Unfair Tag Rugby Grades

valleyoftheunos · 12-06-2008 12:22pm #1

I'm playing Mixed Social grade c on two seperate nights with ITRA, the quality is unreal from some teams, grade b and ocassionally a. its really limiting our enjoyment.

One team is very new but has some good players and the other team was promoted from the beginners league last year, I'm certain that we are in the right grade for our fitness and ability. We dont mind getting beat if its a fair match but on almost every occasion this season we have been up against highly skilled experienced rugby players, these guys should be grade B at least.

Is anyone else having similar experiences?

Downtime · 12-06-2008 12:26pm

It is a joke but it is not ITRA's fault really. Teams are getting stupid and entering grades where they know they will win 80% of their games and have a chance winning the whole things. ITRA suggest grades but don't really follow up on it after that. We did well in begineers last year and 80% of our team were beginners but came up against a team in the final who were in the beginners league for 2 years and are in it again. This year we are in grade C and getting stuffed.

ITRA don't really care where you play - it is all about the money for them. IRFU is a better more enjoyable competition and the grading seems a bit fairer.

Sabre0001 · 12-06-2008 12:31pm

Last year entered a C league with some people who were really beginners...Was tough but enjoyable (I enjoy being up against the odds

). True, there are some teams who drop a grade so that they can win but just try to have fun.

ozt9vdujny3srf · 12-06-2008 12:40pm

IRFU have tag?

valleyoftheunos · 12-06-2008 12:42pm

Sabre0001 wrote: »

Last year entered a C league with some people who were really beginners...Was tough but enjoyable (I enjoy being up against the odds ). True, there are some teams who drop a grade so that they can win but just try to have fun.

We knew we would be up against it and were looking forward to the challenge but had a very unpleasent experience this week where a team who had lost their previous matches v badly suddenly turned into ripped speedy rugby pros who intimidated us and the ref to the point where the game got quite physical.

Our verdict is they got some ringers in, I spoke to the venue manager just to raise the point and make him aware of the situation but its very disapointing and frustrating.

Downtime · 12-06-2008 12:45pm

Ahmad Unsightly Flapjack wrote: »

IRFU have tag?

Yep - in its second year now. All refs are IRFU affiliated i.e. branch referees. www.irfutag.ie

Downtime · 12-06-2008 12:46pm

valleyoftheunos wrote: »

I spoke to the venue manager just to raise the point and make him aware of the situation but its very disapointing and frustrating.

You might as well be talking to the wall.

valleyoftheunos · 12-06-2008 1:12pm

yeah, hes a good guy, said he'd look into it but there wasn't an awful lot he could do. Which isn't good enough really, we're paying to be there and its supposed to be at a certain level, they should at least attempt to take steps to make sure it is.

were gonna carry on though, we are unlikely to come up against them again and it was more their attitude (and the freaking tackles!) that annoyed us more than loosing so badly.

dc69 · 12-06-2008 2:07pm

valleyoftheunos wrote: »

(and the freaking tackles!) that annoyed us more than loosing so badly.

Do you not just have to pull off a flag?

valleyoftheunos · 12-06-2008 2:55pm

dc69 wrote: »

Do you not just have to pull off a flag?

thats exactly what your supposed to do, didn't stop these guys though. The ref left them away at it aswell, should have been a yellow card or two.

Sparky14 · 12-06-2008 3:33pm

we are unlikely to come up against them again and it was more their attitude (and the freaking tackles!) that annoyed us more than loosing so badly.[/quote]

I hate that, played a few teams over the last couple of years that had one or two lads who think they are big shots, ie trying to intimidate and just being overly aggresive. I'm all for being competitive, but theres a limit. I mean it has all the point of going dominating in u12s, just so u feel like a big man. In general tho even their own teams seem to get tired of these guys.

valleyoftheunos · 12-06-2008 4:12pm

Sparky14 wrote: »

I hate that, played a few teams over the last couple of years that had one or two lads who think they are big shots, ie trying to intimidate and just being overly aggresive. I'm all for being competitive, but theres a limit. I mean it has all the point of going dominating in u12s, just so u feel like a big man. In general tho even their own teams seem to get tired of these guys.

My sentiments entirely, if its one or two guys its not really a big deal, you just front up to them a little bit, this week however it was every one of them! One of our girls is 5'2 and 7 stone, they spent the entire match charging down at her, totally unnecessary and against the spirt of the game.

Ah well onwards and upwards.

ndolan · 12-06-2008 6:30pm

We entered a beginners team with people who never played before. We are dumped in with a bunch a teams with A and B teams all in the same league.
The Garda A team destroyed us last week with their regular rugby team and we are up against them again tonight
:-(
The organisers said it was because there wasn't enough teams to have different divisions. It does take some of the fun out of it though.
Hopefully there will be more teams next year as it is the first year that Westmanstown has hosted the league

Sabre0001 · 12-06-2008 6:37pm

valleyoftheunos wrote: »

We knew we would be up against it and were looking forward to the challenge but had a very unpleasent experience this week where a team who had lost their previous matches v badly suddenly turned into ripped speedy rugby pros who intimidated us and the ref to the point where the game got quite physical.

Our verdict is they got some ringers in, I spoke to the venue manager just to raise the point and make him aware of the situation but its very disapointing and frustrating.

Poor form! Happened against us too - a team who were beaten down quite badly a number of times played us and had some really classy players. We saw the same team playing a playoff match (5th v 6th-them) - those players were missing and they got annihilated...Justice felt good

mikedragon32 · 13-06-2008 11:32pm

Teams entering lower leagues just so they can say they've won something doesn't just happen in Tag Rugby... J5 cups are a joke.

Then again, it probably happens in every sport.

kippy · 13-06-2008 11:40pm

mikedragon32 wrote: »

Teams entering lower leagues just so they can say they've won something doesn't just happen in Tag Rugby... J5 cups are a joke.

Then again, it probably happens in every sport.

I must admit this happens a lot.
ITRA here in Galway have a lot of "Open Social" leagues, probably because its too hard to grade a full team into a specific division. Howevever this is wide open to abuse.
I would suggest that the rules of tag (in that you can register different players for your team every night) and indeed the "grading" system are all open to abuse.
I am part of a second year at it team but there are a good few of us on the team who only started playing this year. We hammered two teams at the start and lost to one of the best teams I have seen so far. Theres definetly disparity amoung the levels but no real way to fix it unless you draw random static players from a pool of people who want to play at the beginning of the year. Obviously this doesnt suit all.
Its a fun game and in fairness I dont think people need to be so competitive about it in the first place.
Kippy

Worrytahs · 15-06-2008 1:14pm

ndolan wrote: »

We entered a beginners team with people who never played before. We are dumped in with a bunch a teams with A and B teams all in the same league.
The Garda A team destroyed us last week with their regular rugby team and we are up against them again tonight
:-(
The organisers said it was because there wasn't enough teams to have different divisions. It does take some of the fun out of it though.
Hopefully there will be more teams next year as it is the first year that Westmanstown has hosted the league

There were three pullouts from teams who basically had a very keen captain upon whom everything was left to organise and was subsequently let down when it came to the crunch of starting off. There are only two B grade teams really there. The rest are C.

The venue is, as you say, in its first year and a great spot with a top venue manager who will make sure that all who participate have a memorable summer. Next year will be much more graded and will have three leagues of 8.

Be it us or ITRA running the tag at whatever venue, a lot rides on the honesty of teams at the registration stage. The 'competitive' players out there in C and Beginners grades should remember that this is Tag they are playing and not the 6N or 'Sloe and as you say, its a fun for all way of playing a version of rugby and not having to withstand contact on-field

(by the way, feel free to email or phone me if you've any issues at your venue with us. The 'Contact Us' form is available on www.irfutag.ie.

All the best for the summer.

valleyoftheunos · 16-06-2008 9:16am

Worrytahs wrote: »

Be it us or ITRA running the tag at whatever venue, a lot rides on the honesty of teams at the registration stage. The 'competitive' players out there in C and Beginners grades should remember that this is Tag they are playing and not the 6N or 'Sloe and as you say, its a fun for all way of playing a version of rugby and not having to withstand contact on-field

Thats all very well but the rest of us are all paying to join these leagues and we aren't having a satisfactory or enjoyable experience. When it comes time for me to ask my team if they want to sign up for a mid summer league or even next summer I know that after our experiences this year about half of them wont be interested because the grades are so poorly managed and unbalanced.

Worrytahs · 16-06-2008 10:34am

valleyoftheunos wrote: »

Thats all very well but the rest of us are all paying to join these leagues and we aren't having a satisfactory or enjoyable experience. When it comes time for me to ask my team if they want to sign up for a mid summer league or even next summer I know that after our experiences this year about half of them wont be interested because the grades are so poorly managed and unbalanced.

With new venues its very difficult to pluck out a 'shark' team until a couple of weeks have passed. Not all teams show up for the Open Night which precedes a season.
With existing venues, our venue managers are excellent at checking that the right teams are in the right grades as they have one season behind them as a reference point.
With feedback of the season so far received in mind, the IRFU's Tag programme, Budweiser Tag, is going very well indeed in this respect.

valleyoftheunos · 16-06-2008 11:12am

Worrytahs wrote: »

With new venues its very difficult to pluck out a 'shark' team until a couple of weeks have passed. Not all teams show up for the Open Night which precedes a season.
With existing venues, our venue managers are excellent at checking that the right teams are in the right grades as they have one season behind them as a reference point.
With feedback of the season so far received in mind, the IRFU's Tag programme, Budweiser Tag, is going very well indeed in this respect.

Ok so what happens when, after three games, they spot a team that are in the wrong grade?

Worrytahs · 16-06-2008 11:45am

valleyoftheunos wrote: »

Ok so what happens when, after three games, they spot a team that are in the wrong grade?

Hasnt happened at any of our venues from last year so my answer would only be speculative.

valleyoftheunos · 16-06-2008 12:06pm

Worrytahs wrote: »

Hasnt happened at any of our venues from last year so my answer would only be speculative.

So speculate,

Surely there is a procedure for such an occurance?

jdivision · 16-06-2008 12:29pm

Not that I'm aware of, once you're in you're in.

valleyoftheunos · 16-06-2008 12:42pm

jdivision wrote: »

Not that I'm aware of, once you're in you're in.

That would certainly seem to be the case.

Worrytahs · 16-06-2008 1:41pm

valleyoftheunos wrote: »

So speculate,

Surely there is a procedure for such an occurance?

No, I won't speculate. If you want to pitch a question to us, do feel free to email us or use the 'Contact Us' page in the Tag section of the Irish Rugby website.

highgiant1985 · 17-06-2008 12:09pm

Worrytahs wrote: »

No, I won't speculate. If you want to pitch a question to us, do feel free to email us or use the 'Contact Us' page in the Tag section of the Irish Rugby website.

sorry but thats a complete cop out of an answer...

gar_29 · 17-06-2008 12:26pm

another issue is that some grades fill up quickly, so a team that wanted to play, say, B grade, find that it's full cos that didn't register early, and are then left with the option of either playing A grade and getting beaten every week, or C grade and having a walk in the park.

most go for the lower grade. not very much can be done about it, unfortunately.

valleyoftheunos · 17-06-2008 1:25pm

Worrytahs wrote: »

No, I won't speculate. If you want to pitch a question to us, do feel free to email us or use the 'Contact Us' page in the Tag section of the Irish Rugby website.

Thats a complete cop out, in one post you tell us that you are "Excellent" in your management of venues and grades and then when I ask you for the procedure concerning teams in incorrect grades you wont answer because you'd be speculating as apparently there is no procedure.

That is far from "excellent" managment.

valleyoftheunos · 17-06-2008 1:27pm

gar_29 wrote: »

another issue is that some grades fill up quickly, so a team that wanted to play, say, B grade, find that it's full cos that didn't register early, and are then left with the option of either playing A grade and getting beaten every week, or C grade and having a walk in the park.

most go for the lower grade. not very much can be done about it, unfortunately.

If the demand is there more B grade leagues should be run. And I dont accept the suggestion that nothing can be done, All players should be fully registered and if it transpires that they are more experienced players they should either be told sorry but there is no avaiability for your grade or extra capacity should be added.

gar_29 · 17-06-2008 2:45pm

valleyoftheunos wrote: »

If the demand is there more B grade leagues should be run. And I dont accept the suggestion that nothing can be done, All players should be fully registered and if it transpires that they are more experienced players they should either be told sorry but there is no avaiability for your grade or extra capacity should be added.

perhaps you should write to the IRFU? complaining on boards really won't achieve much. (sorry mods!!!)

Amz · 17-06-2008 3:01pm

Worrytahs, if you're going to use this forum to promote the IRFU tag, the least you could do is go into further detail if/when something about IRFU tag is queried.

Unfair Tag Rugby Grades

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