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Stopped by a Gardai in an unmarked car wearing plain clothes

  • 26-06-2006 12:28AM
    #1
    smarty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 258 ✭✭


    I was driving home at the weekend at at 3:30 am on Sunday morning, when I noticed a car flying up behind me. It was a 05 D Ford Mondeo, and had flashing lights under the front grill. I assumed it was an unmarked garda car. There were two people in the car.

    I pulled over to the side of the road, and a man dressed in casual clothes hopped out of the car and came over to my window. He flashed an id at me and told me he was a garda.

    I asked him was there any reason why he had stopped me and he told me in an aggressive manor that "he was a garda and he was entitled to stop anyone he wanted on any public road". He asked me for my licence, looked at it, checked my tax and insurance and then just handed it back to me and left.

    I thought he was very rude, and after the garda left, I decided to phone 999 to check whether the car was a legitimate garda vehicle. I told them the story and gave them the registration number and he said it was a legitimate vehicle.

    Now, I have no problem with being stopped by a garda, buy what about a girl travelling alone, and an unmarked car, carrying two passengers dressed in civilan clothes, signals then to pull over. Should they stop, or what can they do?

    Can anyone confirm that what the garda said about being allowed to stop any "vehicle" on any public road is true and whether they have to be dressed as a garda or driving a garda marked vehicle or anything?

    Thanks,
    Smarty


«13456

Comments

  • #2
    Owen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,678 ✭✭✭✭Owen


    Before anyone else hops on the bandwagon, 999 is for emergency use only. BUT I say fair play for questioning the Gards. They have become so unprofessional in the last few years it's frightening. When I was in NYC, I lost my phone, and went to the NYPD station in Time Square. I couldn't believe how caring, understanding, and courteous they were. On the side of all their vehicles you can see "Courtesy, Professionalism, Respect". It's a service they see themselves providing for the public.

    The Gardaí however, are so different. Yes the majority provide an excellent service we cannot do without, and they have the best intentions in the help they provide. Then there's the minority. Rude, arrogant, and on power trips. FWIW, I'm not someone who's regularly stopped by Gardaí, nor someone who would give them an excuse to be rude if I were to be stopped, but I hear enough stories, and read enough posts.


  • #3
    YeAh!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 451 ✭✭YeAh!


    You are entitled to make a complaint if you feel you have been unfarily treated here...


  • #4
    smarty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 258 ✭✭smarty


    ned78 wrote:
    Before anyone else hops on the bandwagon, 999 is for emergency use only.

    Thanks for that info. Do you know who I can contact in this situation?


  • #5
    smarty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 258 ✭✭smarty


    YeAh! wrote:
    You are entitled to make a complaint if you feel you have been unfarily treated here...

    I don't really want to make a complaint, I am just trying to figure out if anyone else has come across a situation like this, and how they would respond to it.

    It was a bit of a shock for me. I have never been pulled over before, the fact that he came running towards my car in plain clothes, after the flashing lights, was a bit scary.


  • #6
    YeAh!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 451 ✭✭YeAh!


    In this situation you would still contact the Garda Síochana Complaints Board on (01) 872 8666. They will be able to tell you if this is standard practise. It does sound really dodgy...."we can stop who we like", you know!


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  • #7
    smarty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 258 ✭✭smarty


    YeAh! wrote:
    In this situation you would still contact the Garda Síochana Complaints Board on (01) 872 8666. They will be able to tell you if this is standard practise. It does sound really dodgy...."we can stop who we like", you know!

    It was really odd. He seemed to on some sort of power trip and he didn't seem too impressed when I asked him why I was pulled over.

    I will give them a call tomorrow to see. Thanks.


  • #8
    Owen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,678 ✭✭✭✭Owen


    There is also a 'loophole' that if you don't believe this is a genuine Gardaí car/checkpoint, that you can ignore it, PROVIDED you ring a Garda Station, or visit one ASAP and present yourself and your car. I could have the technicalities on this one wrong, but I'm not a million miles out.

    Either way Smarty, I'd complain.


  • #9
    Eoin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,283 ✭✭✭✭Eoin


    If they were plain clothes, would they normally stop someone to check their tax - or even for more serious traffic offences? Perhaps your car matched the description of one they suspected of being involved in something serious and were checking it out...
    Can anyone confirm that what the garda said about being allowed to stop any "vehicle" on any public road is true and whether they have to be dressed as a garda or driving a garda marked vehicle or anything?

    I would be shocked if the Gardai didn't have this power - they would be pretty powerless to stop anyone of any traffic offence if not.


  • #10
    smarty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 258 ✭✭smarty


    eoin_s wrote:
    Perhaps your car matched the description of one they suspected of being involved in something serious and were checking it out...

    My car is a smart roadster with company logos stuck on it, so I doubt this is the case! :D


  • #11
    gillmc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46 ✭gillmc


    I had a similar experience about 6 months ago, unmarked car pulled me in, in the very centre of a town during rush hour. One of the guys came up opened the drivers door even though i had opened the window and snatched the keys from the ignition. I had my had on the door at the time he pulled it open and he shouted at me to get my hand of the door or he would break it. Both him and his partner proceeded to search my car without giving me an explanation. Not surprisingly they found nothing before throwing the keys back at me and growling for me to move the car immediately as I was blocking traffic. I was in shock and went immediately to the local station to complain about this behavour. The female Garda contacted the 2 thugs by radio as I heard her and then came back to me and told me she couldnt take my complaint as she couldnt find the proper forms, I told her id be happy with her taking a statement from me and fill in the appropriate form when she found it, she made all sorts of excuses not to take my complaint. Then the other 2 thugs arrived back and were even more aggressive than 20 mins earlier, they said who did i think i was to complain about them etc They told me to get my car out of the public car park or they would impound it with a fine for parking illegally etc. I headed off rather than be arrested and the matter has been taken up with my solicitor. I sent a complaint through my solicitor to the "independent" complaints department who wrote back and said that i had no complaint and it is being appealed at present. I had to inform my employer as i drive a company car and he is not happy with me he thinks i must have done something. This was my first conatct ever with Gardai in my life and it was terrifying, these guys have a most difficult job but sadly many have lost the plot.


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  • #12
    Lex Luthor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,203 ✭✭✭✭Lex Luthor


    3.30am...and you stopped for an unmarked car just cos it had flashing lights in the grill and they were in plain clothes?

    You're mad mate....I'd have kept going until I was home...

    The only time I'd ever stop for an unmarked car would be in daylight and if I wasn't on my own.


  • #13
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 27,467 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    I wouldn't have stopped.
    They could have been anyone.


  • #14
    \m/_(>_<)_\m/
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,222 ✭✭✭\m/_(>_<)_\m/


    smarty wrote:

    I asked him was there any reason why he had stopped me and he told me in an aggressive manor that "he was a garda and he was entitled to stop anyone he wanted on any public road". He asked me for my licence, looked at it, checked my tax and insurance and then just handed it back to me and left.

    i didn't know they were allow to do this, but i suppose that's besides the point, if they are allowed or not it doesn't really matter...
    if the want to do it they will...

    they are only paid to enforce the law, not obey it.

    and how far do you really think this will go... it your word against his...and probably the 4 other garda witnesses he had in the car at the time


  • #15
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 18,197 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    gillmc wrote:
    I had a similar experience about 6 months ago, unmarked car pulled me in, in the very centre of a town during rush hour. One of the guys came up opened the drivers door even though i had opened the window and snatched the keys from the ignition. I had my had on the door at the time he pulled it open and he shouted at me to get my hand of the door or he would break it. Both him and his partner proceeded to search my car without giving me an explanation. Not surprisingly they found nothing before throwing the keys back at me and growling for me to move the car immediately as I was blocking traffic. I was in shock and went immediately to the local station to complain about this behavour. The female Garda contacted the 2 thugs by radio as I heard her and then came back to me and told me she couldnt take my complaint as she couldnt find the proper forms, I told her id be happy with her taking a statement from me and fill in the appropriate form when she found it, she made all sorts of excuses not to take my complaint. Then the other 2 thugs arrived back and were even more aggressive than 20 mins earlier, they said who did i think i was to complain about them etc They told me to get my car out of the public car park or they would impound it with a fine for parking illegally etc. I headed off rather than be arrested and the matter has been taken up with my solicitor. I sent a complaint through my solicitor to the "independent" complaints department who wrote back and said that i had no complaint and it is being appealed at present. I had to inform my employer as i drive a company car and he is not happy with me he thinks i must have done something. This was my first conatct ever with Gardai in my life and it was terrifying, these guys have a most difficult job but sadly many have lost the plot.


    Wow that's plain scary.


  • #16
    tabatha
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,078 ✭✭✭tabatha


    these stories are scary! lets say i "know" some people in the garda and the stories i am hearing lately would make your hair curl! drink driving is a regular occurance, drugs, robbery, bullying....the list is endless


  • #17
    Wing Walker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 177 ✭✭Wing Walker


    Smarty and Gillmc, I feel for you both. Something similar happen to me but thankfully they didn't seem to be as agressive as your guys. Unmarked car, quick flash of the badge and you're lost. I'll know to head straight to the nearest cop shop next time. They can talk to me there if they want!

    "Who polices the police" I suppose comes to mind. There's absolutely no recourse for people at the moment and I can't really see that changing in the future. Maybe it's the wrong attitude to have, and I know that there are good cops out there, but I'm afraid that I really don't trust our police force.


  • #18
    Keano
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 12,810 Mod ✭✭✭✭Keano


    Seems to me that some plain clothes officers have big ego's. About a year and half ago a couple of friends of mine were walking to a party with a bag of cans. It was about 2.30 am and they were approached by 2 males who then said they were guards and that they were searching them under the drug act of whatever year they use! But anyway my mate said hang on. Can I see both your id's first and then you can search me. what was the result? the search was done quickly. and off all parties went. The 2 officers reaction had changed completely once they were asked for id. Their power trip was ruined!!


  • #19
    ct5amr2ig1nfhp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,016 ✭✭✭ct5amr2ig1nfhp


    A little off topic, but when you make a 999 call, are you speaking to some randomer or a Garda?

    Reason I ask is because I recently tried to report a drunk driver (who creamed into a set of traffic lights I was standing beside) and all I got was a torrent of abuse. I wanted to make a complaint about the ignorant muppet but he refused to give me his name.

    ambrose :cool:


  • #20
    johnnyrotten
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,592 ✭✭✭johnnyrotten


    kingambrose wrote:
    A little off topic, but when you make a 999 call, are you speaking to some randomer or a Garda?

    Reason I ask is because I recently tried to report a drunk driver (who creamed into a set of traffic lights I was standing beside) and all I got was a torrent of abuse. I wanted to make a complaint about the ignorant muppet but he refused to give me his name.

    ambrose :cool:


    When you make a 999/112 call you are through to an eircom operator first. Then you ask for the emergency service required. When you ask for the Gardai you are put through to a Garda working in the Garda control.

    Off the topic - when you ring 999/112 from a mobile phone and you ask for Garda/Fire/Amb etc state what part of the country you are calling from

    EX: Gardai please for Dublin

    or

    Ambulance please for Wicklow

    This will speed up the process


  • #21
    Kimbot
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 19,068 Mod ✭✭✭✭Kimbot


    I had an unmarked pull up beside me at the bottom of my road just before christmas!! I was sitting in my car waiting for one of my mates cos there was no parking outside my house we were leaving his car there and heading off. Three gardai jump out of the car come over to me in the drivers seat, tells me to give him the keys before he breaks me up!! Then my passenger who was sitting doing a sudoko puzzle was told to get out of the car before the other 2 dragged him out of it!! I asked the garda what he was doing and he told me to shut up, so I said to him where is your ID, flashed his ID and I askedd for all their ID's and reluctantly they showed them!! I asked why I got this hassle and they told me they had seen me "smoking gear". I said well search away so they done a search of my car and found nothing at all. But when they went throught the bin in my car there was a bottle of water in it and the opened the lid and spilt it all over my car!!

    At the end of the day as far as they are concerned they are in the right!! Needless to say one of my mam's best friends is a detective in the drugs unit and they were sorted out pretty quickly!!


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  • #22
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 29,801 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Funnily enough when I raised the point about the Gardai needing to be policed themselves (by an effective independent body) recently, I just got loads of "The Gardai are grand. I've never had a problem, it must be you!" type responses (well ok, mainly from Big Nelly :rolleyes:)

    Examples like those in this thread though serve to highlight just how dangerous it is to have an unprofessional, amateur force without any independent oversight roaming our streets.

    For balance: yes there are some decent Gardai out there, but unfortunately their voices appear to be being lost among the torrent of abuse, arrogance and abuses of power of a growing number of their colleagues :mad:


  • #23
    5500
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,429 ✭✭✭5500


    Lex Luthor wrote:
    3.30am...and you stopped for an unmarked car just cos it had flashing lights in the grill and they were in plain clothes?

    You're mad mate....I'd have kept going until I was home...

    What would the consequence be by doing this?I presume they would call for back up as you were failing to stop,id worry about what would happen when you did eventually stop.

    Are they going to listen to a "you could have been anyone in that car" story or literally pull you from the car and arrest you no questions asked


  • #24
    Wing Walker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 177 ✭✭Wing Walker


    jonny24ie wrote:
    I had an unmarked pull up beside me at the bottom of my road just before christmas!! I was sitting in my car waiting for one of my mates cos there was no parking outside my house we were leaving his car there and heading off. Three gardai jump out of the car come over to me in the drivers seat, tells me to give him the keys before he breaks me up!! Then my passenger who was sitting doing a sudoko puzzle was told to get out of the car before the other 2 dragged him out of it!! I asked the garda what he was doing and he told me to shut up, so I said to him where is your ID, flashed his ID and I askedd for all their ID's and reluctantly they showed them!! I asked why I got this hassle and they told me they had seen me "smoking gear". I said well search away so they done a search of my car and found nothing at all. But when they went throught the bin in my car there was a bottle of water in it and the opened the lid and spilt it all over my car!!

    At the end of the day as far as they are concerned they are in the right!! Needless to say one of my mam's best friends is a detective in the drugs unit and they were sorted out pretty quickly!!

    Is this seriously the type of ****e that's going on out there with some cops???

    So if we have a friend of a friend who's in the cops you're okay, they'll be sorted out? If not, then nothing will ever happen to these guys? What a complete joke!!!


  • #25
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 29,801 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Wing Walker wrote:
    Is this seriously the type of ****e that's going on out there with some cops???

    So if we have a friend of a friend who's in the cops you're okay, they'll be sorted out? If not, then nothing will ever happen to these guys? What a complete joke!!!
    It's like everything else in this country.. it's all about who you know! :(


  • #26
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 18,197 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    Kaiser2000 wrote:
    Funnily enough when I raised the point about the Gardai needing to be policed themselves (by an effective independent body) recently, I just got loads of "The Gardai are grand. I've never had a problem, it must be you!" type responses (well ok, mainly from Big Nelly :rolleyes:)

    Examples like those in this thread though serve to highlight just how dangerous it is to have an unprofessional, amateur force without any independent oversight roaming our streets.

    For balance: yes there are some decent Gardai out there, but unfortunately their voices appear to be being lost among the torrent of abuse, arrogance and abuses of power of a growing number of their colleagues :mad:

    Anyone who complains risks setting themselves up as a future target too.


  • #27
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 29,801 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Henry Ford III wrote:
    Anyone who complains risks setting themselves up as a future target too.
    Also true, and one which I (well my mam) has personal experience of :(


  • #28
    Wing Walker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 177 ✭✭Wing Walker


    Henry Ford III wrote:
    Anyone who complains risks setting themselves up as a future target too.

    Do you know, that's the way I've felt for the last few years. I wonder how true it is.

    Kaiser has already said that his family's had experience of it. Was it hassle from the same cop that the complaint was made against?


  • #29
    dahamsta
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,659 ✭✭✭✭dahamsta


    Obviously the Gardaí need to act like this to prevent terrism, therefore those of you that were stopped must look or act like terrists, and the Gardaí were perfectly entitled to harrass you. Please change your race, dress or mannerisms accordingly.

    adam


  • #30
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 29,801 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Wing Walker wrote:
    Do you know, that's the way I've felt for the last few years. I wonder how true it is.

    Kaiser has already said that his family's had experience of it. Was it hassle from the same cop that the complaint was made against?
    A complaint was originally raised years ago against two detectives from Coolock station regarding their refusal to sieze stolen goods from one of their informants (in this case a pedigree Rottweiler worth several hundred pounds at the time). One of these 2 detectives was later implicated in a case where a local scumbag was bringing drugs in through the airport.

    My mother happened to see the dog with the informant in question several months after it was stolen from the kitchen one night (they broke in and left TV, VCR, money etc) and went to the station. The two detective in question insisted that my mother "wouldn't want" the dog back and she should "let him keep her".

    It was only because my grandfather personally knew the then Minister for Justice that they were made lift the dog, but their informant was never charged with ANYTHING - not even receiving stolen property!

    Since then they have been provided with video, audio and written statements relating to a campaign of harassment against my mother from some of the neighbours and in none of these cases has anyone even been questioned, never mind charged.

    I've linked to some of these examples in another thread, but the situation has been raised with Dublin City Council and local politicans and featured in the papers, on RTE's PrimeTime and the radio, all to no avail.


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  • #31
    redmosquito
    Closed Accounts Posts: 464 ✭✭redmosquito


    I dont trust any gardai, ive had a couple of bad experiences with them, in each case the young gardai acting thick ignorant. In one case I was grabbed in a headlock, thrown to the ground and dragged off for drinking in public.
    The garda said he seen that I had a can in my back pocket and that was enough to say I was breaking the law. When as a matter of fact, all I had on me was, wait for it, a sandwhich!!! I repeatedely told him this, with him telling me to shut up, that I was drunk, when in fact I hadnt been drinking at all on the evening it happened!
    It wasnt till I complained to a senior garda later that I was told to go away, to forget about it, there would be nothing else happening with it.

    At the end of the day, as far as im concerned, most of the new, young gardai are ignorant ****, who are on a pure power trip and think because of the badge they carry, that they are above the law!


This discussion has been closed.
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