Failed asylum seekers flown to Nigeria

Heinrich · 05-04-2006 07:43AM #1

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1592754&issue_id=13879

I wonder did Kunle miss the flight?

Expensive doings!

MorningStar · 05-04-2006 08:14AM

Intresting to note the priority countries for deportation.

1) Eddire Hobbes would have us beleive that life is better in South Africa becasue you can buy desposible camera cheap there
2) How many have direct flights here?
3) Some of these countries have major desease problems such as Aids and TB.

ASylum should be granted to people in need but if you get off in a another country you should be sent back there at the cost of the country that allowed them come here.

I guess in years to come when some of these countries start exploiting their natural resources they can pay us back.

THis isn't about race or country but economics and manipulation of systems.

Hobbes · 05-04-2006 08:15AM

Heinrich wrote:

I wonder did Kunle miss the flight?

Expensive doings!

How did you wait to crack that little gem out? :rolleyes:

Heres something to keep you busy. Tells you how many Johhny Foriegners are allowed stay/not stay on day to day basis.

http://www.justice.ie/80256E01003A21A5/vWeb/pcJUSQ65YEVF-en

3) Some of these countries have major desease problems such as Aids and TB.

Like Ireland?

Our man in Havana · 05-04-2006 08:19AM

I see Kunle is in today's indo. He is looking well. He was up in court again for driving without insurance and tax. So I can summise that he is still around.

Surely they could have got Ryanair or other cheapo option to send them back?

Pythia · 05-04-2006 08:42AM

Hobbes wrote:

Like Ireland?

Like Subsaharan Africa actually...

Dublin Aids Alliance wrote:

Of the 305 cases where geographic origin was known, 136 were born in Ireland and 130 were born in sub-Saharan Africa. Data on geographic origin is missing in 51 of the cases.

http://www.dublinaidsalliance.com/statistics.htm

Considering there's not a one-to-one SSAfrican/Irish population ratio, I'd say the OP's staement was correct.

Any person who claims asylum must do so in the first country they get to after leaving their own. Now correct me if I'm wrong, but there's no direct flight from Nigeria to Ireland, and I don't remember Irish Ferries doing the Dublin-Lagos sailing any time recently.

So, that means anyone who claims asylum must be sent back to the country they entered Ireland from. It's not racism, it's following the rules.

Heinrich · 05-04-2006 09:25AM

Bond-007 wrote:

I see Kunle is in today's indo. He is looking well. He was up in court again for driving without insurance and tax. So I can summise that he is still around.

Surely they could have got Ryanair or other cheapo option to send them back?

Let's have a whip around to pay his insurance and tax. It must be embarassing to have to face that judge.

I'm still tring to figure out how he can afford the car in the first place.

Hobbes · 05-04-2006 09:48AM

Pythia wrote:

So, that means anyone who claims asylum must be sent back to the country they entered Ireland from. It's not racism, it's following the rules.

No one said it was and your wrong about where people claim asylum are placed. You can learn more here...

http://www.irishrefugeecouncil.ie/factsheets.html

Kernel · 05-04-2006 09:59AM

Heinrich wrote:

Let's have a whip around to pay his insurance and tax. It must be embarassing to have to face that judge.

I'm still tring to figure out how he can afford the car in the first place.

Good 'ol Kunle, a lad who wanted to finish the leaving cert and who looks like he's pushing 30 years of age.

Hobbes, I'm a bit confused about your 'like Ireland' comment? Ireland doesn't have an AIDS or TB problem, TB is increasing, but that's due to it being imported by Johnny Foreigners, since it was eradicated from Ireland years ago. Likewise, AIDS is rampant in many African countries, whereas the Irish infection rate is very very low.

MorningStar · 05-04-2006 10:04AM

Hobbes wrote:

How did you wait to crack that little gem out? :rolleyes:

Heres something to keep you busy. Tells you how many Johhny Foriegners are allowed stay/not stay on day to day basis.

http://www.justice.ie/80256E01003A21A5/vWeb/pcJUSQ65YEVF-en

No it doesn't that is about VISAs into ireland no mention of asylum seekers. There is a big difference and your ignorance of the subject and blind defense are part of the problem when trying to deal fairly with people wanting to come here.

Like Ireland?[/QUOTE]

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/hea_chi_liv_wit_aid_percap/AFR

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/hea_hiv_aid_dea_percap/AFR

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/hea_hiv_aid_peo_liv_wit_hiv_aid_percap
Now we are 84th on that last list where are the countries on the priority list?

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/hea_tub_cas_per_100

We 142nd on this list and where are the other countries mentioned?

Now I see that peope would put my comments downs as racist or bigoted. The problem is the only people who are ignorant of the facts would. There are rules and laws governing the EU and some countries are ignoring them. To grant a visa from high risk countries we should do a blood test just like they do in the US. This is self preservation, entry to this country is a privledge not a right.
As pointed out the increase in our countries figures show an large portion of people living with HIV are not from Ireland. It is not racist to say that it is fact. Irish and Scottish people or decendants b are celiac that is fact not rascism

ferdi · 05-04-2006 10:09AM

MorningStar wrote:

entry to this country is a privledge not a right.

i think this is a point which escapes alot of people.

Heinrich · 05-04-2006 10:17AM

ferdi wrote:

i think this is a point which escapes alot of people.

Uncharitable but sadly true! Refugees in need rarely have the means to do longhaul journeys!

MorningStar · 05-04-2006 10:49AM

Heinrich wrote:

Uncharitable but sadly true! Refugees in need rarely have the means to do longhaul journeys!

What has charity to do with it. Many people enter this country for a better life not escape something. Economic imigrants abusing a system. From my understanding the people who get here are basically the well off in majority of cases as they can afford to get here. There are some helped by NGOs. I think any charity that supports corruption of the system should have their charity status removed as they support illegal transportation of people into this country. If they can be granted asylum here they can get it in an EU country which is the first country they enter in most cases.
I refuse to support any charity that I know do this and I urge others to do the same.

Heinrich · 05-04-2006 10:57AM

MorningStar wrote:

What has charity to do with it. Many people enter this country for a better life not escape something. Economic imigrants abusing a system. From my understanding the people who get here are basically the well off in majority of cases as they can afford to get here. There are some helped by NGOs. I think any charity that supports corruption of the system should have their charity status removed as they support illegal transportation of people into this country. If they can be granted asylum here they can get it in an EU country which is the first country they enter in most cases.
I refuse to support any charity that I know do this and I urge others to do the same.

That was irony! The whole issue is clouded with some sort of Nationalistic guilt! When the Irish went abroad they went to work and work hard they did. In those days there were no handouts as is the case here.

There are far too many questions which are nort being answered. The only way I ever got anything was by earning the cash to buy it!

Hobbes · 05-04-2006 11:28AM

MorningStar wrote:

Economic imigrants abusing a system.

You have any kind of facts to back that up or you just pulling that out of your arse.

Asylum seekers stats/rejections etc are freely available on the net, as are Visa listings (posted links above). Unless your on some alternate reality internet I would very much like to see where you got your facts from.

ferdi · 05-04-2006 11:36AM

look hobbes, you'd have to be an absolute fool not to realise that people are coming here on the make, trying to get whatever they can. the system is weak, unbalanced and easy to screw over. and i'm sure if i lived in a sh!tty country (in economic terms) i would do just the same, i dont blame the imigrants - who wouldnt do it in their position?

MorningStar · 05-04-2006 11:48AM

Hobbes wrote:

You have any kind of facts to back that up or you just pulling that out of your arse.

Sorry did I hear you applogise for your stupid comment on Ireland having a major HIV/AIDS and TB problem? The way I see it you pulled that from yourself as I proved.
I suggest you look up the origins of the people seeking asylum here specifically from Nigeria. Find out the wealth places, groups and tribes and see where the Nigerians in Ireland are coming from.
I heard one of the people on the refugee council explain their story. They described an economic migrant not somebody seeking asylum. W

Hobbes wrote:

Asylum seekers stats/rejections etc are freely available on the net, as are Visa listings (posted links above). Unless your on some alternate reality internet I would very much like to see where you got your facts from.

Your first attempt at giving us these facts failed so why don't you prove your point with actual facts and figures. Give us the figure for the number of application for asylum and the number refused. If you like you could break down the resaons for refusal. If you have a valid point I'll accept it but suggesting I made it up when so far you have been proved to be wrong is a bit rich and certainly removes the right for you to be indignant about facts.
VISAs do not equal asylum seekers and you provided a list not figures or statistics go get them and prove your point.

Pythia · 05-04-2006 01:22PM

We also have to remember all the illegal immigrants who don't show up in the figures at all.

nuttz · 05-04-2006 01:28PM

Heinrich wrote:

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1592754&issue_id=13879

I wonder did Kunle miss the flight?

He was too busy getting a one year driving ban!

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1592890&issue_id=13879

Pythia · 05-04-2006 01:30PM

http://www.irishrefugeecouncil.ie/factsheets/dublinconvention4.html

Terribly sorry Hobbes, they must lodge their application in the first EU country they arrive in. Still very hard to go from Nigeria to Non EU country to Ireland.
Considering they're being persecuted and all.

Heinrich · 05-04-2006 01:57PM

nuttz wrote:

He was too busy getting a one year driving ban!

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1592890&issue_id=13879

No wonder he is smiling! He gets a driving ban for no tax and insurance and fined €250. Do you think he will respect the ban, knowing the leniancy of the fine which is being paid for by tyhe taxpayer in the first instance.

This is the second time he was convicted so why not continue on this winning streak!

MorningStar · 05-04-2006 02:07PM

nuttz wrote:

He was too busy getting a one year driving ban!

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independe...issue_id=13879

I never understood why people thought he should be allowed stay. While here he willfully broke the law and he couldn't of made it here honestly. If you come here and seek aylumn you should respect the laws. The minister sent a very bad message by bringing him back.
It is even hard to say things like this without people calling you a bigot or worse.
I am waiting for Hobbes to come smit me

Heinrich · 05-04-2006 02:31PM

MorningStar wrote:

I never understood why people thought he should be allowed stay. While here he willfully broke the law and he couldn't of made it here honestly. If you come here and seek aylumn you should respect the laws. The minister sent a very bad message by bringing him back.
It is even hard to say things like this without people calling you a bigot or worse.
I am waiting for Hobbes to come smit me

I'm waiting for the next offence. Remember one can be constantly breaking the law without being caught. Food for thought.

The Minister is sending out very bad messages of late...

miju · 05-04-2006 02:33PM

Hobbes wrote:

You have any kind of facts to back that up or you just pulling that out of your arse.

Asylum seekers stats/rejections etc are freely available on the net, as are Visa listings (posted links above). Unless your on some alternate reality internet I would very much like to see where you got your facts from.

used to work in the repat unit (the office that deals with leave to remain / JR cases) and i can assue you it's entirely true that about 95% (at least) are financial refugees WHICH IS NOT classed as a genuine refugee anywhere in the EU (and i'm pretty sure the world for that matter)

at the end of the day the asylum seekers coming here are usually faced with the choice of being just below the bread line and having to pay / work to provide for themselves in their home country or coming here and being privded with shelter / food and money (altough not for cars and insurance as i've heard people say before LOL )

what choice would you make?

fao hobbes: i've said this before and i'll say it again, under the Dublin Convention it states that "a genuine reguee should claim asylum in the first safe country that they land in if they are fleeing from persecution" now can you tell me how many countries you go through / over on your way to Ireland via nigeria.

you ever see footage on the telly of people walking on foot miles to get to the border to claim asylum, that's essentially a genuine refugee, they dont care they go just once it's not where they're coming from

so by definition of that yes most of them are financial refugees and to be honest i've talked to plenty of failed asylum seekers (without telling them where i used to work) and they freely admitted that life in Nigeria is **** and are looking for a better life

the majority of asylum seekers coming here are abusing this system and they pass on info to one another about their entitlements to the extent they used to know as much (and in some cases MORE than we knew in the repat unit altough granted we were at the end of the process so we wouldnt neccisarily have to know but you get what i mean)

sceptre · 05-04-2006 02:57PM

miju wrote:

fao hobbes: i've said this before and i'll say it again, under the Dublin Convention it states

fao miju: I've said this before and I'm bored enough for thirty seconds to say it again, the Dublin Convention was replaced by the Dublin II Regulations in 24 out of 25 EU countries in 1998, including this one. Cite current legislation rather than stuff that hasn't been in effect in eight years. It'll make me feel better.

Hobbes · 05-04-2006 03:03PM

Pythia wrote:

http://www.irishrefugeecouncil.ie/factsheets/dublinconvention4.html

Terribly sorry Hobbes, they must lodge their application in the first EU country they arrive in.

Correct.. EU country. While we don't have direct flights to Nigeria a Nigerian can still claim asylum in such instances of...

1) Boarding a flight from a non-EU country to Ireland.
2) Getting on a boat that is going directly to Ireland (if it started off or dropped by Nigeria is immaterial).

MorningStar · 05-04-2006 03:04PM

sceptre wrote:

fao miju: I've said this before and I'm bored enough for thirty seconds to say it again, the Dublin Convention was replaced by the Dublin II Regulations in 24 out of 25 EU countries in 1998, including this one. Cite current legislation rather than stuff that hasn't been in effect in eight years. It'll make me feel better.

so what does it say?

Hobbes · 05-04-2006 03:05PM

MorningStar wrote:

Your first attempt at giving us these facts failed

Only failed because your incapable of reading. Ooh look 5 seconds on the site I find Dublin II and some stats for you.

http://www.irishrefugeecouncil.ie/

MorningStar · 05-04-2006 03:07PM

Hobbes wrote:

Correct.. EU country. While we don't have direct flights to Nigeria a Nigerian can still claim asylum in such instances of...

1) Boarding a flight from a non-EU country to Ireland.
2) Getting on a boat that is going directly to Ireland (if it started off or dropped by Nigeria is immaterial).

Hey Hobbes where are your facts or could you not find any?

MorningStar · 05-04-2006 03:12PM

Hobbes wrote:

Only failed because your incapable of reading. Ooh look 5 seconds on the site I find Dublin II and some stats for you.

http://www.irishrefugeecouncil.ie/

VISA application are not the same as Asylum claims do you understand that?

That was a list of case granted Visas include and American , Australina etc.. who wants to work here.
The Irish Refugee Council is an organisation wanting to get people here and protect those here. The same way I wouldn't trust a Neo Nazi party I don't trust them due to bias.

Hobbes · 05-04-2006 03:13PM

miju wrote:

used to work in the repat unit (the office that deals with leave to remain / JR cases)

Then you should be able to point us to those statistics you are claiming exist, although your knowledge of recent legistration doesn't bode well.

Hey Hobbes where are your facts or could you not find any?

Look above, or do I have to hold your hand to actually click a link?

Hobbes · 05-04-2006 03:13PM

MorningStar wrote:

VISA application are not the same as Asylum claims do you understand that?

That was a list of case granted Visas include and American , Australina etc.. who wants to work here.

ROFL.. you didn't even click the link did you? That site refers to Asylum seekers not Visa applications.

Failed asylum seekers flown to Nigeria

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