excercising chest and arms ???????

Fatloss08 · 10-02-2009 04:51PM #1

hey im in the gym 5 days a week , 45 mins intense cardio and weights after it ( feels better for me than weights first )

i wanna know , for somebody wanting to lose weigh/fat how much should you do on say ur chest ???? im doing 3 x 10 bench press and 3 x 10 incline press

i mean that takes 10 mins , surely u need to more on chest ???

just dont know how much i need to be doing on each muscle

AARRRGH · 10-02-2009 05:58PM

The thing about lifting weight is it has to be heavy and you have to eventually be unable to lift it.

I do 3 x 6. On the 6th rep I will be nearly killing myself to lift it.

So it's not about time, but rather how much your muscles have to struggle to lift the weight.

r3nu4l · 10-02-2009 06:01PM

AARRRGH wrote: »

So it's not about time, but rather how much your muscles have to struggle to lift the weight.

Doesn't this depend on your goal though? If you want to build muscle then heavy weight is the way to go but if it's part of a fat loss routine shouldn't it be 3 x 12-15 of a lighter weight done with little or no rest as part of a circuit of exercises?

Just asking.

AARRRGH · 10-02-2009 06:11PM

It's possible, my advice here is only whatever works for me.

I don't do any cardio (well, I walk to work - 30 minutes of speed walk) and I eat 4000 or so calories per day, but my heavy lifting seems to expand enough energy to keep me slim.

I don't really take any breaks between exercises though. That could be a factor. For example, after I've worked my back I immediately work my chest.

madmik · 10-02-2009 06:13PM

r3nu4l wrote: »

Doesn't this depend on your goal though? If you want to build muscle then heavy weight is the way to go but if it's part of a fat loss routine shouldn't it be 3 x 12-15 of a lighter weight done with little or no rest as part of a circuit of exercises?

Just asking.

increased muscle mass will burn fat too

cardio style hi-rep lifting is not the only way

rubadub · 10-02-2009 06:18PM

AARRRGH wrote: »

The thing about lifting weight is it has to be heavy and you have to eventually be unable to lift it.

Yes, and doing cardio before the weights will wear you out, so you will not be able to lift to your fullest ability. So you do less work on the muscles resulting in less growth in size & strength.

Your cardio probably feels better since you are full of energy. But you would be better off weights first, then most of the energy in your muscles will have been used up doing weights, and I think you are then more prone to burn fat doing the cardio afterwards.

r3nu4l · 10-02-2009 06:19PM

madmik wrote: »

increased muscle mass will burn fat too

cardio style hi-rep lifting is not the only way

I'm aware of that but as mad as it sounds a lot of guys do not want to add a lot of muscle mass but instead just want to burn fat while making small strength gains.

AARRRGH · 10-02-2009 06:21PM

r3nu4l wrote: »

I'm aware of that but as mad as it sounds a lot of guys do not want to add a lot of muscle mass but instead just want to burn fat while making small strength gains.

Well you could lift heavy weights and have a low protein diet. That way your muscles won't grow very big.

celestial · 10-02-2009 06:41PM

Fatloss08 wrote: »

hey im in the gym 5 days a week , 45 mins intense cardio and weights after it ( feels better for me than weights first )

i wanna know , for somebody wanting to lose weigh/fat how much should you do on say ur chest ???? im doing 3 x 10 bench press and 3 x 10 incline press

i mean that takes 10 mins , surely u need to more on chest ???

just dont know how much i need to be doing on each muscle

The real questions to ask first of all are-

Are you making progress with your current routine?
Do your clothes fit better/are you losing fat?
What are your goals?
How often do you train upper body?

Keeping it simple, you need to up the intensity on a regular basis and mix things up frequently.

madmik · 10-02-2009 06:51PM

heavy lifting without a surplus of calories will make you gain strength but not bulk

BobbyOLeary · 10-02-2009 07:39PM

heavy lifting without a surplus of calories will make you gain strength but not bulk

No. This will make you tired as hell, sore and more than likely pissed off at your workout.

aye · 10-02-2009 08:37PM

r3nu4l wrote: »

Doesn't this depend on your goal though? If you want to build muscle then heavy weight is the way to go but if it's part of a fat loss routine shouldn't it be 3 x 12-15 of a lighter weight done with little or no rest as part of a circuit of exercises?

Just asking.

the rep range 12-15 is used to build muscle endurance, much like prolonged cardio build endurance. this uses slow twitch muscle fibers, common in endurance athletes.

the lower rep range, 2-6 reps is to build strength, and 6-12 is for hypertrophy (muscle mass), mostly using fast twitch muscle fibers, common in power atheltes.

you muscle fiber type is largely genetic.

the 12-15 rep range is used a a fat burning tool, as it is considered more endurance based, muscle like endurance cardio is used as a fat burning tool.

Either way building muscle mass, which wil increase your metabolism and help burn fat, but some rep ranges suit other persons better, depending on their fiber type.

Hanley · 10-02-2009 11:21PM

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

No. This will make you tired as hell, sore and more than likely pissed off at your workout.

Lol... that's what I was thinking. Don't know many people getting strong on a calorie deficit like.

I would say that if you're worried about adding in another chest exercise being the key to your fat loss, you're waaaaay off the mark.

I dunno how you're doing all that work in 10 minutes either. I would guess you're fairly inexperienced. As you progress and become more neurologically (sp) efficient, there's no way you'll do 6 sets of a near all out set of 10 in one workout, never mind 10 minutes.

celestial · 11-02-2009 12:52AM

I'd like to see what progress you're making OP. My guess is that you may not be putting in the work to see the results you want to see, and you are looking at irrelevant details like chest workout sequences/plans, number of reps etc as a way of distracting yourself from this.

Transform · 11-02-2009 11:34AM

Fatloss08 wrote: »

hey im in the gym 5 days a week , 45 mins intense cardio and weights after it ( feels better for me than weights first )

i wanna know , for somebody wanting to lose weigh/fat how much should you do on say ur chest ???? im doing 3 x 10 bench press and 3 x 10 incline press

i mean that takes 10 mins , surely u need to more on chest ???

just dont know how much i need to be doing on each muscle

Man i pm you on this before - at your current level just move between a back and chest or chest and leg exercise for 10mins NOT do a set rest do a set rest.

Put up your stats if you like.

You can't flex fat so doing more chest exercises is not the answer and when you get your weight under 200lbs THEN you can focus on refining the specifics of the program.

If its weight loss your concerned about then keep on track with diet and stop thinking about specific muscles and more the body in general.

What leg exercises are you doing, how much rest are you taking between sets, what are you currently benching, chinning/rows.

In 10mins i have clients doing 6-7sets of bench/push ups and lunges/step ups (virtually no rest between exercises)- reps do not matter half as much as intensity, if your not sweating then its not working.

Sorry to be so direct but the coffee i drank earlier is making me jittery - back to work now

Fatloss08 · 11-02-2009 05:07PM

im probably resting 30 secs between sets

im not doing any leg work at the min , as i do my cardio first and i feel thats working the legs , i dont want big legs etc

i go in , few stretches , then high intense bike level 12 around 95-100 rpm constant for 30 mins then , walk , jog for 10 mins treadmill and then do weights

kevpants · 11-02-2009 05:24PM

Fatloss08 wrote: »

im not doing any leg work at the min , as i do my cardio first and i feel thats working the legs , i dont want big legs etc

*Anger...Rising

You're getting free advice from Transform who should really be charging you per letter and you're disregarding it, choosing to believe the old wives tale about getting big legs.

Trust me, I'd love big legs, I know what it takes to get them and with your approach I doubt you'll accidentally end up with them.

God I could just rant on here but I won't. Just to say your problem clearly isn't with sets or reps. My theory is you love the idea of losing weight and researching it, but by god do you not want to actually do it.

Ok I did rant just a little bit.

the drifter · 11-02-2009 05:48PM

why oh why are people scared of leg work....

ill tell you what go do a 5 week 5x5 squat program and i bet you that you burn off more than 30 mins on a statci bike

also have you seen transform the guys ripped to s*hit listen to the man!!

BobbyOLeary · 11-02-2009 05:50PM

why oh why are people scared of leg work....

Because its hard. Unlike eating cheeseburgers.

celestial · 11-02-2009 05:53PM

kevpants wrote: »

*Anger...Rising

You're getting free advice from Transform who should really be charging you per letter and you're disregarding it, choosing to believe the old wives tale about getting big legs.

Trust me, I'd love big legs, I know what it takes to get them and with your approach I doubt you'll accidentally end up with them.

God I could just rant on here but I won't. Just to say your problem clearly isn't with sets or reps. My theory is you love the idea of losing weight and researching it, but by god do you not want to actually do it.

Ok I did rant just a little bit.

Yep as I said when you want a distraction from the fact that you're not doing what you should be doing then you go off an over-think things and spend your time researching and asking irrelevant questions instead.

nice_guy80 · 11-02-2009 06:30PM

info.

I've been squatting and deadlifting and lunging and all the machines stuff as well for 4 months now and I can tell you that there isn't much difference in the size of my legs. I mean i still fit into trousers and shorts and jocks...

just that i'm way stronger and feek way better

Hanley · 11-02-2009 07:54PM

Lol I love it....

Building big legs is easy. But losing fat's hard.

davyjose · 11-02-2009 09:45PM

Fatloss08 wrote: »

i dont want big legs etc ... then high intense bike level 12 around 95-100 rpm constant for 30 mins

Stay off the bike so... just in case :rolleyes:

delllat · 12-02-2009 02:10AM

BobbyOLeary wrote: »

No. This will make you tired as hell, sore and more than likely pissed off at your workout.

so u suggest what?

lifting weights that arent heavy enough to challenge the muscles??

delllat · 12-02-2009 02:15AM

Hanley wrote: »

Lol... that's what I was thinking. Don't know many people getting strong on a calorie deficit like.

I would say that if you're worried about adding in another chest exercise being the key to your fat loss, you're waaaaay off the mark.

I dunno how you're doing all that work in 10 minutes either. I would guess you're fairly inexperienced. As you progress and become more neurologically (sp) efficient, there's no way you'll do 6 sets of a near all out set of 10 in one workout, never mind 10 minutes.

lads,lads,lads

theres a big differnce in a excess of calories and a calorie deficit

it is possible to eat "maintainance" calories that will keep you at your current weight

its also possible to increase strength without getting heavier ,growing new muscle is only 1 way to increse strength

Hanley · 12-02-2009 09:05AM

delllat wrote: »

lads,lads,lads

theres a big differnce in a excess of calories and a calorie deficit

it is possible to eat "maintainance" calories that will keep you at your current weight

its also possible to increase strength without getting heavier ,growing new muscle is only 1 way to increse strength

Have you not realised the purpose of this thread is so the OP can talk about LOSING weight?

Transform · 12-02-2009 11:18AM

Fatloss08 wrote: »

im probably resting 30 secs between sets

im not doing any leg work at the min , as i do my cardio first and i feel thats working the legs , i dont want big legs etc

i go in , few stretches , then high intense bike level 12 around 95-100 rpm constant for 30 mins then , walk , jog for 10 mins treadmill and then do weights

Its really simple - your putting a priority on a secondary activity (aerobic exercise) rather than a primary activity - weight training.

1st - do weights. When doing weights do body weight squats/lunges followed by bench press (15reps on both) for 5-6 sets with little recovery between. The pair up 3 other pairings e.g. lat pulldown and seated leg curls, biceps curls and weighted crunches, plank position for 30secs and standing dumbbell overhead press. All do not require a lot of excessive weight so do the work as stated or keep searching for the 'secret' that no one is going to provide here.

2nd - do intervals - doing the bike at the same level for 30mins is NOT high intensity as high intensity is doing any activity for no more than 30-60secs.

3rd - ANY OTHER REMAINING TIME YOU HAVE LEFT IN THE WEEK DO LIGHT AEROBIC EXERCISE

rubadub · 12-02-2009 12:14PM

delllat wrote: »

it is possible to eat "maintainance" calories that will keep you at your current weight

+1

Hanley wrote: »

Have you not realised the purpose of this thread is so the OP can talk about LOSING weight?

Well the OP said...

Fatloss08 wrote: »

i wanna know , for somebody wanting to lose weigh/fat

And his name is even fatloss! I think we all know most want to be just look thinner, only competitive sportsmen in weight classes are overly worried about their weight. It would not bother me much if I put on 1 stone tomorrow yet looked the exact same. Most are equating looks with weight, which is understandable.

delllat wrote: »

its also possible to increase strength without getting heavier ,growing new muscle is only 1 way to increse strength

I have done so and got thinner all the time. I remember a girl in work saying I had lost loads of weight in the last 6 months, and was bewildered when I told here I had actually put weight on!

Gaining muscle on a calorie deficit is very hard to do, so there will not be much growth, but keeping and maintaining the muscle you do have will lead to more fat loss. No point losing all the fat to reveal a malnourished looking body underneath.

delllat · 12-02-2009 02:06PM

Hanley wrote: »

Have you not realised the purpose of this thread is so the OP can talk about LOSING weight?

He can LOSE or maintain weight and still increase strength and body composition through adjustment of diet and training

two men each weighing 90kg men could have very differnt body compositions

its not all about the number on the scale...:rolleyes:

BobbyOLeary · 12-02-2009 02:41PM

delllat wrote: »

so u suggest what?

lifting weights that arent heavy enough to challenge the muscles??

Now where did I suggest that exactly?

I was responding to

heavy lifting without a surplus of calories will make you gain strength but not bulk

Which isn't true and will just lead to you becoming, and I quote

tired as hell, sore and more than likely pissed off at your workout

If you've got a way for me to get stronger without having to eat as much do tell me, it's a recession after all and I could do with saving money somewhere.

TKD SC · 12-02-2009 02:55PM

delllat wrote: »

He can LOSE or maintain weight and still increase strength and body composition through adjustment of diet and training

two men each weighing 90kg men could have very differnt body compositions

its not all about the number on the scale...:rolleyes:

Yeh Hanley, Don't you know anything!!

excercising chest and arms ???????

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