Student Protests

Wagon · 22-01-2009 05:06PM

neil_hosey wrote: »

SAs i mentioned in my previous post, cuts can be made in the colleges ie.. rediculously high paid profs, badly run admin departments (experienced this first hand) etc..

Yeah. Professers getting paid nearly 100 euro an hour in some places. Work 22 hours a week and they make more than I do in a month. Doesn't mean that they're any good at what they do either. Administration was an absolute shambles where I was too.

Biggins · 22-01-2009 05:11PM

Mark200 wrote: »

I'd actually agree with that. Although...I'm not sure how feasible that idea actually is, for example checking to make sure people actually did do this and not just forge a signature or something.

But yeah, if it was possible to bring in a system like that I think it'd be a good idea. I've never done charity work before, but I'd like to and that would give me motivation.

As well as that, people may find out they actually like it and will continue to do it after they've earned their free education.

I don't know if you actually meant your idea to be taken seriously, but yeah...I like it.

Yep, I meant it as a possible serious suggestion. Just an idea but it would also have the benefit of showing to others that there is not just "Lazy students".

The American military offerers a similar service/benefit. Well as we don't have need for a huge army as such, the same principle idea behind such benefits to students, could still apply.
Free college courses (or cheaper costing ones) in return for civic duty.
In these days of economic tightness, it's just a suggestion to think over...

brianthebard · 22-01-2009 05:12PM

Free fees benefit most the people that can afford to pay fees. If fees are re-introduced they are only going to be taken from wealthy families. I don't care.

neil_hosey · 22-01-2009 05:13PM

Wagon wrote: »

Yeah. Professers getting paid nearly 100 euro an hour in some places. Work 22 hours a week and they make more than I do in a month. Doesn't mean that they're any good at what they do either. Administration was an absolute shambles where I was too.

100 grand?? try double that and add some and you get what some of the higher paid ones in the universities are on, its a disgrace. I had one aswell in my final year, possibly the worst lecturer in my four years at uni.. Made me sick when i seen him on TV about how much money he aws getting.

asdasd · 22-01-2009 05:15PM

Also, I'll never forget being told I couldn't fly a red and black flag on the last march as the issue "Wasn't political"

maybe your co-protesters thought that people who are anarchist and therefore opposed to the very existance of the State, shouldn't be demading more funds from the State.

Nothing more ridiculous than the middle class anarchists, and/or socialists demading more money for privileged students which must come from people who dont go.

brianthebard · 22-01-2009 05:15PM

PrivateEye wrote: »

I'll be there as I was at the last one, but I think the USI protests are a joke. Fine Gael and Labour being given the platform to speak? When were they friends of the student movement, students were often protesting moves by LP/FG governments in the past remember.

The last Lab/FG government introduced free fees.

Mark200 · 22-01-2009 05:15PM

brianthebard wrote: »

Free fees benefit most the people that can afford to pay fees. If fees are re-introduced they are only going to be taken from wealthy families. I don't care.

And then it comes down to parents who don't want to pay for their son or daughters education. Or parents who have many children.

Snowie · 22-01-2009 05:16PM

neil_hosey wrote: »

So what if the UK dont pay fees??? whats that got to do with us? Im guessing that you never had the benefit of gng to college and not having a massive 30000 grand loan on your back when you leave, or maybe your just bitter about the fact that you have to pay now, instead of availing of it when you were young (not trying to be smart, but dont understand your motives for saying that). There is enough personal debt in this country, we dont need anymore.

If the point your trying to make is that we need to make cuts, I agree, but we shouldnt be putting that blame on students who already have higher rent, costs of living and college expenses (other than fees) than most Uni's and Colleges in the UK (id assume )

As i mentioned in my previous post, cuts can be made in the colleges ie.. rediculously high paid profs, badly run admin departments (experienced this first hand) etc..

I dont care about if i have to pay to go back to collage its something i can except happilly.... My point being if other countrys have to do it why shouldnt ireland ? whats makes us so spechil... The world does not O any one a living, so why the hell should the public have to pay for student's.. It looks like this is the only way collages will be able to support them selves and i dont think its such a bad thing eather.... Like you say admin will book up ideas and people who pretend that they actuly do something will find them selves like me In the dole cue..... I there not showing that there working...

PrivateEye wrote: »

Went to O' Donoghues after the last one, whats the problem with that?
I've never seen some Dublin pubs as packed as they were after the Irish Ferries demo, work is the curse of the drinking classes and all that :pac:

Probably will be fcuked with a rise in the cost of going to college (working part-time at the minute, but thats up in the air obv.) but give us the odd pint for now!

and you 10 euros for 24 botels of beer in lidil will do 3 nights out...
20 quid to get into the club do what ever yother student in the past has done rub pints or my personal favourite HUSSEL your drink which can offten leave you pulling a lady

Wagon · 22-01-2009 05:17PM

Biggins wrote: »

Yep, I meant it as a possible serious suggestion. Just an idea but it would also have the benefit of showing to others that there is not just "Lazy students".

Nice idea in theory I suppose, but each course is different. Not all students are Art students and have to go in before 12pm. Also, many work part time. And we had to study a bit too. We had to get our few scoops in at the weekends to, but you can't deny a man his pint whether he's 18 or 80

Stercus Accidit · 22-01-2009 05:18PM

Simple fact, this will hit the less fortunate worst.

Do you want colleges to contain only posh spoilt lazy brats?

Do you want these people to be your boss?

Or do you want people from harder backgrounds (even the lower middle classes may find it a strain) to have the opportunity to compete with the privileged elite, raising the bar and getting a more diverse selection of hard working people.

Or is it a case of know your place, born working class die working class, and be glad that your wonderful yuppy boss had the money to go to college.

Nonsense, we may as well cut back on water supply, medicine, electricity and all go back to banging rocks together and dying off in famines.

Will do this country the world of good, might thin the herd of useless bastards we have now.

brianthebard · 22-01-2009 05:22PM

Mark200 wrote: »

And then it comes down to parents who don't want to pay for their son or daughters education. Or parents who have many children.

Remind me again why I should feel sorry for middle class kids who's parents are rich?

Dudess · 22-01-2009 05:23PM

Stercus Accidit wrote: »

Simple fact, this will hit the less fortunate worst.

Do you want colleges to contain only posh spoilt lazy brats?

Do you want these people to be your boss?

Or do you want people from harder backgrounds (even the lower middle classes may find it a strain) to have the opportunity to compete with the privileged elite, raising the bar and getting a more diverse selection of hard working people.

Or is it a case of know your place, born working class die working class, and be glad that your wonderful yuppy boss had the money to go to college.

Well then, what about making rich people pay and poor people not pay? That's why I think fees should be brought back, just not the same amount across the board.

brianthebard · 22-01-2009 05:25PM

Dudess wrote: »

Well then, what about making rich people pay and poor people not pay? That's why I think fees should be brought back, just not the same amount across the board.

That's what was suggested last I heard, which is why its so hard for the poor rich kids to organise mass support for themselves...

Guy:Incognito · 22-01-2009 05:28PM

thelastangryman wrote: »

If fees are introduced I simply cannot afford to go to college. I work for 20 hours a week and I am in college for 35 more hours. Do you work 55 hours a week? Thats not including time spent studying.

I do want to be there. So kindly shut the **** up.

When I was in 4th-6th year in scholl I worked Thurs and Fri nights 5-10 and sat & sun full days. Some weeks I'd add another night shift or 2.

The problem now is people seem to be afraid to be away from their firends/the pub/the computer for more than 8 hours a day.

Life is hard, deal with it.

Everyone seems to admit cuts need to be made, but it's increasily based on whether it effects them or not. So when theres no cut backs in education, health, pensions, social welfare and the public sector, who exactly is left to foot the bills? Should everyoen int he private sector just kill themselves or what?

Wagon · 22-01-2009 05:34PM

Stekelly wrote: »

When I was in 4th-6th year in scholl I worked Thurs and Fri nights 5-10 and sat & sun full days. Some weeks I'd add another night shift or 2.

The problem now is people seem to be afraid to be away from their firends/the pub/the computer for more than 8 hours a day.

Life is hard, deal with it.

What year was that in? Not being sarcastic but I can't see how a school student can work nowadays. And if they can it's rare. I couldn't get a job as the bloody school discouraged it. Couldn't get a job over the summers either as I had no work experience in the first place and I was probably too young at 16 - 17 to be taken seriously.

Pen1987 · 22-01-2009 05:36PM

The free fees only benefited the middle and upper classes who could already afford to pay frees. Why do you think the Uni's and Colleges have become awash with parking problems in the last ten years? I'd bet there is not one college paper that han't run a story on the lack of parking around the institute in the lat two years. Students got loads more money to spend on cars, money they could of spent on fees. Poorer students had their grants cut - the grants that would of been funded by the fees of wealthier students.

If fees were brought back they would benefit the poorer students through better grants, if implemented correctly.

Oh *disclaimer* I'm a college student, middle class and edit a college newspaper

phasers · 22-01-2009 05:39PM

My brothers are college sudents, but they're not going because they have lectures then work. Bloody posh w*nkers who can afford to pay anyway with "down with this sort of thing" signs thinking they're brilliant protesting tbh.

Fees should be re-introduced on a means tested basis.If your parents earn over 100k a year, you pay fees.

Dudess · 22-01-2009 05:49PM

I think it should be more intricate than that - full fees for households with that kind of income (or less) and getting smaller and smaller the further down the scale you go til you reach the people who shouldn't have to pay anything - or next to nothing anyway.

I know it would be difficult to figure out where to draw the lines though.

Pen1987 · 22-01-2009 05:50PM

phasers wrote: »

My brothers are college sudents, but they're not going because they have lectures then work. Bloody posh w*nkers who can afford to pay anyway with "down with this sort of thing" signs thinking they're brilliant protesting tbh.

Fees should be re-introduced on a means tested basis.If your parents earn over 100k a year, you pay fees.

Noel Dempsey suggested that but was "protested" down.

Mingey · 22-01-2009 05:56PM

thelastangryman wrote: »

If fees are introduced I simply cannot afford to go to college. I work for 20 hours a week and I am in college for 35 more hours. Do you work 55 hours a week? Thats not including time spent studying.

I do want to be there. So kindly shut the **** up.

I work and I'm in college also. I do these things because I want to be in college too and I need to survive. I am not taking up a place in the course from some nonce who 'just wants a degree for their CV. I like my course and I am interested in what I am studying. Many of my friends were those nonces and I hate hearing them moan about wasting their time in courses they didnt like, and not using the degrees that they gained.

I agree that it should be means tested for those who simply cannot afford to go, but from what I've heard so far, most of the moaning is from those who can.

Mingey · 22-01-2009 05:59PM

Wagon wrote: »

What year was that in? Not being sarcastic but I can't see how a school student can work nowadays. And if they can it's rare. I couldn't get a job as the bloody school discouraged it. Couldn't get a job over the summers either as I had no work experience in the first place and I was probably too young at 16 - 17 to be taken seriously.

I did the same as stekelly, but that was in 1997-99

Davidius · 22-01-2009 06:01PM

4 easy steps:
1. Eliminate the bullshít in every area.
2. Take backs teh moneyz
3. ???
4. Well not profit but it's close enough

You all make it seem so complex...

Adamcp898 · 22-01-2009 06:01PM

Surely the date should have been further into February, I'm at DCU, exams on currently but lectures don't resume until the 9th of February and afaik everyone is off during the week running up to that date so most people won't be around to even go to it

Jeapy · 22-01-2009 06:30PM

There's plenty of people who fiddle the books and "can't afford" to send their kids to college and get grants. I know first hand of a family who made a lot of money in the Celtic Tiger era (new 5 bed house, holiday home, 5 star holidays to Las Vegas and other places and brand new mercedes were affordable) and 2 of their children who went to college received grants.

I know of another person who got a full grant, never went to college (well, went in for the first week in NUIG) and still collected her money every month without fail. When it came to exam time, she got a doctors cert to say she couldnt do them, so the college thought she was still attending and she got her next 5months grant cheques. This p1sses me off no end. The abuse of the system must STOP.

My parents slaved away for years to give me, my bro and sister the best education they could. It was ok beacuse fees were free so it was just accomadation etc to be paid. Im the youngest and in my final year so this doesn't affect our family at all, but if it were 6 years ago, money would have been much tighter in the house.

Money was wasted when times were hard and now the government are going to make everyone else pay for their mistakes and it's not fair.

stovelid · 22-01-2009 06:41PM

Wagon wrote: »

What year was that in? Not being sarcastic but I can't see how a school student can work nowadays. And if they can it's rare. .

Not to sound like an old cunt, but I too always had part-time jobs in school and uni. If I could get them in the late 80s - late 90s, I find it difficult to believe that it's harder to get something these days.

Having a job didn't affect my grades; it just constricted my spare time which was the price you had to pay to have some cash.

stovelid · 22-01-2009 06:44PM

Mingey wrote: »

Many of my friends were those nonces and I hate hearing them moan about wasting their time in courses they didnt like, and not using the degrees that they gainedn.

Do you go to college with Pedobear?

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 22-01-2009 06:49PM

SoWatchaWant wrote: »

I'm a student and I don't support it. Cutbacks must be made.

Where better to make them than people who should be in a position to pay back their fees when they get their better, higher paying jobs?

Plus, it'll stop alot of arsing around and people doing a course for the sake of it.

Higher paid? are you serious? A lot of people leaving college with BA's get the same as a person who just done the leaving cert. It's a load of rubbish.

What is the point in having "free education" when we have to pay for it? Every year the regristration fees go up, every single year. Student's don't exactly have a lot of money, it's hard enough without comming out of college in serious debt. Especially in the current situation, college students are leaving college and there's no work for them, they also have large loans to pay for. Loans which they took out in order to do their courses. It's a clusterfcuk if you ask me...

I do believe that the people earning a fortune, or their parents, should pay fees. It's the middle and lower classes getting screwed over as per usual. What's going to happen is families will not be able to afford to send their children to college, college and uni will be come the rich mans place. The rich will become educated. A bit extreme, but it is possible.

phasers · 22-01-2009 06:50PM

stovelid wrote: »

Not to sound like an old cunt, but I too always had part-time jobs in school and uni. If I could get them in the late 80s - late 90s, I find it difficult to believe that it's harder to get something these days.

Getting a part time job is pretty hard nowadays actually unless you know somebody who can get you one. Nepotism for the lose.

K-9 · 22-01-2009 06:51PM

Pen1987 wrote: »

The free fees only benefited the middle and upper classes who could already afford to pay frees. Why do you think the Uni's and Colleges have become awash with parking problems in the last ten years? I'd bet there is not one college paper that han't run a story on the lack of parking around the institute in the lat two years. Students got loads more money to spend on cars, money they could of spent on fees. Poorer students had their grants cut - the grants that would of been funded by the fees of wealthier students.

If fees were brought back they would benefit the poorer students through better grants, if implemented correctly.

Oh *disclaimer* I'm a college student, middle class and edit a college newspaper

Well said, it was a sop by Labour to the upper Middle classes. We couldn't afford it then and we can't afford it now.

Barristers at Tribunals getting free fees, ridiculous.

The participation rates from disadvantaged groups has not increased by much.

Dudess wrote: »

I think it should be more intricate than that - full fees for households with that kind of income (or less) and getting smaller and smaller the further down the scale you go til you reach the people who shouldn't have to pay anything - or next to nothing anyway.

I know it would be difficult to figure out where to draw the lines though.

That would be a good idea, better than an automatic cut off.

Pen1987 wrote: »

Noel Dempsey suggested that but was "protested" down.

YEP, the media outcry scared FF off.

K-9 · 22-01-2009 06:53PM

Novalee Tasteless Acrobat wrote: »

What is the point in having "free education" when we have to pay for it? Every year the regristration fees go up, every single year.

Because we can't afford free 3rd level education.

The registration fee would have to be abolished/reduced if the fees came back.

Student Protests

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