Cross-border review of rail network officially launched

That is absolutely not accurate. The "mid section signal" extends 600m outside of Galway station, and simply allows a platform to be cleared so an arriving train has somewhere to go. The entire line after this to Athenry is single track.

The passing loop will double maximum capacity, and it will be much easier to operate the line closer to maximum capacity, once the loop is complete.

Okay thanks for reminding, I do recall this now. This doesn't change my valid point that the Oranmore passing loop will double maximum capacity on the line.

Looking at the timetable, it looks like only 2x trains utilize the mid-section during the morning: the 06.25 to Heuston leaves Galway 10 minutes after the 06.15 to Limerick, and the 09.05 to Heuston leaves Galway 13 minutes after the 08.52 to Athenry.

When this mid-section is used, it delays trains coming from the other direction, so it does nothing for overall capacity. So in summary, the Oranmore passing loop will magically double maximum capacity

Yes, so we're agreed then? Theoretical maximum capacity will be doubled.

Considering the line doesn't currently operate at maximum capacity, then clearly the upgraded line (with passing loop) will allow new services from Tuam / Claremorris / Westport without the prerequisite of doubling the entire section from Athenry.

It should go without saying that double tracking is needed in the medium term.

It is not doubled, at best 50% increased.

You can send two trains out 10 minutes behind and cross two in Athenry and then send two back in. Also cross at Galway loop which was used as well.

Adding a loop where there was a mid section split, doesn’t double it.

It will be useful, but Oranmore should always have been built with a loop. Even when it was being considered, the Galway line was chocker and suffered delays. Additional obvious loops help reduce some of the delays.

yes. the capacity increase at one point in the network doesn't automatically address bottlenecks elsewhere. The trains need to be timetabled to pass on the passing loop at exactly the right time to get its benefits. The more trains you add, the less likely this is possible. And at this location, where the Galway to Dublin governed by Heuston not Ceannt, the flexibility of the train timetabling is constrained. so you end up with flighting and dwells as I mentioned.

There is effectively no ceiling on how much you can spend on infrastructure so this argument just avoids the fundamental question whether spending money on providing a service like this makes any sense at all.

I actually know someone who commutes from Limerick to Nenagh and you could rebuild the line as high speed twin track electrified service with a new fleet of luxury train sets with bars and restaurant cars running half hourly and he still wouldn’t use it even if it took 15 minutes by train. Because it’s not the train segment of the trip that’s the issue.

He lives in Caherdavin so his options on a dark blustery cold winter morning are: hop in his car and drive to the door of the factory in 35 minutes while listening to the news. Or he could walk to an unsheltered bus stop, wait for a bus (or walk 25 minutes to Colbert), board a train and then face a 25 minutes walk the other end.

The idea that a change of schedule would unlock a flood of demand for the service from office workers working in Nenagh who commute daily from limerick is fantasy.

The train just has no useful role for anyone doing this trip particularly regularly or daily. The service should be abandoned and the resources dedicated to providing train services which people actually want to use. The world where a service like this could be a success doesn’t exist and hasn’t for nearly a century.

It’s an anecdote based on the reality of the utility of this service not some rail for rail’s sake fantasy. I’m guessing you’ve never used this service nor would you ever use it regardless of schedules and timings.

I’m describing the choice facing all potential passengers you imagine would flock to the service if we invested more in it. The timings are irrelevant - it’s the lack of catchment and demand.

Colbert is poorly located and Nenagh station Is even worse. For the vast majority of people in Nenagh AND Limerick, this service is useless. Then if you consider the actual intersection of people living near one station and working near another, it’s no surprise that having less that 10 people on a train isn’t unusual.

The service is trashed in terms of speed, catchment and frequency by bus never mind private cars.

This is the reality of “regional” rail in Ireland - championed by people who won’t use it never mind residing in the catchment area. Nobody in limerick or Nenagh cares.

We have train services in Ireland carrying crush loads but you want to continue wasting money running slow infrequent unwanted train services carrying 5 or 10 passengers per train. It’s madness and the sort of thinking that has resulted in prioritizing a Claremorris service over DART+SW.

Lol “all the Clare and Tipp commuters” - why not be honest here? You mean the 19 passengers per day at Birdhill, the 7 per day at Roscrea, the 11 per day at Cloghjordan, the 43 daily at castleconnell or the 58 at Nenagh? These are the actual number of daily boardings recorded in 2024. We’re running a train service where the entire daily passenger count could fit on not much more than a single double decker bus. It’s simply madness.

just to be clear once again.
athenry to claremorris is not being prioritised over dart+sw, it has absolutely nothing to do with the government deciding to put back that project and it would still be put back even if athenry to claremorris doesn't happen (which i believe it won't reopen) any time in the near future.
you wouldn't get much capacity freed up by limerick to ballybroaphy no longer running, 2 2 car sets at most and the fleet down in limerick isn't exactly worked hard as it is.

Perhaps the poor patronage is also due to only 2-3 daily services. Hardly one that encourages high usage. Better to maintain an existing alignment, with minimal service, than leave it to rot.

I agree: when the reason/justification given was "funding" then anything else getting funded first/instead is being "prioritised". We can all argue about exactly which euro was going to which project and when but overall DART+SW is not being funded while other projects are.

And again to reiterate I have no horse in this race because I'll use neither line, both look like good projects but it looks to me like one of them would have yielded a large net benefit and the other one a modest net benefit. It looks like politics to me. Unfortunately

https://colbertquarter.ie/

There are already plans in train for the Colbert area.

Have you looked at the alignment? It wasn’t even built for passengers - it was built to carry cattle and pigs for processing in Limerick so the stations are mostly in the countryside. I’m even surprised that 19 people per day (both directions) use a place like Birdhill - have a look at a google maps and tell me that offering a “commuter service” in an area like this (farms and forest as far as the eye can see) is anything but a joke. Roscrea has a manned station so that 7 people per day can get the train. 🙄

This line wasn’t even viable as a passenger service back in the 1950s when car ownership was a luxury only afforded by a small segment of population. While today the entire route lies within a few km of a modern motorway. And most of the major trip generators in limerick like the factories of Raheen, the regional hospital or UL are near motorway exits and nowhere near Colbert which means after spending twice as long sitting on a train, you’re still 30 minutes from your destination. And with the isolated nature of the stations means you’re driving just to get the train anyway. Why would you bother?

Can I ask, like I’ve asked breezy, is there ever a case for you where rail is NOT the appropriate public transport solution?

At 1/50th of the budget you could offer an all-day twice-hourly bus/coach service, that would be twice as fast and could serve the likes of UL or Raheen as well as offering stops near where people actually live in places like Nenagh (instead of picking up people from a location chosen to suit 19th century cattle collection - deliberately distanced from the town center).

I think you’re understating the line’s historical importance. All Dublin-Limerick trains used the line until they were redirected via Limerick Junction in 1967. Not that that means it must be kept. There are valid arguments on both sides. While it is true that the line is heavily subsidised, once it’s closed it becomes quite hard to open it again. Had the Navan line not shut in 1963 we wouldn’t need to spend ~€3 billion to open it. The timetable isn’t great either: if I lived in Nenagh and worked a 9-5 in Limerick city centre, while the morning train would suit fine, I’d have 2 hours to spare before the train left back home, which is hardly ideal.

Nenagh is the same ride time as Ennis so why is the alignment a problem if it isn't for Ennis ?

As for buses you are back to being stuck in all that traffic car drivers in Limerick spend their entire working week btching about and delayed unreliable buses that everyone btches about because of said traffic.