Polish (CON) artists

The_Minister · 07-04-2006 01:26PM

They always admitted to us that they were from a computer.

Giblet · 07-04-2006 01:28PM

Deleted User wrote:

What did you do.... He offered the sale, you pushed money into his outstretched hands, and grabbed the drawing, without looking at it?

I'm sorry but its your mistake. You failed to examine the picture/sketch/print whatever.

I still can't see a con here, because you could have checked the sketch before you bought it, determining what format it was in. You assumed that it would be an original sketch.

In my eyes at least it wasn't a con. Just lack of oberservation by yourself. :rolleyes:

Yes a CON is ALWAYS your mistake.... Each of the points you have made apply to all cons.

07-04-2006 01:32PM

CoolGuy2006 wrote:

eh, they are lying to you. They tell you they drew this picutre themselves. That is why you buy it, you think you are buying a orginal that someone has put some time and effort into. You are led to believe that you are buying this piture off the "Artist". You are not getting what you paid for

They are deceiving you, it is a con

Giblet wrote:

Yes a CON is ALWAYS your mistake.... Each of the points you have made apply to all cons.

Hmm.... maybe you should sue Lynx for telling you that their products will have women running after you all the time, when they obviously know its a marketing gimmic.....

Know what I mean? Surely you've learnt by now to read between the lines, and judge a product on its own without the propoganda that comes before it.

The Artist lied. So what? He boosted the quality of his product, therefore getting you to buy it. At every stage during the sale of the drawing, you could have checked what he was selling. That is not a con. Cons usually involve where you have to pay first, with the seller disappearing before you can open the good.

CoolGuy2006 · 07-04-2006 01:36PM

eh, a con is when someone gains confidence from someone.

He gained my confidence by lying, its quite simple really.

Im not the one who started this post, i dont feel that passionately about it. Just felt id add my own account.

Whatever way you look at it, it was a con

And no, its not the same as clever advertising. Its like buying a can of coke and you find there is pepsi inside. Yes, they are both cola's but its not what you wanted or paid for

I think your're missing the point. how can you say he lied but he didnt con me. I bought something thinking it was something else because he lied to me. And yes, you can say its my fault for not checking, i did check. I checked as soon as i got inside but becuase it was christmas and all i didnt want to start any ****.

Jumpy · 07-04-2006 01:40PM

Snake Plisken wrote:

Better then the Arsehole from Talk Talk who called at my door last week, looking to save me money on my phone bill! I said I wasn't interested, he said your not interested in saving money, I said I'm not interested in switching provider and I use my mobile mostly, he then starts getting cheeky and comes back with a smart arse answer "your either loaded or Mad", that is when I slammed the door in his face Its bad enough having these feckers telephoning me every week without them turning up at my door!

Snake

You should have replied, "yeah and you must be poor to end up doing that".

07-04-2006 01:42PM

And no, its not the same as clever advertising. Its like buying a can of coke and you find there is pepsi inside. Yes, they are both cola's but its not what you wanted or paid for

I think your missing the point

Was the print covered and wrapped up so the buyer couldn't see what the print was like?

from my take on this, he could have looked at his purchase at any time. He just handed over the money and took what was given. He didn't check that what he was buying, was the same as what he thought it was going to be.

My point is simple. He could have checked the picture at any time before he bought it. Thats not a con. A con is where you're trusting someone because you can't check it out fully. But, hey, you can feel he was hard-done by. I just think he made a mistake.

CoolGuy2006 · 07-04-2006 01:49PM

sorry mate, i think your grasp of reality is slighty obscured.

He took my money off me knowing that he made a sale because he told me it was an original. I dont see how this is a marketing gimmick.

What person looks at a "Lynx" add as you say and actually believes they are going to have women running around after them

Lynx sell you a deodorant, you get a deodorant.

Con artist sells you picture saying its an original, you get a copy

This is the most simplest con ever, i fail to see how you cant seem to grasp it. It sounds silly to me that you say it wasnt a con because i was stupid and didnt check it first, thats my point, THE CON HAD ALREADY TAKEN PLACE. He gained my confidence by lying to me. Hence its called a CON

"A con is where you're trusting someone because you can't check it out fully."

Well, there are many different cons. The basis is all the same, someone gets money off someone under false pretence by gaining confidence.

07-04-2006 01:53PM

Con artist sells you picture saying its an original, you get a copy

Ok. Let me ask you this. Do you think he should have checked the picture before handing over the money to ensure that it was an original?

Are you really that trusting of what people selling something are telling you?

RotalicaV · 07-04-2006 02:00PM

I work with a few polish guys. Really hard working when given the chance and they're all dead sound.

I wouldn't label poland but i can understand that every basket has some bad eggs.

CoolGuy2006 · 07-04-2006 02:01PM

Ok, maybe you havent read everything.

He said he was the artist who drew these pictures. He pointed out a picutre of his cat and his younger cousins that are living back in poland.

I liked the one with the cat and bought it under the pretence that he told me he drew it.

When i got inside into proper light i realized that it was a print. And yes, i am a very trusting person. I liked all the pitures he had. If he had told me they were prints i would have no problem with him calling to my door.

He didnt though, he told me he had drawn all these himself. A month later a girl called by the house with the same pics with the same story

And sorry, im not labeling all polish people as con artists. I have many polish friends here.

imeddyhobbs · 07-04-2006 09:58PM

I had the same thing a few weeks ago,i answered the door to her,she handed me the note,i said no thank you then she said ahh jasses boss wud ya not take one off me,turns out she was a tinker so i gave her a bit of scrap metal and told her to gwan

Kintarō Hattori · 07-04-2006 11:02PM

Sorry I have to back klaz up on everything he said so far!

Caryatnid · 16-04-2006 09:05PM

Deleted User wrote:

Ok. Let me ask you this. Do you think he should have checked the picture before handing over the money to ensure that it was an original?

Are you really that trusting of what people selling something are telling you?

Klaz, why do you not see what a con is? It's irrelevant of how trusting/stupid the person being sold to is - it's still a con. Suppose a guy comes to my door, selling real gold jewellery to your door for a tenth of the value, and says it is from a shop that is shutting down - I would think the stuff is stolen and not buy it from him. Maybe my next-door-neighbour doesn't have a destroyed mind like mine, and is more innocent, believes the story, and buys the stuff. Has my next-door-neighbour been lied to? Yes.
Conned? Yes.
Was he too trusting of what people tell him? Irrelevant.

18-04-2006 12:47PM

Caryatnid wrote:

Klaz, why do you not see what a con is? It's irrelevant of how trusting/stupid the person being sold to is - it's still a con. Suppose a guy comes to my door, selling real gold jewellery to your door for a tenth of the value, and says it is from a shop that is shutting down - I would think the stuff is stolen and not buy it from him. Maybe my next-door-neighbour doesn't have a destroyed mind like mine, and is more innocent, believes the story, and buys the stuff. Has my next-door-neighbour been lied to? Yes.
Conned? Yes.
Was he too trusting of what people tell him? Irrelevant.

I suupose I count a con as being some action thats a little bit more intelligent. In this case I wouldn't have considered it a con, simply because at any stage during the purchase he could havce checked the product. It was his own lack of observation that created the con. There's nothing here that suggests that this was an intentional con, since the seller didn't try to change the product to reflect what he was trying to sell.

When I was in Russia, there was a con, where a guy infront dropped a wad of cash on the ground in front of you. If you picked it up, a militia member would appear, and start questioning you. The original man would then come back, and between them they would say you were trying to steal the money. then you'd need to bribe both to stop being arrested (which in turn would cost more money to get out of)

That to me is a con. You view this painting job as being a con. Fine. I don't.

Again I'll say it. At every stage during this purchase the buyer could have checked the product to confirm his own assumptions.

If it makes you feel better to think of this as a con, fair game to you. However, I wouln't call it a con, and the mistake rests totally on the buyer.

FuzzyWuzzyWazza · 18-04-2006 03:31PM

Again I'll say it. At every stage during this purchase the buyer could have checked the product to confirm his own assumptions.

He didnt 'assume' they where pencil drawings, he was told!!!

I have had 3 or so of these Poles selling these prints, two where very attractive girls, and I bought a couple of the 'sketches'. In each case they where made out to be hand drawn, and in each case they where not. Now as I bought them for the asthetic value this didn't bother me, and after the first one I knew what I was getting.

But it is most definatly a con.

CoolGuy2006 · 18-04-2006 04:06PM

A confidence trick, confidence game, also known as a con, scam, or flim flam, is an attempt to intentionally mislead a person or persons (known as the "mark") usually with the goal of financial or other gain. ---- WIKIPEDIA

So, it is a con. Not saying its crime of the century or anything but it is a con

These "artists" create the their story because they know that most people dont wanna hand over money for a print. So, they mislead the person, ie ME, and tell them a story that isnt true and claim the product is something which it isnt.

Simple con but a con none the less

padi89 · 18-04-2006 04:16PM

Klaz of course its a con.He was lead to belive he was buying a drawing by the artist and it turned out to be a print,this is a blatant lie by the seller.I dont see your Russian reference as a very intelligent con in my opinion,I certainly wouldnt pick up a wad of cash thats fallen out of some dudes especially in Russia of all places, but there are people that will.Thats how cons work,some people are just less wary that others ,not nessecarily less intelligent.

18-04-2006 05:16PM

FuzzyWuzzyWazza wrote:

He didnt 'assume' they where pencil drawings, he was told!!!

And you believe everything you're told? Come on.

He did assume that the product was the same as he was told. Otherwise he would have have checked the product to ensure what he thought he bought was what he actually bought.

I had a big reply ready to post about this, but I figured in the end I was just repeating what I've already said. [And now in hindsight I've just rewritten what I had removed, lol]

Its very rare that products are sold without some form of embellishments about what it can do, or how it can improve our lives. This isn't any different, and in many ways this situation makes it easier to check the product before buying where you often can't in supermarkets, or from the TV. [I have a number of products ranging from nose-hair clippers, electric razors, to frying pans all of which promised alot, but failed greatly. Good marketing, but failed to deliver. A con, perhaps?]

I have had 3 or so of these Poles selling these prints, two where very attractive girls, and I bought a couple of the 'sketches'. In each case they where made out to be hand drawn, and in each case they where not. Now as I bought them for the asthetic value this didn't bother me, and after the first one I knew what I was getting.

Thats nice. You've bought them, and you're happy. You bought the items, and weren't pissed that you didn't check the purchase before handing over your money. Not once, but three times. Ever think to check the pictures as you're talking about the money?

And if you have a problem with this "con", then why haven't you reported these people when they come repeatedly to "con" you? And yet you're ok with this because of the "asthetic value"?

But it is most definatly a con

Where does your responsibility to check your purchases start and end? At what stage is it just marketing, and when does it turn into "a con"? What separates the purchasers stupidity, as opposed to an actual confidence scam?

This is where we differ on this. I understand that you believe this to be a con. Frankly I don't really care if it is or not. It doesn't matter. What does matter is this seemingly throwing away of personal responsibility just because it was a con.......... We're responsible for our actions/inactions, and the original buyer was responsible for checking the product before handing over the money. That to me is common sense.

blueshirt · 18-04-2006 05:23PM

I don’t really mind Poles, or most other eastern Europeans. They are European like ourselves and the only thing separating us is language. But that can be surmounted. Most of the women are very attractive and we could do with them to thicken up the blood. (Don’t need or want Africans though, they have no place here, let them go to their former colonial masters, they are responsible for them, not us).

FuzzyWuzzyWazza · 18-04-2006 06:24PM

Thats nice. You've bought them, and you're happy. You bought the items, and weren't pissed that you didn't check the purchase before handing over your money. Not once, but three times. Ever think to check the pictures as you're talking about the money?

And if you have a problem with this "con", then why haven't you reported these people when they come repeatedly to "con" you? And yet you're ok with this because of the "asthetic value"?

Of course I checked them, they where handed to me before the purchase, they are pretty decent pics and though they are prints the look very like sketches, only on a pretty close inspection would you even notice.

Apart from the reason I stated before, these people where out trying to make some money, so I gave them some, better the mugging people or straling stuff to make some extra cash.

I am not upset with the con, I paid my money and got some nice pictures, but they are not what the seller said they where, and as I said before, that didn't matter to me.

padi89 · 18-04-2006 07:16PM

Klaz,lets say i sell you for electrical item.You come over to purchase it ask me to set it up so you can see it running and to you it seems fine so you hand me the money for it and off you go.
Little do you know that the item cuts out after twenty minutes due to over heating after i telling you it works perfect.You made your own judgement when you bought it and you were told its perfect.Would you consider this a con?

0utshined · 18-04-2006 08:13PM

unkel wrote:

Forget about English. I'd teach her French, Greek and Russian. In that order.

You're a bad man unkel, a bad bad man.

That was completely unexpected and very funny.

Gurgle · 18-04-2006 08:37PM

CoolGuy2006 wrote:

He said he was the artist who drew these pictures.

Maybe he did draw the pictures, then scanned them and sells prints.

Tbh, I never buy anything at the door. If I want insurance, I'll ring an insurance company, not stand by the door hoping someone shows up:rolleyes:.

Has anyone ever bought anything at their door and not regretted it one way or another ?

19-04-2006 12:56PM

padi89 wrote:

Klaz,lets say i sell you for electrical item.You come over to purchase it ask me to set it up so you can see it running and to you it seems fine so you hand me the money for it and off you go.
Little do you know that the item cuts out after twenty minutes due to over heating after i telling you it works perfect.You made your own judgement when you bought it and you were told its perfect.Would you consider this a con?

Yup. You got me. I would consider that a con. However there is a bit of a difference here. Quite easy to examine a picture to see if its whats being sold, compared to something that has hidden machinery....

animaal · 19-04-2006 01:42PM

Deleted User wrote:

Yup. You got me. I would consider that a con. However there is a bit of a difference here. Quite easy to examine a picture to see if its whats being sold, compared to something that has hidden machinery....

So it's a con because it's beyond your ability to know you're being mis-sold something. What about jewellery? If you bought somebody special a diamond ring, but the shop gave you paste instead of a real diamond is that fair enough? Surelly you're free to examine the stone yourself when you're buying it? <b>I</b> could tell fairly easily it's a fake, so surely it's not a con?

Whether or not something is a con is not defined by your own (in)ability to discover the fact. It's defined by the actions of the person performing the con.

elvis2002 · 19-04-2006 02:51PM

blueshirt wrote:

(Don’t need or want Africans though, they have no place here, let them go to their former colonial masters, they are responsible for them, not us).

I dont know if I should be laughing but thats brilliant. Something to txt my black friends.

20-04-2006 07:47AM

Whether or not something is a con is not defined by your own (in)ability to discover the fact. It's defined by the actions of the person performing the con.

Grand. You've explained a con, and convinced me that it was a con.

However it was a very obvious con, which should have been seen through, at any stage of the transaction. My problem isn't whether it was a con or not. That came later in responses to my initial post. Personally I think he was foolish not to have checked the prints to ensure that they were what he assumed they were. Am I the only one that thinks this? Probably....

CoolGuy2006 · 20-04-2006 08:06AM

Klaz, it wasnt that obvious for Fuk sake. I am an artist, was in the middle of doing some sketches at the time he knocked at my door. It was dark outside, just had my crappy porch light on. IM SURE THIS IS ALL PART OF THE CON, calling during the night.

Yes, he was a nice guy with a big sad story, blah blah blah. It was chrismas so i thought i would buy a sketch, from artist to artist if you get me. I wanted to buy something that this guy had put a bit of heart and soul into. Instead he lied to me and i bought a crappy cheap print. Can you see how a real sketch would be worth more to me than a print. On a personal level, not on a actual financial one. I did have a good look, with my crappy light permiting. Yes i was trusting. Does this mean he didnt con me. He fooled me to get money and it worked.

I did not start this thread, it is not something i think about much, you are the one who seems to think the the con artist is not to blame and is totally innocent

Anyway, i had a close look at the drawings. They were PRINTED SKETCHES if you understand me. They looked like sketches. If they were coloured paintings it would have been more obvious that they were prints but because they were pencil sketches it was less obvious. It wasnt until i went in and turned on my proper light that i realised they were prints. I had an eraser beside me so i tried to erase some lines and they wouldnt come off.

The fact that it was christams week stopped me from going out and starting SH*T.

Klaz, by your logic, if anyone is stupid enough to fall for a con then it isnt a con because the victim was just stupid.

It was a con EVEN though i didnt check EXTRA properly.
It doesnt matter what the outcome was. Even if i didnt buy the drawing, HE WAS TRYING TO CON ME.

Why cant you understand this really basic concept.
I never said it was the crime of the century, you are the one who just keeps contradicting logic itself.

Everyone who is conned, in a big or small way could always have checked up on things a bit more before handing over their money. By your logic, nobody has ever been conned because they were either stupid or didnt check what they doing

pbsuxok1znja4r · 20-04-2006 08:51AM

Heard a funny story actually about a polish guy who was working as an apprentice or labourer or something for this guy. He asked his boss for time off and some advance pay to go holiday back home in Poland. So off he goes. But he doesn't turn back up here for work when he's supposed to. Instead, this other Polish guy, complete stranger, turns up to the boss and says he's 'here for the job'. The boss says he doesnt know what he's on about. Apparently, the first polish guy had taken the boss' money and gone home to Poland and sold the resulting job vacancy to some other guy, so he could come to Ireland and just walk into the job!

:

Dave! · 20-04-2006 09:01AM

aww man, that's harsh, poor bloke!

Polish (CON) artists

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