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Gay adoption

2456

Comments

  • #32
    Cato
    Closed Accounts Posts: 347 ✭✭Cato


    as i said im no psychologist, ive yet to hear any good reasons why they need to raise kids or am i not jumping on the band wagon correctly?

    Some reasons why i think it would be a bad idea? the points mention by OP also i believe a child develops its ideas of male/female relationship through its parents, i think introducing same sex parents would mess with the natural order of things and lead to psycological problems later on.i dont believe this crap that a child is born gay etc its what he/she is exposed to at mental maturity which influences this.

    hope that makes sense, dont think it really matters anyway gonna get abused by having a different opinion:rolleyes:


  • #33
    Cato
    Closed Accounts Posts: 347 ✭✭Cato


    jaffa20 wrote: »
    Then would the below reason suffice as i posted in an earlier message. Also, if the biological parent wanted to give her child to me and i was willing to accept. Shouldn't i be allowed? Or should a piece of paper decide issues relating to society and hand the baby over to a complete stranger against the mother's wishes.

    i think biological parents should have the choice, not saying its right though, you have to think about the child as well not just yourself and your want to raise it.


  • #34
    the_syco
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,308 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    Princess Innocent Knickers wrote: »
    how exactly would it affect them negatively?

    the only way I can think of is from the prejudice and bigotry of others.
    Yup. Why should the child suffer just so that the father and father feel equal to the mother and father next door?


  • #35
    Cato
    Closed Accounts Posts: 347 ✭✭Cato


    Okay then: why should same sex couples raise kids?

    1. cos they want to-i want alot of things to.
    2. cos they can-therefore they should?
    3. cos there's no reason they shouldn't (even you don't have one, cato)-already said trying to prove a negative is pointless and will never happen because its IMPOSIBLE
    4. cos there's no recipe for raising kids-no but generaly there are circumstances were it would not beneficial for a raing a kid (same sex couples) for variose reasons i mention in other post
    5. cos they're the same as any other couple-no, please same sex couple are not the same.


  • #36
    The_Minister
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,255 ✭✭✭✭The_Minister


    I used to be very against gay adoption (for the reasons cited above: bullying etc). I've actually changed my mind though.

    Firstly, gay people can already adopt. There are many children in Ireland being raised right now by gay parents. All they have to do is adopt as a single parent.
    This means that the issue isn't whether or not gay people can begin to adopt children, but whether or not gay couples can adopt. At the moment we have the very unsatisfactory situation where gay people who want to adopt are purposefully perverting the adoption system, and I would argue that for the sake of child welfare, it is important that gay people be allowed to adopt.

    I have more, but I think that that deserves its own post.


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  • #37
    Cato
    Closed Accounts Posts: 347 ✭✭Cato


    ixoy wrote: »
    So the reason they shouldn't raise kids is because they don't raise kids? What?
    kinda missed my point or i dident put it across correctly, they did not conceive or produce child and im not sure a couple who has done neither of this have the required subconscious investment to properly raise a child the "regular" way, cause lets face it you can argue until your face turns blue, its just not the same!

    ixoy wrote: »
    Is there a fundamental reason why opposite sex couples need to raise kids?
    yes there is, think about it :rolleyes:


  • #38
    the_syco
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,308 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    Cato wrote: »
    yes there is, think about it :rolleyes:
    I'm against it, but... there isn't. Kids don't catch the gayness. Think about it: gay people come from hero's, so gay's won't make hetro kids gay.


  • #39
    The_Minister
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,255 ✭✭✭✭The_Minister


    Cato wrote: »
    kinda missed my point or i dident put it across correctly, they did not conceive or produce child and im not sure a couple who has done neither of this have the required subconscious investment to properly raise a child the "regular" way, cause lets face it you can argue until your face turns blue, its just not the same!
    Surely that is an arguement against all adoption?
    And before you say it, I'm straight, so I'm not being purposefully obtuse.
    the_syco wrote: »
    I'm against it, but... there isn't. Kids don't catch the gayness. Think about it: gay people come from hero's, so gay's won't make hetro kids gay.
    No. But they may pressure them into a certain lifestyle. "Dad...Other Dad...I'm straight"


    Na. On second thought I don't really see it.


  • #40
    Cato
    Closed Accounts Posts: 347 ✭✭Cato


    the_syco wrote: »
    gay people come from hero's
    what?

    i dident say it was a disease that could be caught sigh*


  • #41
    jaffa20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,624 ✭✭✭jaffa20


    ugh i give up. I reread the above posts several times without understanding anything. I don't know if it is me or are the arguments against just repetitive and boring. Yes, the child comes first, yet they don't always come first in a heterosexual relationship with abuse, neglect etc etc. The idea of catching gayness is just ridiculous. But don't worry people in oposition, i've no intention of having kids so i won't spread my gayness :eek::eek::confused:


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  • #42
    jaffa20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,624 ✭✭✭jaffa20


    Cato wrote: »
    what?

    i dident say it was a disease that could be caught sigh*

    More or less. You said the upbringing goes against the natural order of things and it would directly affect the child's views and by being exposed to such an environment, he/she would somehow think it is normal and become gay.


  • #43
    Cato
    Closed Accounts Posts: 347 ✭✭Cato


    well thats end of it for me i have my reasons, and im not against adoption im all for couples adopting who are unable to produce a child because of some physical defect/incapability, not because they cant because are biologically incompatible, guess that makes me old school bigot? :pac: weres the nazi party application form sign me up!!!:D


  • #44
    jaffa20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,624 ✭✭✭jaffa20


    Cato wrote: »
    well thats end of it for me i have my reasons, and im not against adoption im all for couples adopting who are unable to produce a child because of some physical defect/incapability, not because they cant because are biologically incompatible, guess that makes me old school bigot? :pac: weres the nazi party application form sign me up!!!:D

    Gay males do have a physical incapability. I don't like the term biologically incompatible.


  • #45
    dr_manhattan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 650 ✭✭✭dr_manhattan


    If your mother dies and your older brother helps your da with the housework... or your father dies and your older sister helps your mother with the housework...

    That's the only major difference I see.

    Possible lack of a role model of some description - is that enough to ban half the world from adopting?

    ****, if I was in business with someone - a bloke - and neither of us married but we wanted a kid and had a stable shared environment (I'm straight by the way) -

    What would be the problem with that? ****, it beats an orphanage. Do we really only recognise marriage between a man and a woman as "stability"?


  • #46
    MagicMarker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    If i were female, giving a child up for adoption, I'd rather he/she be brought up by a gay couple who were successful, mature, healthy, emotionally stable, good morals/ethics that could supply my child with a stable home, emotional and financial support as well as unconditional love.

    I would choose them any day over a hetro couple that go to the pub every night, on welfare with a history of physical and mental abuse.

    If a couple can offer a child a good and loving home, then their sexuality shouldn't come into it.


  • #47
    The_Minister
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,255 ✭✭✭✭The_Minister


    MagicMarker wrote: »
    If i were female, giving a child up for adoption, I'd rather he/she be brought up by a gay couple who were successful, mature, healthy, emotionally stable, good morals/ethics that could supply my child with a stable home, emotional and financial support as well as unconditional love.

    I would choose them any day over a hetro couple that go to the pub every night, on welfare with a history of physical and mental abuse.

    If a couple can offer a child a good and loving home, then their sexuality shouldn't come into it.
    Except that unstable hetero couples won't be allowed adopt. It isn't a choice between horribly heteros and godly gays. When you're talking about adoption, the demand and standards are high enough that all couples recieving children are of a very high standard. Gay adoption won't "save" any children.


  • #48
    MagicMarker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    The_Minister wrote: »
    Except that unstable hetero couples won't be allowed adopt. It isn't a choice between horribly heteros and godly gays. When you're talking about adoption, the demand and standards are high enough that all couples recieving children are of a very high standard. Gay adoption won't "save" any children.
    True enough, i'd still choose a godly gay couple over a mediocre straight couple.

    Like i said, if a good home is on offer, then sexuality shouldn't come into it.


  • #49
    dr_manhattan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 650 ✭✭✭dr_manhattan


    "horribly heteros and godly gays."



    9pm thursday, channel 4

    ;-)


  • #50
    The_Minister
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,255 ✭✭✭✭The_Minister


    MagicMarker wrote: »
    True enough, i'd still choose a godly gay couple over a mediocre straight couple.

    Like i said, if a good home is on offer, then sexuality shouldn't come into it.
    I'm for gay adoption, but tbh I think your arguement isn't great. If it is a choice between two equally good families, one straight and one gay, then which is chosen?
    None, of the other posters want children to suffer, but if they think that hetro relations are optimal for a child then they will want a straight family to be given preference.


  • #51
    The_Minister
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,255 ✭✭✭✭The_Minister


    dr_manhattan wrote: »
    9pm thursday, channel 4

    ;-)
    Did I make a funny and not realise it?:)


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  • #52
    MagicMarker
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 32,865 ✭✭✭✭MagicMarker


    If it's a choice between two hetro couples, then how is a decision made?


  • #53
    dr_manhattan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 650 ✭✭✭dr_manhattan


    If it's a choice between two hetro couples, then how is a decision made?

    Bribery first, but in the event of both couples having exactly the same amount of cash, then WWE wrestling.

    And actually - there's another point.

    Wrestlers are allowed to adopt... but gay couples aren't?

    No way that's right.

    Gays in. Wrestlers out.


  • #54
    kizzyr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,410 ✭✭✭kizzyr


    Cato wrote: »
    as i said im no psychologist, ive yet to hear any good reasons why they need to raise kids or am i not jumping on the band wagon correctly?

    Some reasons why i think it would be a bad idea? the points mention by OP also i believe a child develops its ideas of male/female relationship through its parents, i think introducing same sex parents would mess with the natural order of things and lead to psycological problems later on.i dont believe this crap that a child is born gay etc its what he/she is exposed to at mental maturity which influences this.

    hope that makes sense, dont think it really matters anyway gonna get abused by having a different opinion:rolleyes:

    If children develops its idea of the male / female relationship from its parents then how to you explain in a family of 6 children of both boys and girls that one boy only is gay? All 6 children are raised in the same way by the same parents so are all exposed to the same morals, virtues, ideas of what is right and wrong yet you have one who is gay. Are you saying that at some stage in their life they decide to mix things up a little in the all too heterosexual family and be gay?


  • #55
    irish_bob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,271 ✭✭✭irish_bob


    having read all the posts on this subject , i have come to the conclusion that most of those who favour gay adoption do so purely out of idealogical reasons , they want to shake up the mainstream , that the kids are being used as political footballs seems secondry


  • #56
    kizzyr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,410 ✭✭✭kizzyr


    irish_bob wrote: »
    having read all the posts on this subject , i have come to the conclusion that most of those who favour gay adoption do so purely out of idealogical reasons , they want to shake up the mainstream , that the kids are being used as political footballs seems secondry

    Thats not true, I would never support the idea of using anyone as a political football to shake up the main stream. I simply believe that anyone can be a good parent regardless of their sexual orientation. Some people are good some people are bad, some of these people happen to be heterosexual, some homoesexual, some bi sexual. I really and truly cannot see how a family with two women / two men as the parents can possibly harm a child.


  • #57
    dr_manhattan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 650 ✭✭✭dr_manhattan


    i have come to the conclusion that most of those who favour gay adoption do so purely out of idealogical reasons

    correction: unless you can support what you say here, then you have *jumped* to the conclusion.

    after all: those who prevent gays adopting do it out of what? Non-ideological reasons?

    Last I saw most of the reasons were "lifestyle" or worse, religious.

    Are these not ideological?


  • #58
    Tar.Aldarion
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,119 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »
    Topic's come up a bit recently. Should a same sex couple be allowed to adopt a child?

    My opinion is no. A child is better off with a male & female parent and there's no shortage of suitable hetero couples who want a child.

    Also the child of a gay couple is going to have a nightmare in school.

    Seems to me to be just another "equality issue"

    Opinions?
    Yes, I see nothing wrong with it. Unless of course people fear theil will catch 'gay' or the simple mindedness of others should affect the decision.


  • #59
    dr_manhattan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 650 ✭✭✭dr_manhattan


    Yes, I see nothing wrong with it.

    You mean wrestlers or gays?


  • #60
    Tar.Aldarion
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,119 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    There is a lot wrong with wrestlers.


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  • #61
    dr_manhattan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 650 ✭✭✭dr_manhattan


    Good to hear.

    Personally, I feel wrestlers are against god, and if he wanted to give them children he wouldn't have made them so... you know, whatever it is that's wrong with them ;-)

    Gays in. Wrestlers out.


This discussion has been closed.
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