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Ireland Team Talk XII: Farrell's First Fifteen

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 730 ✭✭✭darkened_scrum


    We also blew a couple of really good chances ourselves. Crossfield kick to nobody in the first half with England on the back foot, interception in the second half when it looked impossible to not score, knock-on that may or may not have been a knock-on, contact in the air that might not have been a penalty, etc.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,067 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    I wouldn't argue that Casey does those things for Munster, and I'm sure he is a good leader. I haven't seen do much in that regard with Ireland, even accounting for his reduced minutes. Perhaps it's hyperbolic, but I doubt any team devotes time to working out how to deal with Casey as a threat.

    Put it this way, before his injury last season, Casey was playing at his ceiling. Doak is already matching that, if not exceeding it imo, for Ulster and has potential to improve beyond that. I don't see Casey having much of a hold on the 9 jersey going forward, post JGP. For me Doak and Murphy look to be the most likely heirs after 2027.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,315 ✭✭✭✭phog


    I thought Casey was captain for the summer tour.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 42,774 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Nobody is even taking about Ben Murphy. He's developing nicely with Connacht. I think he'll be considered shortly. He's 24 as well.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    Put it this way, before his injury last season, Casey was playing at his ceiling. 

    I'm not sure I'd agree with that tbh; Casey is only 26, and if you compare him to JGP, he didn't get his first international cap til 28, I think, and wasn't even in Farrell's first squad for the 6 Nations.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,067 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    ok, from your perspective, what can he do to improve from there? His passing and kicking are already very good. He's unlikely to improve physically, which fundamentally is what holds him back. He could become more of a general on the field, in the French mold, but Munster don't play like that, if I'm not mistaken. Doak is given that role for Ulster and is inherently more of a physical threat.



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,928 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    This was absolutely top level sh!thousery from Ryan near the end.

    fair due to JGP for playing along as well.

    🤣



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,759 ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    I think his kicking has tapered off; about 18 months to 2 years ago it was much better, imo. His form too has dipped too, but he was excellent back then, imo.

    I also think he needs more minutes vs Tier 1 nations. Outside of the Italy game, his minutes in 7 of his last 8 Tier 1 games, in reverse chronological order are: 9, 8, 8, 10, 13, 15 and 7. That amounts to 70 minutes across 7 caps, but you're really not giving him any opportunity to influence the game.

    But the obvious one, imo, is his decision making; which is exactly the thing that JGP improved dramatically to make him the player he is today.

    I really don't think it's accurate the suggest Casey, at only 26, has hit his ceiling yet. I doubt any player has, tbh.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 1,883 ✭✭✭Ben Bailey


    Would agree on most of this. Always recall Justin Marshall being adamant that 9s should be replaced after 60 mins max on the basis that if your 9 is not absolutely flogged by 60 mins he hasn't been doing his job. JGPs ability to play 80 at his pace & at his age is truly exceptional, and not something we should be expecting any 9 to do. Switching out your half backs at 50-55 mins would be ideal. Would help Casey further improve his decision making, but apart from an occasional snipe where even a half tackle usually stops him, his abilty to find his 10 or 12 in phase play is exceptional. It's in broken play that his decision making, particularly compared to the best 9s, is sometimes weak. Still time for him 'though.

    Post edited by Ben Bailey on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,242 ✭✭✭Bogwoppit


    So what you’re telling us is that we would have conceded more scores if we didn’t defend as well as we did or if we were playing against better opposition.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,067 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    I don't entirely disagree, he could certainly grow as a leader on the field, but Casey needs to show that game managing ability at club level before he be entrusted to do so for Ireland. JGP benefited massively from Sexton, he really didn't take on that role until after 23, and you can see an example of how he floundered with it in the 2nd La Rochelle final, where he ignored Bryne and we ended up fluffing the lines.

    I think Doak has been thrust into that role for Ulster, and worked through difficulties to become the player he is now. Feel we ought to be looking to utilise that, and give him an opportunity to build on it in green. Probably shouldn't be asking a player, like Casey, to learn a new skill set in the hardest of environments.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,090 ✭✭✭ironingbored


    Watching Against the Head and Jackman did a piece on Ireland's work at the breakdown. There were some outstanding examples of insanely accurate clean outs that prevented turnovers.

    JvdF on Pollock when JGP made the break.

    Ryan on Genge.

    Ringrose, Lowe, Furlong, Loughman other examples of note.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 27,315 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Jaysus, that YouTube of the match is a tough listen with Mark Robson on the comms



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,501 ✭✭✭almostover


    Yes and he could well be picked to bench vs. Wales. I'm just saying that I think it would be better to go with Sam, especially in a 5/3 bench. It's a good opportunity to give him time to steer the ship home v Wales to rebuild his confidence.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,054 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    I am not advocating one player over another but surely they should develop at their club in the higher end games in the URC and European games. Like JGP did at Leinster. Like Murray did at Munster. They need to be ready for Ireland by what they learn and experience under the direction of their own coaches, not finishing their apprenticeship in Green. They might then get even better if they are frequent starters.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,627 ✭✭✭Felexicon


    I can see how they could go with Sam starting against Wales.

    It would be harsh on Crowley but you tell him he's definitely getting the Scotland game.

    What other upcoming game can they get Sam back in the team? Wales are the weakest we'll face for a while.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,784 ✭✭✭BoardsMember


    I heard on a Podcast earlier that Ireland were 30% quicker ball to first receiver when JGP replaced Casey v Italy. If speed is Casey big thing then he needs to be less ponderous. I've always thought him quick but he looked slow v Italy and the stats back that up.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 166 ✭✭Jelly Welly


    SP needs to rebuild at Leinster first and be clear first choice 10 there (which he is not)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,627 ✭✭✭Felexicon


    I don't think AF agrees with you. Crowley and Prendergast are still options 1 and 2 for Ireland. Harry Byrne sent back to Leinster probably signals he won't be involved in this tournament.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,791 ✭✭✭50HX




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,067 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,414 ✭✭✭✭bilston


    I have ears and enjoy listening to him. Each to their own.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,414 ✭✭✭✭bilston


    No chance they go back to Prendergast for the Welsh game. Crowley should keep the jersey until there is a compelling case for Prendergast to win it back.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 813 ✭✭✭padraig.od


    Robbo is great! Do you have link for the game?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 309 ✭✭big-al


    yeah, he’s a decent commentator.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,792 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    Robson’s bizarre similes grate on me a bit but I love his passion for the game. Give me that over Hugh Cahill or Conor McNamara any day



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 44,928 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,272 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    Bundee didn’t impress much this season so I can’t see him coming in. But maybe he plays for Connacht this weekend and then it can be assessed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,272 ✭✭✭lawrencesummers


    The issue might not be speed of pass but the way Casey delays until he has the 10 in his sights.

    JGP during phase play gives players no choice or time to make a decision he just hits whoever is out there, Casey tends to always look for the 10.

    It’s very obvious to watch at times and that increase in recycle and distribution is not defendable in phase play as long as the attacking team don’t make handling errors



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,228 ✭✭✭TRC10


    Baloucoune wouldn’t have got a shot had Hansen and Keenan not been injured. Yes he was injured last season but there was also a period around 2021-23 when he was unplayable but hardly got a look in because he didn’t “fit the system”. He’s 28 now which for a winger is on the older side so his best years are likely behind him. McCloskey made his debut a decade ago. He’s now 33 years of age and only now is he getting a proper go. Now you could say “oh but we’ve had Aki and Henshaw”, but I’d argue that what Stu is delivering now is better than anything Henshaw has delivered in a long long time. Imagine the impact he could have made if he was given a go sooner. Same goes for Nick Timoney.

    I just worry that with a lot of the “next crop”, we’ll find ourselves in a similar situation, with them only getting a shot in the twilight of their career when it’s forced upon the coach, and we find ourselves realising that they’re actually good players who can make an impact at test level and wondering what if that had gotten a chance sooner



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