asked their name they hop on their high horse and qoute their rights. I've never seen someone randomly selected for identifuying. There is always a reason. It could be where you are, who you are with, or even the way you are acting. You mightn'e realise but their are certain things you could be doing that raise red flags for us. It might even be that you looks similar to someone who has committed a crime near by.

In answer to the ops question. You are not required by legislation to provide your date of birth but remember that Gardaí have a power to arrest you if they have demanded your name and address and are not completely satisfied with the details you have given. If you were to refuse to give me your d.o.b. or provide me with some form of i.d. to cooberate the name you have given I would most likely arrest you in order to confirm your identity. <mod snip> You may think you are being smart but you are really just raising suspicion about who you are.

Also, lets not forget the fact that there is every possibility that someone of the same name in your area has a warrant for them. Warrants are issued quite frequently in courts and if your name is the same as that and the warrant and you won't differentiate your identity you could find yourself spending a night in a cell.

bravestar · 25-07-2010 11:48PM

Ruen wrote: »

They can stop people without having a particular reason, like you're generally acting suspicious in area with a lot of crime, which is not an offence by the way so in those circumstances a person can give their name and address and just walk off, they dont have to answer any other questions like DOB or personal info like where are they going to or coming from, the Guard has no right to detain them in those cases so they can have their raised suspicions all they like but free citizen is going about their business. You can be arrested if you are suspected of having committed an offence though which is a different situation, the Guard would have to know of an offence that was committed and then suspect you.

When you're just stopping someone walking on the street though because they're acting suspiciously for instance you're still only entitled to ask for their name and address, anything further than that they dont have to answer and can just walk away, so if thats not sufficient information needed by a Guard then that's an issue for them.
Anyway I doubt if you suspect this "Joe Bloggs b.01/01/1970" of having committed an offence then all the guy has to do is tell you some random DOB and you let him away.

It would be great for Gardai if everyone had to carry photo I.D. cards like some mainland European countries wouldnt it

An issue for the Guards? Section 30(1) of The Offences Against the State Act makes it an issue for you very easily.

Yes it would be great if everyone had to carry photo I.D.

Shield · 26-07-2010 02:11AM

I think we can safely close this one off now. The OP's question was answered several times, and a number of instances have been provided to help clarify.

Thread closed.

Do you have to give a Garda your date of birth if asked?

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