My new article

Millionaire · 24-02-2006 05:44PM

fianna.5u.com wrote:

I really worry about you SD guys, genuinely.

Thanks Fianna, thats feels great someone cares!

fianna.5u.com wrote:

I even might open a field of study of you guys with some of my psychology colleagues. I mean just by looking at some of the posts we could open the DSM-IV and have a field day.

Your probably right, but then again, genius borders on insanity!!!

fianna.5u.com wrote:

"Exterminate and Cleanse Unit" = Scum of the earth (and very poorly educated)

I more am into Cleansing and Exterminating...especially after a steak and fried onions and baked beans and a few pints of guniness! LOL!!!

Seriously, someone on here posted that some english cage fighter, had the guts ripped out of him with a knife attack after some page 3 bimbos party in london a few months back. Maybe if he trained some knife defence, he might not have got fatally stabbed??? its a point to consider seriously.

I trained with a guy in Israel who was ex SEAL and also a JKD instructor under Paul Vunak, and he was a real sound nice guy. and of irish catholic decent too!

To be good at knife (or anything else) you got to train it over and over and over and over...and then some more.

For example RBSD instructor Lee Morrisson, and Iwas just watch his DVD this morning, said
with the Close Quater Combatives it got about 8 strikes say, you find the 2 or Max 3 strikes
that suit you the best, and you train those 2 or 3 technique 1000s and 1000s and 1000s of
time so it is just part of you and your SD game plan.
And thats exacty what I did and still do, Palm Shots(chin jab) and Cupped Hand blows (Slaps)
and today I go to the Thai camp early before training call and I train these daily on bags, on pads,
etc. and my boxing training is the same delievery system so the Thai stuff trains it for me too.

25-02-2006 04:57AM

Seriously, someone on here posted that some english cage fighter, had the guts ripped out of him with a knife attack after some page 3 bimbos party in london a few months back. Maybe if he trained some knife defence, he might not have got fatally stabbed??? its a point to consider seriously.

If that was Lee Murray, the guy had a habit of getting into fights - and seems to brag about it (at least from what I've seen). My advice would have been ditch the knife defence and chill out Lee.

Millionaire · 25-02-2006 06:49AM

columok wrote:

If that was Lee Murray, the guy had a habit of getting into fights - and seems to brag about it (at least from what I've seen). My advice would have been ditch the knife defence and chill out Lee.

If it was n't for a knife defence, i would be blind in one or both eyes, from the broken bottle attack last year. (knife defence works for bottle too).

Knife defence is good to know..just in case

on knife attacks. I was in Abrekabera in Rathmines one night with me buddy getting me curried chips!

2 drunk guys get into a fight (one was a bouncer from some pub ) anyway after a diggin match fight breaks up. 5 min later one of the scrappers (and he is mad mad drunk) appears in the door swinging a Samuri Sword, back for revenge. he staggers along swinging and chopping as he is looking for his victim (mean while the bouncer type is turning white with fear)
now me and my buddy as it happened were sort of in between...not a nice situation, and our knife defence was to flatten ourselves against the wall!!!

so there me and marcus was , flattened into a wall, while some crazy drunk guy is swinging and slashing a sword, inches from my nose. I think the situation was that weird, we were actually could not stop laughing. very very luckly someone ran across to the Guards and about 15 guards barged in and stopped the thing! Man, that was close!

Hell I could write a book about all this stuff!!!

fianna.5u.com · 26-02-2006 12:41AM

Hi Dave, leaving aside the fact that you didn't counter any of my agruments just put plenty of smoke around them (which of course is in no way representative of your style of self defence training) I'll counter your comments directly.

Dave Joyce wrote:

Wow, you're some man,

You got that right, usually people say "wow, you're some man for one man".

Dave Joyce wrote:

you don't even have to train STAB and its still top notch, and even better than your "previous" knife defence, I'm SO impressed.

That's right, my previous knife defence was delusional. What I have now is the ability to run well. I don't train stab, I didnt say I didnt need to or am so great in general that I dont need to. I just dont, that said I am still better now than I was then at defending a knife. If you see a conflict there you have either grammer or logic issues. Wiehter I train or not has no bearing on weither STAB is top notch are not. You can see that I hope, its fairly straight forward.

Dave Joyce wrote:

This of course from someone who thinks there no need for all that RBSD "stuff" and no need to learn anything about knives in this country.

How do you think this statement, follows, adds, completes etc the above statement. How would that have anything to do with what I said. Yes "someone who thinks there no need for all that RBSD "stuff" and no need to learn anything about knives in this country." except I am very good at using knifes in the kitchen, "nobody beats me in the kitchen". Are knives in this country different to others? I mean will the knife defence an Israli shows you not work in Ireland?

Dave Joyce wrote:

AND even better, you know so much about SEALS and Taliban, you are sharing YOUR knowledge with us. So, how many of each group have you met or is that just a generalisation about people you've just posted???

No, I clearly am not sharing my knowledge with you. What I am doing is presenting an alternative opinion. This has 2 effects:
1; Hopefully makes you think because I genuinely think that someone who aligns themselves with SEALS is at least one of many bad things.
2; People who come on here not knowing much will see that MMA presents a nice, friendly and realistic enviornemnt. Couple this with all the MMA related posts and soon we have a nice cultural shift that you can't change. MMA is taking over.
In any event your arguement is a waste of time, its like saying how many NAZIs have I met. I can observe actions and outcomes (read: piles of chared corpses from 3rd world countries)

Dave Joyce wrote:

And then you want to lecture me on ethics??? Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!!!!

I'm glad you got a laugh, I dont want to lecture you on ethics although Dr. Stephen Costelloe could, he's an expert in the field. Again, I really dont know where you got the notion that I want to lecture you on ethics, I simply said "Ethics my man, ethics." which of course somehow can be rehashed into "Dave Joyce, I want to lecture you on ethics (in a humouris tone).

Now since I thought your tone was quite personal I'll reply as such. Dave given your grasp of english and logic I can see you are lacking in those fields. Statistics show that people who have poor literacy skills are far more likely ot be involved in a physical assault. Similarly, just anicdotal eveidence would suggest that taking someone completely wrong might add to your likely hood of being in fights. So there are at least 2 ways you can improve your "Reality" Based Self Defence. I too am aware of my terrible spelling so I am taking steps to improve that, to avoid further street fights.

Thats the longest post I have posted in some time, so I think I'll chill for now.

Peace

MaxBax · 26-02-2006 01:51AM

fianna.5u.com wrote:

Now since I thought your tone was quite personal I'll reply as such. Dave given your grasp of english and logic I can see you are lacking in those fields. Statistics show that people who have poor literacy skills are far more likely ot be involved in a physical assault. Similarly, just anicdotal eveidence would suggest that taking someone completely wrong might add to your likely hood of being in fights. So there are at least 2 ways you can improve your "Reality" Based Self Defence. I too am aware of my terrible spelling so I am taking steps to improve that, to avoid further street fights.

Thats the longest post I have posted in some time, so I think I'll chill for now.

Peace

ah lads.

Cabelo · 26-02-2006 04:59AM

Hey kids,

Just thought I'd pop in a little anecdote. Not last saturday, but the saturday before I was waiting for a bus with the girlfriend (and a lovely lady she is). I'm a regular "walking home around pub closing time" young man, so I didn't expect any kind of mischief from the general gang of lads milling about at eleven o'clock.

During our wait for the bus, a lad (later accompanied by 5 or 6 lads and one reasonably terrified young lady) walked up behind me and smashed my right arm with a nice heavy pipe. By the time I'd turned around he had raised the pipe in the over-the-shoulder motion Bambi calls the "caveman". I couldn't lift my right arm (instinct to use my better arm to defend myself) so I was forced to fall back into the dodges we drill day in and day out as part of capoeira.

I'll not say it's the same as knife fighting but I did manage to get well out of the way of a fair few rough swings of the pipe. Regardless, my point is that no amount of genius self defence could have saved me if he had had a knife instead of a pipe. If my arm happened to be in the way of wherever the knife were headed then that's all well and good, but he'd still have had a knife, and as nice as it was to be capable of dodging a pipe I'd have been properly messed up if it were a knife.

My point is that I've been in one unavoidable fight already this year, completely unprovoked (unless you qualify having long hair as provocation). If not for the training I do have it'd be far worse now than my current cuts and bruises.

why do i train ?

I'll be perfectly honest, I love what we do.

why?

There's the added bonus points that it keeps me fit and healthy and burns off my slightly too junk food diet but primarily I love the movements, I love the grace and I love the subtle call and response of watching another player and responding to every move they make. I like having good footwork and I like being flexible.

why ?

"because it makes me feel good"

I stole the last one because it should be everyone's last line, I reckon.

Musashi · 26-02-2006 06:02AM

In my health and Safety trainig we are taught to ask the five "Why's"

These get us to the root cause of industrial accidents?

Try it on any encounter you may have had and see what is the root cause?

On another note I've not met Luke in a while but I will pass on your addy Fianna, Luke is not linked to me in any way other than being one of my instructors?

Musashi · 26-02-2006 07:42AM

This article is by one of the "Gurus" of knife fighting from an RBSD standpoint.
I doubt anyone here can fault his logic or reasoning, even with his being a "knifer" of sorts? Please read what he has to say before ripping into me and my attitude to blade encounters! I'd copy and paste but some lads don't like that?

http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com/knifelies.html

Enjoy!

Roper · 26-02-2006 10:32AM

Cabelo wrote:

My point is that I've been in one unavoidable fight already this year, completely unprovoked (unless you qualify having long hair as provocation). If not for the training I do have it'd be far worse now than my current cuts and bruises.

I'm sorry about the pipe, it's just every time I see long hair I just start swing the damn thing...:)

Sometimes you can't avoid things I suppose.

One question though (stirring the pot!), what about after the initial hit, if it had have been a knife, would you have benifited from knowing some sort of knife defence programme?

Cabelo · 26-02-2006 01:45PM

Hard to say, I reckon I've benefited plenty from the knifework I've already done

and that certainly wasn't advertised as knife defence. I think reflexes are probably more important than anyone else has mentioned.

There's been a lot of "control the arm" and not enough, "keep out of reach of the arm" IMHO.

MaxBax · 26-02-2006 01:50PM

i'm a black belt in nife d-fens.

Dave Joyce · 26-02-2006 10:36PM

Hi Dave, leaving aside the fact that you didn't counter any of my agruments just put plenty of smoke around them (which of course is in no way representative of your style of self defence training) I'll counter your comments directly.

Just where did I not answer any of your arguements, (mind you I'll readily admit I normally TOTALLY ignore anything you have to say), and I will answer them where as I can't you answering my original points, just what you fancy arguing with. So who is blowing smoke up whose ass??

That's right, my previous knife defence was delusional. What I have now is the ability to run well. I don't train stab, I didnt say I didnt need to or am so great in general that I dont need to. I just dont, that said I am still better now than I was then at defending a knife. If you see a conflict there you have either grammer or logic issues. Wiehter I train or not has no bearing on weither STAB is top notch are not. You can see that I hope, its fairly straight forward.

Try READING my post, which shouldn't be too difficult for you seeing as I am a lowly educated working class slob (in your opinion of course) and unlike your superior third level education (once again in your opinion). My point was you totally ignore what a number of posters have already stated when there are times when running is not an option, and yet after ONE STAB seminar which you no longer bother to train, you give your worldly advice on these type of situations. The irony is great, particularly, if I after ONE BJJ seminar started to advise you about your groundgame

How do you think this statement, follows, adds, completes etc the above statement. How would that have anything to do with what I said. Yes "someone who thinks there no need for all that RBSD "stuff" and no need to learn anything about knives in this country." except I am very good at using knifes in the kitchen, "nobody beats me in the kitchen". Are knives in this country different to others? I mean will the knife defence an Israli shows you not work in Ireland?

Call it my poor education but I don't have a clue what the friggin hell you're talking about in this piece!

No, I clearly am not sharing my knowledge with you. What I am doing is presenting an alternative opinion. This has 2 effects:
1; Hopefully makes you think because I genuinely think that someone who aligns themselves with SEALS is at least one of many bad things.
2; People who come on here not knowing much will see that MMA presents a nice, friendly and realistic enviornemnt. Couple this with all the MMA related posts and soon we have a nice cultural shift that you can't change. MMA is taking over.
In any event your arguement is a waste of time, its like saying how many NAZIs have I met. I can observe actions and outcomes (read: piles of chared corpses from 3rd world countries)

A couple of points on this classic piece. Firstly, seeing as the Machados and others train the SEALS, do you regard them in the same light?? I have NEVER argued with no 2 only the "realistic" part, which does not require the same mindset for the street, although perfect for the ring/cage. Maybe its just the grammer you use but comparing SEALS to NAZIS is different and I notice you have observed such actions and outcomes, was this in person and over there or in the media/on the internet???

I'm glad you got a laugh, I dont want to lecture you on ethics although Dr. Stephen Costelloe could, he's an expert in the field. Again, I really dont know where you got the notion that I want to lecture you on ethics, I simply said "Ethics my man, ethics." which of course somehow can be rehashed into "Dave Joyce, I want to lecture you on ethics (in a humouris tone).

Very impressive name-dropping but its wasted on a lowly like me, as I haven't a clue who the good Dr is! However, maybe you can explain EXACTLY what you meant so I wasn't incorrectly rehashing it.

And as for your poor attempts (I would have expected better insults from a third level student) at insults, bring them on, I find them very amusing.:p

fianna.5u.com · 27-02-2006 05:34AM

Dave Joyce wrote:

Try READING my post, which shouldn't be too difficult for you seeing as I am a lowly educated working class slob (in your opinion of course) and unlike your superior third level education (once again in your opinion).

Okay Dave, here's a question, when did I voice the opinion that a/ you are a lowly educated working class slob, and b/ I have a superior third level education. I don't remeber saying anything like that. I'd love to see you quote me on the above, if you cant provide such a quote, maybe an apology would be in order? But I dont epect one.

Dave Joyce wrote:

My point was you totally ignore what a number of posters have already stated when there are times when running is not an option, and yet after ONE STAB seminar which you no longer bother to train, you give your worldly advice on these type of situations. The irony is great, particularly, if I after ONE BJJ seminar started to advise you about your groundgame

Wow, Dave that twice now you didnt understand that realy simple point. Me saying STAB is great and not training it is like you doing one BJJ seminar, never training it again and saying "BJJ is great". You see my point is, I dont have to train STAB for it to be great, it is a separate entite to me. Likewise, you dont have to train BJJ to know it is great. I really hope you can understand that now?

Dave Joyce wrote:

A couple of points on this classic piece. Firstly, seeing as the Machados and others train the SEALS, do you regard them in the same light?? I have NEVER argued with no 2 only the "realistic" part, which does not require the same mindset for the street, although perfect for the ring/cage. Maybe its just the grammer you use but comparing SEALS to NAZIS is different and I notice you have observed such actions and outcomes, was this in person and over there or in the media/on the internet???

There is so much (I wont say wrong) that I fundamentally disagree with in that statement. I have no problem with SEALS being compared to NAZIs only instead of the term "compared" I would say "likened", and he Heidigger is one of the greatest minds ever and he was a NAZI, the MAchados being excelent at BJJ doesnt mean I will sudenly think, "wow, the Machodos, political role models." Once again I hope this illustrates: The Machodos dont have to be SEALS to say the training is excelent, they can simply say it.

Dave Joyce wrote:

Very impressive name-dropping but its wasted on a lowly like me, as I haven't a clue who the good Dr is! However, maybe you can explain EXACTLY what you meant so I wasn't incorrectly rehashing it.

Firstly, I wasnt name droping, you pulled the notion of me lecturing you out of the air, so I suggested someone who might be able to lecture you. Once again, your calling yourself lowly, I hope you are in no way suggesting htat I think that, once again if you do, please show me a quote when I suggested this. Thanks.

Dave Joyce wrote:

And as for your poor attempts (I would have expected better insults from a third level student) at insults, bring them on, I find them very amusing.:p

Once again, when did I try and insult you? If I wanted to insult you I wouldnt bother writing replies to your posts. I just say something stupid. As for you finding these imaginary insults amusing, thats great, I was pleased that you found the imaginary notion of me lecturing funny too. So if you making things up about what I said is amussing to you, thats fine, but I would appreciate it if you kept these thoughts to yourself, that way other people may not start thinking untruths about me.

Anyway, if you have some fundamental beef with me, why not PM me rather than all this cloggin up threads where people might actually like to read some coherant arguments and opinions?

Peace

Dragan · 27-02-2006 11:06AM

Millionaire wrote:

Seriously, someone on here posted that some english cage fighter, had the guts ripped out of him with a knife attack after some page 3 bimbos party in london a few months back. Maybe if he trained some knife defence, he might not have got fatally stabbed??? its a point to consider seriously.

That was in fact Lee Murray, who was stabbed in the heart and it was not in fact fatal. Lee , as far as i am aware from various media reports and interviews with the man himself, went to the defence of some friends outside the club. During the incident Lee thought he had been punched in the chest, but when he looked down he could see a huge amount of blood.

He then staggered down the road where two girls tried to help him.

With or without the influence of alchohol the instincts and awareness of a professional fighter would be second to none, so if Lee did not pick up on someone in the brawl having a knife then it is unlikely that most people would, it would also seem that Lee had very little opportuinity to counter, dodge or even be aware of the blow that delievered the knife would, so i would doubt that any knife defence would save someone in Lee's situation.

Lee is now back in training and is hitting it hard. As he offically at least twice i believe while receving the medical attention needed to bring him back i suppose you could be right in your "fatal" description however. Lucky for Lee it was temporary.

Dave Joyce · 27-02-2006 05:03PM

Wow, Planet Fianna is a great place to be, where all logical discussion can be avoided by clouding debate with waffling and non addressing of points. Its amazing Fianna my boy that you actually accuse me of not addressing points and when I do, you go off on a tangent and bring in all kinds of irrelevant points. However, I do not tire of debate, that is what this discussion forum is here for, as I recall you (and others) saying to posters in the past.

Okay Dave, here's a question, when did I voice the opinion that a/ you are a lowly educated working class slob, and b/ I have a superior third level education. I don't remeber saying anything like that. I'd love to see you quote me on the above, if you cant provide such a quote, maybe an apology would be in order? But I dont epect one.

Once again, when did I try and insult you? If I wanted to insult you I wouldnt bother writing replies to your posts. I just say something stupid. As for you finding these imaginary insults amusing, thats great, I was pleased that you found the imaginary notion of me lecturing funny too. So if you making things up about what I said is amussing to you, thats fine, but I would appreciate it if you kept these thoughts to yourself, that way other people may not start thinking untruths about me.

Right so here you go,

If you see a conflict there you have either grammer or logic issues.

and also,

Now since I thought your tone was quite personal I'll reply as such. Dave given your grasp of english and logic I can see you are lacking in those fields. Statistics show that people who have poor literacy skills are far more likely ot be involved in a physical assault. Similarly, just anicdotal eveidence would suggest that taking someone completely wrong might add to your likely hood of being in fights. So there are at least 2 ways you can improve your "Reality" Based Self Defence. I too am aware of my terrible spelling so I am taking steps to improve that, to avoid further street fights.

Wow, Dave that twice now you didnt understand that realy simple point. Me saying STAB is great and not training it is like you doing one BJJ seminar, never training it again and saying "BJJ is great". You see my point is, I dont have to train STAB for it to be great, it is a separate entite to me. Likewise, you dont have to train BJJ to know it is great. I really hope you can understand that now?

Do me a favour and see where I have called the STAB programme into question, my point (which you continually avoid, of course) is that you offer your expertise in comments about KNIFEWORK, although you don't train it and I offered the comparsion that if I did ONE seminar in BJJ and THEN offered to advice you on your groundgame, how would you feel???

There is so much (I wont say wrong) that I fundamentally disagree with in that statement. I have no problem with SEALS being compared to NAZIs only instead of the term "compared" I would say "likened", and he Heidigger is one of the greatest minds ever and he was a NAZI, the MAchados being excelent at BJJ doesnt mean I will sudenly think, "wow, the Machodos, political role models." Once again I hope this illustrates: The Machodos dont have to be SEALS to say the training is excelent, they can simply say it.

Once again you are clouding the issue, you made the point

1; Hopefully makes you think because I genuinely think that someone who aligns themselves with SEALS is at least one of many bad things.

and I simply asked, do you view the Machados and others in this same light, I mean its a very easy to answer the question, and of course you go on rambling about politics, not a simple yes or no. The only reason I even mentioned the SEALS was in reply to another poster, not to get into the politics of the situation but I suppose this suits your arguement.

Firstly, I wasnt name droping, you pulled the notion of me lecturing you out of the air

, well then why mention the good Dr's name, to simply show my ignorance of not knowing who he is? You still haven't answered my question about, what exactly did you mean by your ethics comment!!!

Anyway, if you have some fundamental beef with me, why not PM me rather than all this cloggin up threads where people might actually like to read some coherant arguments and opinions?

For someone so opinionated, why do you not want to discuss this in the public FORUM, I mean is this not what the discussion board is actually for??? Maybe you think its clogging up the thread (I don't) and if you stuck to the point and not waffled about non related topics, then maybe it wouldn't seem so clogged, dear boy!!

Roper · 27-02-2006 05:10PM

Dave, your link in your sig isn't working.
Just FYI.

Also, keep up the good work lads this is as busy as this forum has been since the days of Dim Mak!

Dave Joyce · 27-02-2006 06:02PM

Roper, my friend, you're a gent. Just got it sorted. I just slagged off Gerry (Millionaire) about getting too many punches to the head in Thailand and just realised I can't spell academy. Frigg it, mocking is catching!!

Also forgot to add to the Lee Murray piece. Before I'm accussed of dissing the man, I think Lee Murray is a great fighter, and I thought he looked great against Jorge Rivera, BUT once again while he is a devasting fighter in the ring/cage, the MINDSET for the street is whats different, (and John Kavanagh agreed with me on this point on a recent thread) and the guys I train with continually point out to people that a guy carrying a knife is not always gonna show you the blade and therefore you gotta train like as if he was armed if you HAVE TO FIGHT. One of the lads I currently train was stabbed on the door one night in Limerick and he said it just felt like he'ed gotten punched fairly hard and didn't know he'ed been stabbed until the head doorman saw the blood. It turned out not only had he received a nasty stab wound but it had punctured his lung also. Apparently, getting stabbed without knowing it, feels just like been punched hard.

Its seems on reflection that a few people have intimated on occasion (not just in this thread) that MAYBE I'm slow to walk away from fights but I've actually been in what I regard as VERY FEW streetfights in my lifetime and have actually avoided/walked away from more!

Dragan · 27-02-2006 06:07PM

Dave Joyce wrote:

and the guys I train with continually point out to people that a guy carrying a knife is not always gonna show you the blade and therefore you gotta train like as if he was armed if you HAVE TO FIGHT.

The first part of that is my point exactly, to the second part i will simply say that why should someone who trains for a sport have to train for knife defence?

Baggio... · 27-02-2006 06:31PM

In response to the article:

No, street fighting is not safe.... It's pretty obvious. No matter what form of M.A. you train in, or how many Dans you have. Yes, we should not get involved in any form of scuffle. However sometimes you have no choice, and you may have to protect your life or that of a loved one.

1.Awareness.
2.Avoid and escape.
3.Protect your Space (using a fence)
4.Talk it Down.
5.Then attack (if you have NO OTHER choice).
6.Get the hell away.

Just my take,

Baggio.

Michael O Leary · 27-02-2006 10:38PM

Hi Dave and Fianna,

As far as I know the Doctor in question is a psycologist and a university professor who I believe lectures in ethics. If it is the same Stephen Costello then he is also a family friend and avid martial artist who practises Escrima together with his Wing Tsun and has no ethical problem with both arts being self-defense based.

Hope this helps.

Michael O'Leary
www.wingtsun-escrima.ie

Dave Joyce · 28-02-2006 05:47PM

Hey Baggio, gotta agree with that post 100%.

Dragan, there is no reason for someone training in/for a sport to do knife defence, but I would put it to you if I lacked any knowledge/ability in the clinch or on the ground AND THEN started to describe to you how you should go about fighting in a MMA event, I would expect to be rideculed (and rightly so), as there is a serious part of my fighting ability missing, particularly when I'm talking to seasoned MMA fighters. However, seeing as we're talking street fights here I think its a bit much for sports compeditors to be lecturing some of the RBSD guys here about how they should/should not train, or offering their expert advice on subjects which most guys DON'T EVEN TRAIN!!

28-02-2006 05:54PM

I disagree with you when you say this Dave...

but I would put it to you if I lacked any knowledge/ability in the clinch or on the ground AND THEN started to describe to you how you should go about fighting in a MMA event, I would expect to be rideculed (and rightly so),

I think anyone has a right to challenge anything. They shouldnt have to pre-qualify to be allowed to discuss something. If what theyre saying makes sense then it should stand without the need for them to have the skills themselves. Example: I can say that Royce Gracies standup is relatively bad even though his is relatively better than mine.

Therefore I think its the statement that should be challenged not the stater.

Dragan · 28-02-2006 05:54PM

Dave Joyce wrote:

Dragan, there is no reason for someone training in/for a sport to do knife defence,

Cool , thats all i was asking, it's just that by the way you phrased you post i thought you were saying the Lee should have included knife defense in his training.

Dave Joyce wrote:

but I would put it to you if I lacked any knowledge/ability in the clinch or on the ground AND THEN started to describe to you how you should go about fighting in a MMA event, I would expect to be rideculed (and rightly so), as there is a serious part of my fighting ability missing, particularly when I'm talking to seasoned MMA fighters. However, seeing as we're talking street fights here I think its a bit much for sports compeditors to be lecturing some of the RBSD guys here about how they should/should not train, or offering their expert advice on subjects which most guys DON'T EVEN TRAIN!!

Not entirely sure where you are going with this, or why you want to put it to me in the first place as if you read back through my post you will see that i have done some self defence and knife work recently, enjoyed it and saw the value and have consistenly put across the argument on this board that people can pretty much train in whatever they want and have the right to do so without having to defend themselves over why. ( this includes the people who knock MMA knowing little about it, TMA knowing little about it , or self defence by making assumptions about it's practitioners. )

All in all, your preacher to the wrong person dude, i just asked a simple question and thanks for answering me.

Dave Joyce · 01-03-2006 03:44PM

Cool , thats all i was asking, it's just that by the way you phrased you post i thought you were saying the Lee should have included knife defense in his training.

Not if he doesn't want to, but my point was just because he a great fighter in the cage (and a big lad to boot!) doesn't mean he'll find it easy during an encounter on the street, particularly when the guy(s) could be armed. Believe it or not, I would agree with MMA guys that you need to be well schooled in the 3 areas to be able to fight (generally), but you also need to include other areas if that is to translate to the street.

All in all, your preacher to the wrong person dude, i just asked a simple question and thanks for answering me.

Hey Dragan I didn't mean you personally, but in the general sense and was just trying to clarify my position.

I think anyone has a right to challenge anything. They shouldnt have to pre-qualify to be allowed to discuss something. If what theyre saying makes sense then it should stand without the need for them to have the skills themselves. Example: I can say that Royce Gracies standup is relatively bad even though his is relatively better than mine.

Ah Jaysus Colm, I don't know if its deliberately mis construing what I meant, but that is WAY OFF the mark!! I totally agree with you that its good to question (not necesscarily challenge which I think is very confrontational) and I encourage my students to question things in training continually but my point and I put it to you, if I was very lacking in groundwork or clinch and then proceeded to lecture YOU on how you should fight in an MMA event, would you not find that I'd have a nerve when part of my game is so lacking?? When some guys on this very forum have espoused what they would do as strikers (only) in a MMA event, they have been corrected and rightly so by MMAers here, that lacking any groundgame would leave them very exposed in a MMA fight.

Michael O Leary · 21-03-2006 12:19AM

Hi Fianna,

I bumped into "Dr. Stephen Costello" this evening and while he is absolutely delighted that his name was put forward to make a point in a forum debate he can't remember who you are. I said that your name was Pearse Stokes but all he could say was that it sounded familar.

Hi Colomuk,

You must have made more of an impression on him as he well remembers you from UCD Aikido and was pleased to hear that you passed on your regards. He told me to say hello.

Sorry everyone for dragging this old thread up.

Michael O'Leary
www.wingtsun-escrima.ie

Michael O Leary · 21-08-2006 11:47PM

judomick wrote:

if someone says i train self defence/martial arts for self preservation i say their full of ****

SorGan · 21-08-2006 11:48PM

Michael O Leary wrote:

:rolleyes:

judomick · 22-08-2006 05:04AM

its a pity Michael, you have obviously missed the whole point, again where have i made a derogatory comment towards RBSD?

My new article

Comments