secondary school league table

Font22 · 17-04-2006 04:58PM

hullaballoo wrote:

Ok, from personal experience I'll make a recommendation. I wouldn't normally get involved in a thread like this, because I went to a school that is shrouded with a fog of ostensible elitism, despite the fact that I'm personally not too bothered with that sort of thing.

What I want to say to you is this: do not, under any circumstances, send your kid to Newpark CS. I was there for two years of my life, and they were the two worst years of my life that I remember. Now, I'm not going to libel the school, but take my recommendation that if your son is only an average performer in NS, but seems to have potential, then Gonzaga, St Michael's, St Gerard's or St Andrew's should all have his name on their shortlists.

Now, St Gerard's and St Michael's are both small enough, so your son will be guaranteed to get the attention he needs in his education. They also both play rugby, but St Gerard's has an hour every day after school when students play sports, and there is a fairly broad variety of sports for boys and girls both (from soccer to archery). I don't know what the sports in St Michael's is like, except that they are probably currently the best rugby team in Leinster, despite the outcome of the cup.
In addition to being small, there are girls in St Gerard's. This, contrary to what some might think, promotes a sense of competition, because (although they might not admit it) the lads don't want to be outshone by the girls. The probem with St Gerard's and St Michael's is that they are expensive, St Gerard's very much so. St Gerard's doesn't really feature on the League because it is a very small school (about 300+ students) and many of them go abroad for third level.

Beyond that, Coláiste Eoin is actually the second best feeder for tertiary education, and it seems to me that the students there always do well. It's an Irish school too, so that almost guarantees that your son will get top marks in Irish, and apparently their English Department is very good too. Coláiste Eoin has the advantage of not being too expensive either!

CBC Monkstown has a mixed bunch of students and results, so sending him there would depend on his work ethic.

St Andrew's is a very good school too, most people who go there love it, and it has a high ratio of students going on to third level.

Besty is prob going to love you forever thanks to that comment!

patzer117 · 17-04-2006 07:06PM

hmm, yeah, if you don't know how about ringing up the school or talking to the parents of a pupil there? i reckon you should talk to the jesuits about gonzaga, and to maybe champion sports about blackrock. gonzaga's aim is to produce well rounded 'men for others' - the jesuit aim. they don't teach stuff for exams, results don't matter, you're judged a success by your person not by your results. i think it's important you decide what you want for your son and then pick the school based on that. if it's results you want, i don't think gonzaga's the place tbh - cause that's not what they are there for

Zapp Brannigan · 17-04-2006 07:17PM

That league table is ridiculous. It only counts some colleges as 3rd level. Doesn't include numbers of PLC's etc.
Shambolic, of the highest order.

blu_sonic · 17-04-2006 07:20PM

where can i view this table?

patzer117 · 17-04-2006 07:29PM

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,4386-1879754,00.html
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/front/2005/1121/1630273000HM1FEEDER.html is another one

i don't think the table itself ever went online, at least i can't find it now.

to the op, you need to have applied to these schools a long time ago too, just if your son is like 10 now there isn't that much chance

blu_sonic · 17-04-2006 07:33PM

but is there an actual league table i can view?

RandolphEsq · 17-04-2006 07:40PM

Thirdfox wrote:

Meh Boo Blackrock, St. Mary's, Rathmines is the school to be in!

You're both wrong, Michaels is quite superior to the other schools in the country whilst maintaining a level head

bandraoi · 17-04-2006 07:52PM

I would judge a school by the comments on ratemyteacher.ie rather than on any league table in the newspapers.

Pythia · 17-04-2006 07:53PM

patzer117 wrote:

to the op, you need to have applied to these schools a long time ago too, just if your son is like 10 now there isn't that much chance

In my old school, people were putting their kids names down at birth to be getting in in 12/13 years times.

gilroyb · 17-04-2006 08:05PM

I'm currently in University. I attended a State school, got on fine, and I feel mine was a much more rounded education as a result. There are a number of private schools I would definitely advise against, but Gonzaga is not one of them. I have seen some wonderful people become totally self-involved as a result of going to a private school. Be very careful about about thinking that just because you pay for an education it will be an improvement. Find THE school for your child, don't just assume all private schools are good and all public schools are bad.

Also, on a similar subject, I'd advise that all girls go to mixed schools. Single sex schools schools may give them somewhat better grades, but that's not everything one wants from an education.

Tom65 · 17-04-2006 08:13PM

I went to Blackrock and I think while it probably does tend to produce more students with better academics, there are always wasters around who'll do nothing. Also, I think public school makes more well rounded child. Blackrock produces a lot of "Blackrock - Superior" types, who really are arseholes, and view the world in terms of money.

I think if I was to choose where to send my (imaginary) kid, having had the private school experience, I'd probably choose a public school. I would avoid the D4 rugby schools like the plague.

diggies · 17-04-2006 08:28PM

interesting topic- and ultimately one of nature v nurture. Gonzaga seems to be producing excellent league table results, but IMO doenst strike me as the best 'all rounder' school. I dont think your son would get a really broad perspective on society there- i went to a private school, one that still relishes in mid to lower table obscurity. I had a great time there, but often felt inferior to lots of the rich gals. my parents were teachers, my mother in a girls school in a really deprived area, she reckoned that my school was krapp compared to the education that the students in her school got. it depends what you are looking for. good to see the old boys network still going strong on these boards though. i work with men who left 'rock 30 years ago, its still the first question they ask any new joiner to the company.
Finally to the posters who says their old school is not on the league tables cos the principal didnt want it there- an urban myth m'afraid. league tables are compiled by information obtained by the media under the FOI act.

Nightwish · 17-04-2006 09:44PM

League table results are not an accurate reflection of the school. They only focus on the number going to University. I would recommend the OP review the WSE (Whole School Evaluation) results carried out on the school. This gives a well rounded more balanced view of the school environment, taking into account the schools facilities, extra curricular activities, school learning environment etc. They are posted on the Dept of Education website.

Vorsprung · 17-04-2006 09:49PM

Nightwish wrote:

League table results are not an accurate reflection of the school. They only focus on the number going to University. I would recommend the OP review the WSE (Whole School Evaluation) results carried out on the school. This gives a well rounded more balanced view of the school environment, taking into account the schools facilities, extra curricular activities, school learning environment etc. They are posted on the Dept of Education website.

Link?

thebaz · 18-04-2006 12:41AM

his name is already down for a few schools including Rock . Gonzaga like others dont take applications until 5th class , which is next october . I'm not from Dublin and want whats best overall. we have discussed with freinds and others , and the issue was raised by more than one that Gonzaga was elitist . The feedback here seems to indicate that this is not necessarily so, and other schools such as Blackrock would be even more so. He likes sport , particularly soccer and hurling, which Rock do offer but not Gonzaga. The others from his class are being scattered across Oatlands, Blackrock ,Newpark , Colaiste Eoin and Gonzaga. p.s his irish is poor so colaiste eoin is out -- unfortunatly.

Sangre · 18-04-2006 12:55AM

St Michaels all the way tbh. The year we graduated 25% of the year got over 500 points and the overall average was way above the national average. You'll struggle to find a school with 80+ students with better results (theres a reason why michaels always do worse at SCT level). Great facilities, great teachers and he'll make friends for life.
Despite its Dublin 4 location its a school of north and southsiders because its literally at Sydney parade DART.
In my 8 years in that school I can't ever recall someone being slagged for being poor. You can't tell when everyone wears a uniform.
When I went from public to private school I loved the differce in faclities, so much more to do and try out and I went to Hollypark which is an excellent public school.

Also to the person who said Marys was a great academic school...don't make me laugh!

Black_Couch · 18-04-2006 01:17AM

Seriously some posters going on about which schools are grade B rugby schools etc. get a grip! The OP is trying to decide where to send his son and how good the school is at rugby simply isn't a factor. :mad:

A lot of people are focusing on leaving cert results and league tables of feeder schools. This is not the most important aspect of a school believe it or not and unfortunately is often what a school is judged upon.

I'm biased, went to a non-fee paying school and glad. Makes you work harder to get what you want than a non-fee paying school. I also think grinds are a cop-out too. And its kind of connected to my opinions on private schooling, paying for your education is wrong I feel.

Also I'd like to point out that there is a disproportionate amount of people here on boards from private schools.

Best thing to do is probably list out all the negatives and positives of each type of schooling and see what comes out on top.

psicic · 18-04-2006 01:22AM

Hmmm....my state school was a living disgrace, so I have to say school choice is very important. Even though there are some good state-funded schools out there, there are a lot of really, really – no, you don’t quite get what I’m trying to tell you – REALLY bad ones out there. In all honesty, I think you get a lot more opportunities in fee-paying schools. Even if your son’s not academically inclined, he can still progress to degree level from a fee-paying school more easily which, after all, doesn’t mean he’s a genius, but is only a tool to a higher wage. There are some very dull people with degrees

One example from my own schooling, in Leaving Cert Year our French teacher, who was still doing the same thing as in first year when he actually held class, kept taking the class out for football instead of doing work because it was 'our last year' and we never had a chance to relax. We never heard of any of the national extra-curricular activities. No school clubs. No student organisation (though we did have a strike or two

). No organised study. I was constantly bored, never said anything in class because discipline was out the window, no PE, no school library of worth ....yup...good times. I'm not talking too long ago either, say about 7 years ago now.

On-topic, I can only say one thing of worth, and that's schools funded/built/run under a PPP programme seem to be very dynamic places. The activities and facilities available to the students are, well, amazing. You've already said your kid isn't academically inclined, so that’s something to consider.

p.s. Now I (ironically) work for the Department of Education - my alma mater on the verge of closing down. Completely co-incidental, of course. :rolleyes:

p.p.s. I agree with Black_Couch on several levels - there seems to be a whole lot of people posting here who went to fee-paying schools. Also, in a perfect world, the schools the state funds would be run well. But they're not. Once again the petty sectional interests that control education in this country win out at the expense of the taxpayer and the pupils. If only schools paid-for by the state were run by the state...and no, VECs don't count as they are as badly warped and twisted by the current quango as any of the other schools.

irlrobins · 18-04-2006 08:48AM

Black_Couch wrote:

Seriously some posters going on about which schools are grade B rugby schools etc. get a grip!

My mention of Gonzaga being 'b' grade at rugby was to point out that while they offer sports, it is not the end all and be all attitude towards them that other schools have, like Blackrock. I was crap at rugby and never played it while at Gonzaga. So my opinion on Gonzaga or any other school is not influenced by how good a rugby team they offer. But i would be concerned on the pressure some schools put on their rugby players.

Black_Couch · 18-04-2006 12:39PM

irlrobins wrote:

My mention of Gonzaga being 'b' grade at rugby was to point out that while they offer sports, it is not the end all and be all attitude towards them that other schools have, like Blackrock. I was crap at rugby and never played it while at Gonzaga. So my opinion on Gonzaga or any other school is not influenced by how good a rugby team they offer. But i would be concerned on the pressure some schools put on their rugby players.

Sorry completely took u up wrong so. Good point you made so.

Hermione* · 18-04-2006 01:55PM

Pythia wrote:

I also believe that private schools make people more rounded. I speak nicely and am polite.

This is called parenting. So do I. Because my parents brougt me up that way. So do all my schoolfriends. We all went to very good schools, schools that had been private when our parents attended them but switched to the public education sector in 1966. My parents could have paid for me to go to the boarding school my mum went to, so it wasn't a money issue. Private education is virtually non-existent in Limerick, and while I've always been kept away from the less pleasant aspects of the city, I think it gave us a wider viewpoint to have been publicly educated. All my friends went to university, most into the professions.

To the OP: Having followed these tables from curiousity for a couple of years, most southside schools whether free or private are going to have the advantages of well-heeled students. Some private schools actually have larger classes. Marian College in Ballsbridge has tiny class sizes, very high rates of university attendence and is free. But from what I've seen and read, two of the best schools in Dublin at the moment are Colaiste Eoin and Colaiste Iosagain in Stillorgan. But not every body approves of education through Irish.

melekalikimaka · 18-04-2006 02:04PM

i went to a d4 school, according the the league, the best, and i can tell you for a fact its a load of rubbish, the way the table is generated is flawed completely and you would be a fool to go by it, it included students that repeat the year after etc. this thread is just a 'pick my school cos i think its the best' thread. to the op, your only gonna get bias comments here, be it which school, or the whole prive vs public. your and your wife know your son best, maybe a talk with your sons current teacher, from there you could find a school suited to his personality, primary school teachers know their stuff

Macker · 18-04-2006 02:53PM

Bunch of fúcking snobs *

*about time someone said it

melekalikimaka · 18-04-2006 03:24PM

Macker wrote:

Bunch of fúcking snobs *

*about time someone said it

i see someones got a chip on their shoulder

ferdi · 18-04-2006 03:32PM

melekalikimaka wrote:

i see someones got a chip on their shoulder

probably a bag of chips and a batter burger.

orlib · 18-04-2006 10:53PM

I recommend St Michaels, Ailesbury Rd. The fees are pretty high but it's a great school. My 4 older brothers went there and loved it

besty · 18-04-2006 11:09PM

I would fully recommend looking into St. Michael's. It's great and produces well rounded students in most instances

Thirdfox · 18-04-2006 11:36PM

And they even beat St. Mary's at Senior Cup rugby this year! *madness!*

Guess which school I came from then?

thebaz · 19-04-2006 12:22AM

is Michaels not the same as Rock , in the words of "Macker" snobby .Thats one thing i want to avoid , hence the question . Yes , i want the best , but I also want someone who can communicate socially, not just with Dublin 4 aristos. Sent daughter to wrong sec. school, she won't leave now , without being forced to, which i dont want to do.

Thirdfox · 19-04-2006 12:34AM

Most people in private schools do not turn out to be snobs, especially if one is taught about the value of the euro early in life.

Snobbery was always just at a trivial level in our school - we made lighthearted jokes about it but no one truly believed that they deserved something out of life for nothing.

Finally D4 is soo last year, don't you know it's D6 nowadays?

secondary school league table

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