Eddie Hobbs - Politically Biased?

Cork Boy · 29-08-2005 5:32pm

When we pay ridiculous amounts of money for things we can easily have ourselves, we drive up the prices (eg, prepared salads at the supermarket)
In modern Ireland, being thrifty is equal to being a leper. Funny thing is, do you think millionaires have millions by spalshing the cash??!!!
Its basic free market economics lads, demand dictates price with the exceptions of:

Insurance (monopoly/cartel so free market doesnt apply)
Housing (where demand outstrips supply)

ESB doesnt count cos you can change to solar panels and wind energy
Car Fuel Prices.....ever heard of the smart car/rapeseed oil/walking/public transport?
Eating Out...Try cooking yourself for once, much healthier too!
Drink....If your too cool to be seen dead anywhere but posh bars, then stop complaining bout the prices....pints are a euro cheaper in raheny than in town.

parsi · 29-08-2005 9:15pm

As an aside has he covered the Licence Fee yet or would that be a taboo subject ?

Wertz · 29-08-2005 10:38pm

well even though I had a rough idea of the costs involved in motoring in this country, tonight's show was still an eye opner....the man himself annoys me as does the style of the show, but there's no arguing it's effectiveness. He kind of tells us what we wnat to hear in some cases though.

RainyDay · 29-08-2005 11:20pm

parsi wrote:

but was involved in the whole scandal.

Please explain exactly what you mean when you say he was 'involved'?

Macy · 30-08-2005 8:57am

It's tabloid economics, but he's the first one to make the general public sit up and take notice. The only one's put out by this are the Government Parties who have had the power, the purse and the time to change things.

If his shows make people look beyond their nett pay at the bottom of their pay slip and see how much tax they're really paying then it can only be a good thing for this country. Only FF and PD activists could possible disagree that this would be a good thing.

Cork Boy · 30-08-2005 10:31am

parsi wrote:

As an aside has he covered the Licence Fee yet or would that be a taboo subject ?

I think its very unrealistic to xpect RTE to survive without the Licence fee and rely on advertising alone, or vice versa.
Before anyone says "but the BBC do it" let me remind ye the yes, the BBC doesn't have advertising revenue because it gets licence revenues instead.
However, the licence fee in the UK x Number of Licences is millions and millions more than what RTE generate from advertising AND licence fees!

The second counter argument here is "TV3 manage fine"

TV3 is nothing but (IMO) cheap drivel bought in from America, trailer trash TV thats mind numbing and very cheap to buy. I'd like to see TV3 afford Kevin Myers, Charlie Bird, George Lee and make informative programs like Prime Time.

dregin · 30-08-2005 12:25pm

Macy wrote:

It's tabloid economics, but he's the first one to make the general public sit up and take notice. The only one's put out by this are the Government Parties who have had the power, the purse and the time to change things.

If his shows make people look beyond their nett pay at the bottom of their pay slip and see how much tax they're really paying then it can only be a good thing for this country. Only FF and PD activists could possible disagree that this would be a good thing.

Agreed.

BrianD · 30-08-2005 1:19pm

parsi wrote:

As an aside has he covered the Licence Fee yet or would that be a taboo subject ?

Why would it be a taboo subject? As a community we contribute towards our public broadcaster. Broadcasting is an important form of cultural expression. Like any organisation, RTE has room for improvement but bear in mind there have been some huge employee culls in RTE in recent years. They still produce some of the most popular programmes on radio and TV.

Illkillya · 30-08-2005 1:29pm

BrianD wrote:

Why would it be a taboo subject? As a community we contribute towards our public broadcaster. Broadcasting is an important form of cultural expression. Like any organisation, RTE has room for improvement but bear in mind there have been some huge employee culls in RTE in recent years. They still produce some of the most popular programmes on radio and TV.

I think that Hobbs could show that it is in fact a rip off. It is a taboo subject because the program is being aired on RTE and they would not be too happy to show that.

30-08-2005 1:51pm

Macy wrote:

It's tabloid economics, but he's the first one to make the general public sit up and take notice. The only one's put out by this are the Government Parties who have had the power, the purse and the time to change things.

If his shows make people look beyond their nett pay at the bottom of their pay slip and see how much tax they're really paying then it can only be a good thing for this country. Only FF and PD activists could possible disagree that this would be a good thing.

Aha Macy, we meet again. I would have expected different signature though!!

Of course much of what you say is true. He is a character, he is entertaining, he is a far better presenter than other RTE gob****es like Derek Mooney, he is highlighting an issue that needs to be dusted down. But the stuff he peddles can be very weak. I mean, last night he managed to get through a whole programme about overruns in road contracts without once mentioning the small issue of how land values have shot up, as have the wages for road workers to the point where gangers now come in from England to carry out works here in a reversal of every stereotype. I would have thought that would be central to the issue, yet he didn't even allude to it. As someone said here or elsewhere, he is the Roy Curtis of economics - flimsy tabloid-style patter, jokes about public representatives, and a few anecdotes about getting a mixed grill on a train. Classic cut and paste. If anyone in the Government is worried, more fool them. When the SSIA's are handed out, if Eddie is giving out about the cost to the nation he may well be trampled over in the rush...

Cork Boy · 30-08-2005 1:52pm

Illkillya wrote:

I think that Hobbs could show that it is in fact a rip off. It is a taboo subject because the program is being aired on RTE and they would not be too happy to show that.

I honestly don't think he could prove the licence fee is a ripp off. See my above post? I wonder is there a source where we could do the math or a balalnce sheet?

Serioulsy, how much do RTE spend on quality programming both self made and bought in? I know we like to say if its done here its done by cowboys but RTE also supports radio stations. If someone can show from a reliable source RTE are ripping us off, i'll eat my words on this board

Tazz T · 30-08-2005 2:46pm

Cork Boy wrote:

I'd like to see TV3 afford Kevin Myers, Charlie Bird, George Lee and make informative programs like Prime Time.

Maybe they could afford Eddie Hobbs too!

That depends on what you think is informative and who you think is a good presenter.

Thousands of TV stations throughout the world do without a TV licence. The third arguement you missed is, why not give us the choice to pay for the licence. I'd glady drop RTE1 if I didn't have to pay the fee. I don't think it's worth it. But I don't have a choice.

foxybrowne · 30-08-2005 3:12pm

I've heard that Eddie Hobbs is paid by the Communist Party. Anyone else hear this? Anyone from the Communist Party care to comment?

landser · 30-08-2005 3:16pm

Macy wrote:

It's tabloid economics, but he's the first one to make the general public sit up and take notice. The only one's put out by this are the Government Parties who have had the power, the purse and the time to change things.

If his shows make people look beyond their nett pay at the bottom of their pay slip and see how much tax they're really paying then it can only be a good thing for this country. Only FF and PD activists could possible disagree that this would be a good thing.

Do you honestly believe that every poster in this thread who has criticsed Hobbs is either in the govt. or a supporter of FF or the PD's? Gimme a break.

I am "put out" by Hobbs for all the reasons, and more, that I set out in earlier posts. I disagree with him, because a lot what he says is utter bollocks, misleading, or economically naive. Don't denegrate my opinion, and that of others, to that of some party hack.

Eoin · 30-08-2005 3:30pm

landser wrote:

Do you honestly believe that every poster in this thread who has criticsed Hobbs is either in the govt. or a supporter of FF or the PD's? Gimme a break.

I am "put out" by Hobbs for all the reasons, and more, that I set out in earlier posts. I disagree with him, because a lot what he says is utter bollocks, misleading, or economically naive. Don't denegrate my opinion, and that of others, to that of some party hack.

hear hear!

Cork Boy · 30-08-2005 4:23pm

Tazz T wrote:

Maybe they could afford Eddie Hobbs too!

That depends on what you think is informative and who you think is a good presenter.

Thousands of TV stations throughout the world do without a TV licence. The third arguement you missed is, why not give us the choice to pay for the licence. I'd glady drop RTE1 if I didn't have to pay the fee. I don't think it's worth it. But I don't have a choice.

I plan on having health care but I'll still have to pay my PRSI. TV licence is a Tax, just with a prettier name.
Plenty of stations that do well with no govt revenue don't have such a small audience base as RTE does

Santa Claus · 30-08-2005 4:41pm

Cork Boy wrote:

I plan on having health care but I'll still have to pay my PRSI. TV licence is a Tax, just with a prettier name.
Plenty of stations that do well with no govt revenue don't have such a small audience base as RTE does

PRSI & Health Insurance are 2 very different things aren't they ?

i.e PRSI entitles you to social welfare etc..

Cork Boy · 30-08-2005 4:50pm

PRSI is for pensions, public health services, social welfare etc.

So what i should've said is saying i'd rather have no rte than pay a licence fee and just pay for sky is like saying i'd rather not have to pay PRSI and just pay my insurance/pension scheme etc.

It defeats the purpose of taxes (ie, to try to distribute wealth fairly).

I know the wealth is never distributed fairly but in all fairness, if you're poor enough, you don't have to pay PRSI and still get treatment. You're TV licence is paid for or waived or subsidised.

If we didn't have PRSI we'd be like the US where when you ring an ambulance, they'll ask your insurance number first. If you don't have insurance, they'll ask your credit card number. If you've no credit card, they'll hang up.

So we can't pick and choose which taxes we want to pay, like the TV licence

daveirl · 30-08-2005 7:43pm

This post has been deleted.

Dimitri · 30-08-2005 10:13pm

FinoBlad wrote:

there is an element of truth in this, he does take the pi$$ out of the politicians and is far too personal in his attacks. it would be a lot better to have a balanced documentary and discussion with factually correct information and less pi$$ taking as this is a serious subject.

The problem with an unbiased factually correct show would mean the majority of people would ignore it, every point Hobbs makes has already been made before by analysts, opposition parties and even the odd journalist, but no one took any notice. There is no denying that his tabloid sensationalism is an insult to anyone who has been keeping up with current affairs over this and the previous term of the government. However most people in this country over the past few barely have the time to scratch their own ass yet alone follow the often tedious to watch q & a, prime time or worse still listen to Matt Cooper! Being realistic trying to keep up with rising prices, is very tiring all i want to see or read when i'm not working is nice and simple tabloid sensationalism. My biggest problem with the show is not the political bias but the fact that another alternative is not being suggested. Now while most people believe that tax revenue is being badly allocated and badly spent, i think it is safe to say that tax revenue is needed, he gives out about stealth taxes, but the money must come in somehow he has yet to suggest how a) to generate revenue elswhere or

suggest a more efficient use of the lowered tax revenue.

parsi · 31-08-2005 12:15pm

Cork Boy wrote:

I honestly don't think he could prove the licence fee is a ripp off. See my above post? I wonder is there a source where we could do the math or a balalnce sheet?

Serioulsy, how much do RTE spend on quality programming both self made and bought in? I know we like to say if its done here its done by cowboys but RTE also supports radio stations. If someone can show from a reliable source RTE are ripping us off, i'll eat my words on this board

I mentioned the TV licnece fee originally as it is another one of the so-called stealth taxes that is regularly moaned about (be it right or be it wrong). It would be a nice populist issue as well but the fact that Hobbs ignores it shows that only certain populist targets are acceptable and not the ones that might reflect on his employers...

landser · 31-08-2005 12:39pm

Dimitri wrote:

There is no denying that his tabloid sensationalism is an insult to anyone who has been keeping up with current affairs over this and the previous term of the government. .

you are right, but at the same time missing the point. the style of the show is not the main concern, but rather the content. it is quite easy to be correct and at the same time, entertaining. take the BBC's Watchdog... awful show imo, poorly presented by Thickie Campbell and some bit of eye candy... but, for consmer affairs it works, it is factual and is not just 30 minutes of rant. Rip Off Republic is comment dressed as fact, we are getting Hobb's opinions, not an assesment of the state of the nation. I agree that not everyone can follow in depth economic analysis, but that does not mean that they should be fed this diet of tripe either.

LegacyUser · 31-08-2005 12:50pm

I would rather be fed this ****e than the total and utter crap that our government feeds us every day. Waje up and smell the coffee. No amtter what is said on this forum about Eddie hobbs or Joe Bloggs we all know one thing for a fact!!!! WE ARE BEING RIPPED OFF EVERYDAY and no matter what way you look at it or no matter who you support we are the people that sit and moan about and never do anything. LAzy Ireland ...we get what we deserve and as long as we accept it we may shut up or get out there and do something about it!!

Dellgirl · 31-08-2005 1:13pm

Mary Harney has cunningly disguised herself as Siobhan.Harding!

31-08-2005 1:19pm

siobhan.harding wrote:

LAzy Ireland ...we get what we deserve and as long as we accept it we may shut up or get out there and do something about it!!

Is watching telly Monday night the new 'getting out there and doing something'?

Macy · 31-08-2005 2:11pm

landser wrote:

Do you honestly believe that every poster in this thread who has criticsed Hobbs is either in the govt. or a supporter of FF or the PD's? Gimme a break.

I am "put out" by Hobbs for all the reasons, and more, that I set out in earlier posts. I disagree with him, because a lot what he says is utter bollocks, misleading, or economically naive. Don't denegrate my opinion, and that of others, to that of some party hack.

I suppose it depends if you're expecting it to be a Prime Time style programme or a populist programme aimed at people that wouldn't normally watch current affairs. Personally, I'm happy enough even if it is full of errors and it politicises the large swaths of the population that couldn't care less at the moment. A show like this may mean they watch more serious and factual programmes, and there's going to be a lot of them given his success. That is a good thing imo.

landser · 31-08-2005 2:16pm

Macy wrote:

. Personally, I'm happy enough even if it is full of errors .

i think that sums up the argument against the programme.

Eoin · 31-08-2005 3:11pm

daveirl wrote:

This post has been deleted.

Is there a chance someone could post the text from that page (here)? I can't access the page from work...

Macy · 31-08-2005 3:49pm

landser wrote:

i think that sums up the argument against the programme.

Nice selective editing - if it politicises people who wouldn't normally be. They'll soon discover the true facts, and they still won't make pleasant reading. If it's so riddled with inaccuracies a simple press release comparing and contrasting with the real situation would clear it up - I mean what have the Government got to lose if Hobbs is that bad?

landser · 31-08-2005 4:33pm

Macy wrote:

people still won't read. it's so riddled with inaccuracies a simple press release comparing and contrasting with the real situation would clear it up - Hobbs is that bad

this is selective editing. what i did was to quote your salient point!

daveirl · 31-08-2005 6:55pm

This post has been deleted.

BrianD · 31-08-2005 11:47pm

Illkillya wrote:

I think that Hobbs could show that it is in fact a rip off. It is a taboo subject because the program is being aired on RTE and they would not be too happy to show that.

I wouldn't agree there is no evidence whatsoever to suggest that it is a rip off. Most nations support broadcasting by means of a public subscription such as a TV licence. As I said, broadcasting is an important form of cultural expression that the entire community should pay for. It seems to be a fair contribution and therefore can not be called a "rip-off". Now, there's a satellite delivery platform ...

jank · 01-09-2005 1:44am

daveirl wrote:

This post has been deleted.

Thing is if you go away on a holiday and come back to ireland, do you get the feeling of being ripped off??

Answer for most is yes

SparkyLarks · 01-09-2005 8:23am

you go on holiday and then whenyou come back you feel you are being ripped off.

True but would you like to earn the lower take home pay that the people in those countries earn??

Prices are high because wages are high, wages are high because prices are high.

Eoin · 01-09-2005 9:51am

SparkyLarks wrote:

you go on holiday and then whenyou come back you feel you are being ripped off.

True but would you like to earn the lower take home pay that the people in those countries earn??

Prices are high because wages are high, wages are high because prices are high.

Exactly. I have probably said this already on this thread, but Spain also have a ban on below cost selling. One big difference between Spain and Ireland is that their minimum wage is about 3 or 4 euros cheaper per hour.

Prices over here may have risen in the last few years, but so have our wages.

I know people are talking about the cost of houses etc, but how many people have heard their parents say it was easy for them to get on the property ladder when they were our age? I know I haven't heard that.

And people back then almost never bought on their own - even still they were living in unfurnished houses for months on end before they could afford a stick of furniture.

The fact remains that our prices may be high - but we are still well off. We can still afford many luxuries that our parents couldn't.

jank · 01-09-2005 1:03pm

It may be true for Spain and eastern europe.

But what about, Germany, France, England, USA, Italy.

These are all places where wages are about the same if not higher then here.
Yet things are soooo much cheaper over there than here.

How do you explain that becasue the higher wages malarky wont cut it here.

BY the way ive been to all the above destinations (but Italy) and its sicking how much basic things like clothes are so much cheaper there

01-09-2005 1:16pm

I see the RTE/Eddie Hobbs PR machine had a disappointing day yesterday.

First news story at 9 o'clock last night, 1,000 killed in Baghdad.

Second new story, hundreds dead in Louisiana.

Third up was the Government resuming business after the summer recess to discuss the Colombia Three.

And fourth was about the same meeting failing to address the Eddie Hobbs issue, as RTE had anticipated they would. Imagine, failure to discuss Eddie Hobbs is now considered worthy news by the people who employ him.

All very Wag the Dog/William Randolph Hearst-ish.

Eoin · 01-09-2005 2:05pm

jank wrote:

It may be true for Spain and eastern europe.

But what about, Germany, France, England, USA, Italy.

These are all places where wages are about the same if not higher then here.
Yet things are soooo much cheaper over there than here.

How do you explain that becasue the higher wages malarky wont cut it here.

BY the way ive been to all the above destinations (but Italy) and its sicking how much basic things like clothes are so much cheaper there

Germany and Frances economy is quite weak at the moment. The UK has a far bigger population base, so economies of scale enable them to be cheaper. London is very expensive, whereas other cities may be cheaper. Much like Ireland. I have been to Italy twice, and the prices (apart from most restaurants) did not seem much cheaper.

Some Americans earn higher wages, but I would bet that their percentage of people living in poverty is much higher than ours.

The higher wages "malarky" does cut it. We have more money to spend, so prices go up. It's simple economics.

landser · 01-09-2005 2:09pm

there's a good article in the IT today re Hobbs by Mary Raftery. It focuses on Hobbs' bias and the lack of balance in the show. Anyone still defending him should read it. I'd post a link, but I don't subscribe to Ireland.com... it's a rip-off

nesf · 05-09-2005 10:12am

Personally, and this is just opinion here:

Eddie Hobbs is financial advice for the masses. The show will never appeal to people who like their financial discussion serious because it's not aimed at them. It's pointless to cry out for a more serious treatment of our economy. That will not be shown. Do you honestly think your average person would watch it?

Now, there are issues with some of his "facts and figures". I don't find this suprising tbh, since he is more "sketching out a big picture with nice clear primary colours for the masses" than writing an article for the Economist. It doesn't make them any more accurate or true but they have to be taken in context to an extent.

I would be slow to call him unintelligent or unaware of economics. I've a feeling he knows exactly what he is doing and is going for maximum impact here. Remember, he's talking to people with no background in economics. He is not lecturing them because they would just switch off. I think Pratchett's term "lies to children" is apt here. It's not that your average person couldn't understand more precise economics, it's a matter of them not wanting to. If people were inclined to take an interest in economics and such, then this show wouldn't be necessary now would it?

Comparisons with the 80s are unfair I agree, but in some instances it is very valid. House prices in relation to average wage for that time is extremely valid and something that needs to be in the public mind. We have an extreme housing market atm which has turned mortgages from annoyances to milestones around people's necks. But then, I'm one of those "there is a housing bubble" types so I'm biased in this regard by my own opinion/knowledge (depending on the way you look at it).

In all, this is, imho, a case of people taking tabloid tv too seriously. If you have a decent grasp of economics and markets, or even if you've made the effort to try, you don't need to watch this show. You should already be aware of some of the problems this country does have. It's not as bad as the Hobbs makes out, but it's not as good as the politicians would make out either.

parsi · 05-09-2005 11:50am

jank wrote:

It may be true for Spain and eastern europe.

But what about, Germany, France, England, USA, Italy.

These are all places where wages are about the same if not higher then here.
Yet things are soooo much cheaper over there than here.

We go to France each year and some things are way cheaper (wine, coffee, alcohol, fruit/veg, eating out (bif you don't take drink), water) but plenty things are the same - razors, nappies, toilet rolls, pasta ; and some are dearer petrol (!!), milk (no such thing as 1.19 for 2l own brand - its 86c a litre for Carrefour own brand).

In fact over the last few years we have noticed prices in France creeping up and the newspaper reports bear that out as well - they too discuss rip-off France type stuff and were blaming it for the reduction in French holidaying and home this summer and the reduction in the amount they spent...

None of this is trying to justify Irish prices but more to point out that other countries are having a hard time as well...

06-09-2005 1:34pm

Last night's show was appalling. He has turned the whole issue into a running gag sequence, Eddie with an arrow in his head, Eddie with a dog, Eddie with a jeep, Eddie phoning Psychics Live, Eddie with a budgie called 'Tweetie' etc. etc. Last night was more than just bad economics - the standard charge - but bad television. The lowest point came when he made a big joke out of some Lithuanian walking dogs, and when the audience were all in stitches he told them it was not a laughing matter at all.

Still, at least he did remind us of that Yeats line about fumbling in the greasy till. So it's not a new complaint at all Eddie? Perhaps a show about the Irish being a nation of complainers since the foundation of the State might be apt...only this time he might drop the 'we, the small people' routine which he churned out last night too.

Mr E · 06-09-2005 1:40pm

Hobbs is on the Late Late Show on Friday, face to face with his critics (apparently). I'd put up with Plank Kenny just to watch that, I think.......

Eoin · 06-09-2005 11:54pm

TmB wrote:

Hobbs is on the Late Late Show on Friday, face to face with his critics (apparently). I'd put up with Plank Kenny just to watch that, I think.......

Hobbs said on the last word on Today FM that he would not be appearing on the show, and that he had never agreed to appear in the first place. He said something to the effect of news had "moved on" since the program, so it wasn't worth talking about

07-09-2005 1:35pm

eoin_s wrote:

He said something to the effect of news had "moved on" since the program, so it wasn't worth talking about

I take it he won't be doing a repeat next year.

Wonder will he collect his cheque from RTE this week, or has he not moved on so much as to forget that bit...

Nothing like a good debate, and clearly Eddie wants nothing like a good debate.

07-09-2005 3:02pm

I think there is a big misunderstanding going on at the moment.

"Rip off republic" focuses on the cost of goods and tax and all that, and the main argument against "everything is cheaper in Europe" line is that overheads are cheaper. Wages, lighting, rent etc.

I think we (as an entire nation) are completely missing the point. We are for want of a better phrase, greedy, intolerable, money scrounging, get one over your next door neighbour ba$tards.
It should be about "Standard of Living" not how much (or lack of) coinage is in your pocket. I fervently believe that here in Ireland, we have a pi$$ poor standard of living. I was a bartender in Austria for a year. I earned €5 per hour + tips. It wasn't a glamorous bar by any means, and the Chef (manager/owner) took home slightly more than his staff. We worked a 4 day 8-10 hour week, and my take home pay was usually around €500 (inc. tips).
My outgoings in Austria:
€300 a month rent or €75 a week
Cigs, €2.70 a pack x 7 days = 18.90
My food bill would be around €40
We always kept a bottle of champagne in the fridge too: €28 for Veuve Cliquot
Average price of a pint: around €3.10 for local Lager - €4.50 for imported beer like Guinness or Bulmers.

Could you compare that to Ireland?
My average weekly wage is 5 day week 8 hour day = €550 after tax
€505 monthly rent in an apartment 1/2 the size of the one in Vienna
Cigs, 6.35 a pack x 7 days = 44.45
Food bill would be around €60
Wouldn't keep champagne in fridge as I wouldn't be able to really afford it. But it's about €50
Average price of a pint:€3.90 to €5

So there's my "shopping basket"

If you have ever been to Vienna, you know how beautiful the City is. All workers get free medical and dental work. Street cleaners get paid the same as a bottom rung MP, so there is actually a list you are put on if you want to be a street cleaner. You can buy alcohol 24 hrs a day. Ive shared beers with Juknkies who don't need to Mug you as they are (not exactly accepted) but their condition is more understood than it is here. They get paid more social if their drug tests show the levels are lower than last time they were tested.

So thats it. Wages lower (not by much) Standard of living immensely higher. People are not greedy, they haven't lost that community spirit yet. Oh and most people would rent, as it's cheaper than buying your own place.

I think we are to hold the majority of the blame. The Govt. has f*cked us over time and time again, but they do it, by huge salaries, Consultancy fees that don't answer anything. Various fiascos - roadworks, e-voting etc. And to say that the co-alition has squandered millions is an understatement. But however, the buck stops with us. That's you and me. We were the ones that said, "Mary across the road sold her house for 250,000, do you think I could get 280,000?" We are the ones that ring in sick everytime we feel a slight tummy pain or had one too many the night before, losing productivity, We are the ones that spend a fortune on credit cards and paying (roughly) 18% interest on them. We are the people that charge person "x" so much for a service, but person"y" a little more for the same service as, "they look like they can afford it"

I think it's time to grow up as a country and stop being such miserable greedy batards.

MisterAnarchy · 07-09-2005 3:27pm

you go on holiday and then whenyou come back you feel you are being ripped off.

True but would you like to earn the lower take home pay that the people in those countries earn??

I've worked/lived in the US,UK and Germany and I feel Ireland is a rip off.
I also earned a hell of a lot more there than I do here and enjoyed a higher standard of living.
If a company isnt competitive in these countries it goes bust.
Simple economics.

07-09-2005 6:45pm

Papa Smut wrote:

So thats it. Wages lower (not by much) Standard of living immensely higher. People are not greedy, they haven't lost that community spirit yet. Oh and most people would rent, as it's cheaper than buying your own place.

The benefits of electing a Nazi army officer President? As a matter of interest, would immigrants and Jews in Vienna share your unbridled enthusiasm for that country? I don't mean to detract from what you say - the brother and his wife and kid just spent a year in Vienna for work reasons and loved the place, but again it's easy to portray other countries as lands of milk and honey.

As for the standard of living, I believe some of Austria's own analysts put them fourth in European terms in standard of living...and Ireland second!! But then again, I guess somewhere on an Austrian board there is someone saying how good things are here, we don't elect the Kurt Waldheim's and Jorg Haider's of the world, we don't have a policy of rehabilitation of former nazis, we don't have a leader who described Hitler's social policy as 'exemplary', we have more toleration for minorities, we don't bind gag suffocate and kill deportees (check out the Martin Omofuma case in Austria) etc. etc. Utopia doesn't exist - if the Irish are guilty of anything, it's an obsession with ourselves and how we compare to other countries.

http://wko.at/wp/extra/standort_analyse/oesterreich/AUT_2005_08_EN_A4.pdf

RainyDay · 07-09-2005 10:31pm

Papa Smut wrote:

I think we are to hold the majority of the blame. The Govt. has f*cked us over time and time again, but they do it, by huge salaries, Consultancy fees that don't answer anything. Various fiascos - roadworks, e-voting etc. And to say that the co-alition has squandered millions is an understatement. But however, the buck stops with us. That's you and me. We were the ones that said, "Mary across the road sold her house for 250,000, do you think I could get 280,000?" We are the ones that ring in sick everytime we feel a slight tummy pain or had one too many the night before, losing productivity, We are the ones that spend a fortune on credit cards and paying (roughly) 18% interest on them. We are the people that charge person "x" so much for a service, but person"y" a little more for the same service as, "they look like they can afford it"

Great common sense - and don't forget the other reason why we the citizens need to take responsibility - we elected the Govt in the first place.

Eddie Hobbs - Politically Biased?

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