Why are we looking to charities to help Asian Disaster victims?

logonapr · 31-12-2004 09:56PM #1

We are seeing great examples of generous donations from the general public in Ireland and also in many other countries to a huge number of different charities.
I can't help but feel that we should not be looking towards charities to deal with major disasters such as we are presently witnessing.
I can't understand why more people are not insisting on their governments making massive donations to help. I'm talking about contributions on a level that will be felt by us and not just of amounts that are not much more than the equivalent to petty cash in national terms.
When one thinks we wasted over 50 million on electronic voting it puts our national contribution into context. The US increased their commitment by tenfold today. Sounds great until you discover this is less that their war effort in Iraq costs for just 2 days.
I, for one, would not object to 2 cent going onto my taxes permanently with one going towards poverty and the other for the various disaster appeals. My only requirement would be that an independent agency would manage the funds so as to prevent politicians exploiting it.
If all rich countries (like us!) wanted to we could make a real difference by having a poverty/disaster relief tax.
As great as the 45 million so far collected by Irish charities is, it is really only a drop in the ocean to what will be needed and within a few weeks we will all forget about it as we have about Sudan, Beslan etc once these events disappeared off our news media.

D!ve^Bomb! · 31-12-2004 10:13PM

When i go into work on Sun, i'm gonna leave a collection box by the till in the canteen, and i'm gonna mail the whole building and ask them that if they cannot give much, at least give whatever change you get from when you pay for your dinner/lunch, hopefully, after a week or so there'll be a couple of hundred saved up in change..

logonapr · 31-12-2004 10:24PM

All very laudable but surely we need a better respoonse than boxes beside tills etc.
With so many charities all doing their own thing and many of them spending a good bit on administration and fund raising I feel that as well intentioned as it is that charities are not the way forward.
Arguably they mainly help ease our own consciences as even with all these charities in place for years have they had any more effect than a band aid.
Surely it is time that a real response is given and this can only be done by the governments of the wealthier nations.

MojoMaker · 31-12-2004 10:26PM

45 million collected by Irish charities?? Surely you mean the €2m pledged thus far. We'd be doing bloody well to ever collect €45m...for anything.

gandalf · 31-12-2004 10:31PM

Err that 45 Million has been collected by British Charities !!!

Irish Charities have collected around 3 Million so far with the government pledging €10 million.

Uthur · 31-12-2004 10:41PM

Apparantly more than 50% of money collected by a typical charity ends up going into administration and advertising etc. In chronic cases this has been known to rise to 90% - and that's for the honest charities! I'm not saying that governments could do a more efficient job (they probably couldn't) but at least it would remove the advertising costs (which are massive for tv).

logonapr · 31-12-2004 10:43PM

Sorry meant to say 45 million in UK and around 3 here. Even if it doubles, triples or quadruples in all the countries collecting it still will only make a tiny, tiny dent in extent of problem. It also will do nothing for future disasters or poverty that is ongoing.
Not trying to knock peoples generosity or intentions but simply questioning if the charity route achieves anything beyond easing our own consciences.

is_that_so · 31-12-2004 10:44PM

I find myself both agreeing and disagreeing with the post. I think the sentiment is well-meant but unfortunately it forces people into giving to charity. Charities themselves speak of "donor fatigue" and I think it is true. There is only so much we can give. We give according to our means. There are many other charities that do other types of work. In an ideal world many of these would not be needed to help children ,women, disabled etc. It is also true that stories disappear off the radar- 30 days is the shelf-life of a story unless someone keeps it alive which is where activists and charities come in.
As regards world poverty most of the answer is with governments and banks.
http://www.jubilee2000uk.org/

Drop the Debt !!

MojoMaker · 31-12-2004 10:52PM

How many people prepared to stay in tonight and donate the otherwise pi$$ed away €100-odd to the Red Cross?

Might be a better reflection of the spirit of the Irish people. There's not a lot we can personally do but fronting our booze money is certainly a step in the right direction.

is_that_so · 31-12-2004 10:54PM

Pubs and clubs are being asked to have charity buckets available so maybe some good will come out of the evening

alleepally · 31-12-2004 11:23PM

The UN guy was entirely right and the OP is correct. We have to lobby our Government to meet development targets... A small nation like ours can make a difference...

www.keepourword.org

But in the meantime.... Put anything you can in a collection box... There's a collection at all masses at the weekend if you run out of money in the pub!!!

D!ve^Bomb! · 31-12-2004 11:45PM

i think you underestimate the power of a collection box.. a box beside a till may seem small, but like the saying goes, 'every penny counts'. and it contributes a hell of a lot..

Oh yeah, anyone any idea what i could use as a collection box

all i have is on big tin can that used to house lollipops:)(approx 1ft high) but that's it.. if possible i'd like to have a few, maybe one in each kitchen(there's a kitchen on both floors).. that way when people get a can or a bar, they can put their change into the box...

Besides, some poeple are actually really generous and will stick a fiver or a tenner in there as well.. it all adds up.

The Real B-man · 31-12-2004 11:48PM

exacltyl why should charitys in ireland have to pay for life saving machines in hospitals in a well developed country like ireland???

Oriel · 01-01-2005 04:36AM

More importantly,
What the **** is money going to do, really?
That's not what makes the world go round, so why is it going to make the difference in a place where money is of no help?

Human aid is what is needed most.

Please help.
Trust me, if there was a way I could go out there, I would.

S.

simu · 01-01-2005 04:45AM

sinecurea wrote:

More importantly,
What the **** is money going to do, really?
That's not what makes the world go round, so why is it going to make the difference in a place where money is of no help?

Human aid is what is needed most.

Please help.
Trust me, if there was a way I could go out there, I would.

S.

???

Provide medical staff & supplies, food, clean water, shelter, help with rebuilding etc etc

JackKelly · 01-01-2005 05:08AM

sinecurea wrote:

More importantly,
What the **** is money going to do, really?
That's not what makes the world go round, so why is it going to make the difference in a place where money is of no help?

Human aid is what is needed most.

Please help.
Trust me, if there was a way I could go out there, I would.

S.

Seriously,think about the first part. The money goes to the buying of everrything basically.

I agree with the "if i could go out there" thing though.

chewy · 01-01-2005 05:09AM

i duno if theres a dfiference betwenn cahrities and development NGO's

the red cross is asking for cash donations so it spend money on food in the local country rather then buying and shipping it from the uk...

you could alwasy donate to local ngo in the countries themsleves rather then international agencies cut down on layers of beaucracy...

de5p0i1er · 01-01-2005 05:13AM

logonapr wrote:

I, for one, would not object to 2 cent going onto my taxes permanently with one going towards poverty and the other for the various disaster appeals. My only requirement would be that an independent agency would manage the funds so as to prevent politicians exploiting it.
If all rich countries (like us!) wanted to we could make a real difference by having a poverty/disaster relief tax.

You can't force ppl to give to charities just because something bad happens in the world. We all should make donations to things like this but some ppl won't and you can't force ppl to give away there money.

is_that_so wrote:

Pubs and clubs are being asked to have charity buckets available so maybe some good will come out of the evening

I was in to pubs this evening and both had buckets on the bar and at some point during the night one of the bar staff went around the bar with the bucket and asked for money from everybody.

chewy · 01-01-2005 05:15AM

went to the keepourword site and signed the petition but why is the minister tom kitt who's government is refusing to keep their word standing smiling along with bono about keeping our word... is this not totally a government decision?

is_that_so · 01-01-2005 12:33PM

sinecurea wrote:

More importantly,
What the **** is money going to do, really?
That's not what makes the world go round, so why is it going to make the difference in a place where money is of no help?

Human aid is what is needed most.

Please help.
Trust me, if there was a way I could go out there, I would.

S.

The agencies themselves asked for cash. They can buy things cheaper locally. As for volunteering those agencies that are recruiting are looking for people with experience. However much any one of us want to go out there and help, someone with no experience with humanitarian crises would be no help in this situation, more of a hindrance. Money is our form of human aid.

alleepally · 01-01-2005 01:50PM

chewy wrote:

went to the keepourword site and signed the petition but why is the minister tom kitt who's government is refusing to keep their word standing smiling along with bono about keeping our word... is this not totally a government decision?

The government quite neatly focus the attention on dropping the debt campaign , hence the Bono connection whilst quietly rowing back on the commitment to ensure 0.7% of GDP goes to foreign aid. Both issues are interlinked of course but the latter is one we can directly influence. If enough people send those letters and sign the petition, politicians will take note. 13,000 or so have signed cards and the petition online..... I've had responses from ministers on the issue by post and I'm not satisfied with the answers I got so I'm going to continue writing to them. I am also sending a letter to the local newspaper to highlight the issue - we can't let this commitment on foreign aid slip. It's not good enough.

alleepally · 01-01-2005 02:00PM

de5p0i1er wrote:

You can't force ppl to give to charities just because something bad happens in the world. We all should make donations to things like this but some ppl won't and you can't force ppl to give away there money.
.

Your quite right, we can't force people to give away their money and aid agencies consistently say that private donations cannot be depended on which is why the agencices are heavily involved in issues such as the millenium goals, fair trade, dropt the debt.

Each and every one of us MUST ensure that we lobby politicians to ensure that we meet our foreign aid obligations.

As an example, the plastic card tax the government enforced a few years back. A sneaky and unfair tax...I would have no objections if this tax were renamed as a foreign aid tax... It raises 70 MILLION A YEAR!!!! Eh, sorry Bertie - 10 MILL doesn't cut it me old mate.. I want the card tax to go to save lives...

alleepally · 01-01-2005 02:07PM

Make Poverty History

Just launched today... I'd urge everyone to start wearing the white band this year. Make it your new years resolution. A brilliant concept and a very visible way to get more people thinking about the issues of aid, debt and trade

http://www.makepovertyhistory.com/home.html

JackKelly · 01-01-2005 02:56PM

i would happily buy one as long as it doesnt turn out like a Lance Armstrong thing with everyone wearing them cause they look good. Out of the 3 friends of mine who have the yellow ones, none of them payed for them.

Edit:Actually, the white bands are a far better idea. Its more of a gesture.

MojoMaker · 02-01-2005 08:52PM

alleepally wrote:

The government quite neatly focus the attention on dropping the debt campaign , hence the Bono connection whilst quietly rowing back on the commitment to ensure 0.7% of GDP goes to foreign aid. Both issues are interlinked of course but the latter is one we can directly influence. If enough people send those letters and sign the petition, politicians will take note. 13,000 or so have signed cards and the petition online..... I've had responses from ministers on the issue by post and I'm not satisfied with the answers I got so I'm going to continue writing to them. I am also sending a letter to the local newspaper to highlight the issue - we can't let this commitment on foreign aid slip. It's not good enough.

Yeah yeah, foreign aid is sooo much sexier than domestic aid. Really tugs at the heart strings watching flies crawling over the face of African children but what about the very serious homeless problem in Ireland, particularly Dublin. I agree it is in no way atractive to stand up and face a problem like that, a problem of our own making. Far too close to home for that.

Rozabeez · 02-01-2005 08:55PM

I'm hoping that my Youth Club will hold something to collect money, hopefully we can do a few things. Any ideas?

dangerman · 02-01-2005 09:05PM

It's an impossible conundrum.

Should I give according to my means? Well what does that mean? I don't need the computer I'm typing this on, I don't need to go out tonight I don't need...

I don't have a full time job...should I go over and help? Could I help?

It's an impossible balance to strike.

One thing on the news tonight was the suggestion that the Irish army should go - I 100% agree - I'd send a bunch of EU battlegroups too.

interesting point of view in this article on why the us goverment shouldn't give any money:
http://www.aynrand.org/site/News2?page=NewsArticle&id=10688&news_iv_ctrl=1021

The United States government, however, should not give any money to help the tsunami victims. Why? Because the money is not the government's to give.

Blisterman · 02-01-2005 10:01PM

I think it should be up to the individuals to give money, not the government. I'll be giving money to them.

alleepally · 02-01-2005 10:53PM

MojoMaker wrote:

Yeah yeah, foreign aid is sooo much sexier than domestic aid. Really tugs at the heart strings watching flies crawling over the face of African children but what about the very serious homeless problem in Ireland, particularly Dublin. I agree it is in no way atractive to stand up and face a problem like that, a problem of our own making. Far too close to home for that.

Excuse me but that's bullsh1t... You're assuming a lot there. I feel strongly about this issue AND many others too - and you're right - homelessness is an absolute disgrace and if you feel strongly about it tell others in a positive way and make them care too. Don't assume someone doesn't care about domestic issues just because they are passionate about foreign issues....

captainplanet · 02-01-2005 11:40PM

150,000 people? in one disaster? over 40 million people have died from aids in africa. since the asian disaster, over 150,000 people have died from aids. by 2025, 80% of children in africa will be orphans.
how about giving some of that money to help them?

elivsvonchiaing · 03-01-2005 12:06AM

... From dangerman's link: "David Holcberg is a research associate at the Ayn Rand Institute in Irvine, Calif. The Institute promotes the philosophy of Ayn Rand, author of Atlas Shrugged and The Fountainhead."

Seriously thought this post (on link - not Dangerman;s); Holcberg's, was from an 11 year old! The idea that the world is unconnected; is what you would expect from from some white-racist bitter jerk gas-pump attendant that has to remember his high-school Spanish when speaking to his boss.

American foreign policy completely ignored - lack of payout to Americans from US army induced health problems - totally ignored.

This man is an arch-asshole!

Why are we looking to charities to help Asian Disaster victims?

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