DCC wants to rename Herzog Park

it would satisfy everyone else though.

These councillors did not become councillors to improve footpaths or serve citizens. They are there to rant about places on another continent 5500Km away.

what is described as Islamophobia is actually a perfectly rational response to a stupid religion.

also Judaism as a religion isn't quite as bad as it's not a proselytizing religion whereas Islam is.

considering the negative impact Islam has had on all the countries it has gained prominence in , considering the negative cultural practices associated with it , it is perfectly reasonable to not want it spreading within your country and to have negative feelings about Islam as a religion .

All religions are stupid.

Some are far more damaging than others in the present day though. Barbaric behaviour 400 years ago is irrelevant in the present day, it doesn't impact anyone today. Nigerians being killed because of their religion today is relevant as it impacts people who are alive today.

the park renaming thing sure is needless nonsense , those councillors could have just left things as it was

I have no problem hating Judaism as a religion , it's complete nonsense aswell.

The religion itself and it's practices and traditions isn't why people dislike Jewish people though, they just dislike them for the sake of it.

There are genuine reasons for disliking Islam as you can see the damage it does across the world and has done, Judaism doesn't cause much damage across the world, they don't actively try and convert people they don't have quite as many negative cultural practices as Islam has therefore it isn't as bad.

Absolutely. Orthodox Judaism is almost as bad as Islam in how women are treated although TBF I don’t think they have rules on how to correctly discipline your wife. I could be wrong on that. But the way women are refused divorces when men are allowed them, the refusal to shake a woman’s hand because she might be unclean, and the general concept that woman needs purification anyway just revolt me.

I also find the idea of men spending their lives studying the Torah while the women not only bear multiple children and do the associated work but also (in NY anyway - I guess in Israel they’re probably state-subsidised) are the main wage earners just complete serfdom for women.

I bet nobody’s going to call me antisemitic for saying all that though. Oddly.

ETA I forgot: I think both Halal and Kosher methods of animal slaughter are cruel to animals and while I’m not that much of an animal rights activist as to want it banned for those who believe in it, I very much object to it being used in school canteens and other collectivities on the grounds that rest of us have no moral objections to anything and thus can eat halal/kosher by default.

Antisemitism means being against a group of people because of their ethnicity.

People who are religiously Jewish can also experience antisemitism. I've known some.

Historically people have been on the receiving end of prejudice because of their adherence to Judaism.

Pre 1930's Germany, European antisemitism was primarily in the form of religious intolerance, especially during the Middle Ages. This had its roots in the Roman Empire when Christianity was proclaimed as the only legal religion in the 5th Century.

In the modern era many Jews who've experienced antisemitism have done so from people of their own ethnic and racial makeup.

Islamophobia literally means being against the ideology of Islam. I don’t see anything wrong with being against an idea.

So, following the line of (so called) "logic", you'd be perfectly fine if someone was antisemitic on religious grounds.

For someone who's so quick to sling around the slur of "antisemitism" at all and sundry, it's telling you don't even know the basics.

Fair enough, it still doesn't mean Islam is good and therefore it does nothing to counter my point that being opposed to Islam is perfectly rational and sensible.

If the catholic church ceased to exist in Ireland tomorrow I'd be fine with it. The catholic church hasn't power in Ireland today and won't have any in the future.

We've just rid of one religion out of the country why should we tolerate the spread of another.

So much wrong here.

Antisemitism is not “being against an ethnicity” but specifically prejudice toward Jews as people, regardless of ethnicity. An Irish Jew, or a Russian one, or an Israeli, would be hated equally and irrationally for being who they are as people, or their beliefs. Is that why you constantly attribute criticism of Israel to antisemetism (incorrectly)?

Likewise, the term Islamophobia doesn’t mean “being against the ideology of Islam”, it refers to discrimination and hostility toward Muslims as people.

Criticizing ideas or religions is legitimate. Antisemetism/ Islamophobia is pure prejudice against people because of their identities.

As an example, lumping 1.8 billion Muslims and a wide range of interpretations into a single caricature, treating the worst readings as representative of the entire faith, promoting distrust towards the people who identify as Muslim because of it (they are told to beat their wives!), is prejudice, as is dismissing their faith wholesale as "backwards with no place in society".

And to keep things back in topic - if Ireland is so racist and antisemetic (and always was according to the scholars on here), why do we have a Herzog park in the first place? Why was his father, the first chief Rabbi of the Israeli state, such good friends with De Valera, the notorious antisemite that proves our rampant antisemetism from many of these same people?

So much so, that this notorious antisemite worked with Herzog senior, against pushback from actual racists in government, to enshrine in the constitution the protection of Jewish people - the only country in the world to do so outside of Israel? Why is there a forest named after him in Tel Aviv?

Why, also, did the park remain Herzog park for so long?

Why the request to change the name now?

It couldn't possibly have anything to do with the, you know, utter disgust people feel towards what almost all major NGO's, humanitarian groups, international medical groups, UN special committees etc etc declared as a genocide going on in Gaza, which the Israeli state (not Jews) happen to be getting away with without sanction. The shooting dead of children. The mass bombing of whole cities. The forced starvation of millions of people.

Naaah, that couldn't be it.

Like De Valera, close friend of Israel's chief rabbi, we are all just antisemetic.

Antisemitism has nothing to do with whether or not they practice their religion though - Hitler didn’t let the atheist Jews off. Polish Jews were killed at Kielce after the war, again, regardless of whether they’d lost their faith in Yahweh while in the concentration camps. They were Polish but not Polish enough.

And I don’t know what you want to call that if not ethnicity?

The rest of your post is just projection. I lived abroad for years in a country with a large number of Muslims and on a personal level I’ve never had a problem with Muslims, or no more than with anyone else and not over their religion.

My objection to Islam is about its teachings. And I’ve never said all Muslims practice the most extreme versions of it - I know they don’t.

That said, I’ve been friends/neighbours with several women who married local (European) men and they ALL got physically beaten by their fathers and brothers and generally have no relationship with their families. Even after having children their families wanted nothing more to do with them. That’s only women though. Of course. The men are grand to marry out.

FWIW, two of those women say that the beatings were at the instigation of their mothers - and I have in my own family an uncle who was badly beaten up by the family of his Protestant girlfriend, now wife.

This was in Belfast just before the start of the troubles. So I’m not saying we’ve been all that great either - but my point is that I’m well aware of the harmful effects any religion can have. We had enough of it with Catholicism having too much power in the south and both religions having too much power over their own “people” in the north. But we’re allowed to say that without being accused of being anti Christian. Why though?

So anyway. I’m well able to differentiate between people and an ideology, and giving the religion of Islam protected status from offence under the term Islamophobia is absolutely wrong. If that’s Islamophobic then I’m fine with being Islamophobic.

I’d say the exact same thing about Christianity and Judaism except that nobody here wants to give them that protection any more. Thank Fk.

Pure whataboutery.

You can make up hypotheticals for anything.

If you were in America you’d be more likely to be killed by a Christian American but are you more afraid of them or Arabs?

I think we both know the answer to that.

Antisemitism has nothing to do with whether or not they practice their religion though -

Yes, it is an attack on them as people. The Nazis targeted people who were religiously and culturally Jewish, separated them as a race from the people they had lived alongside, intermarried with etc, for generations.

Their ethnicity didn't matter, nor did their religion (they targeted those who converted to Christianity for example, along with targeting cultural Christians who adopted Judaism).

This was a racist, prejudiced endeavour. Antisemetism others Jews, and does not allow for them to be Jewish and truly Irish, Jewish and truly Polish etc. It is one of the definitions in the ADL guidelines, that Jews are not natives of their respective countries.

In reality, if you leave the Jewish faith, and adopt another, you are no longer Jewish. You can also be Jewish of any ethnicity. I know this isn't the majority, who trace ancestry from specific groups.

The rest of your post is just projection. I lived abroad for years in a country with a large number of Muslims and in a personal level I’ve never had a problem with them, or at least no more than with anyone else and not over their religion.

It isn't projecting, you are trying to say Islamophobia is criticism of Islam as a religion, and in definition it isn't.

Islamophobia targets Muslims as people, just like antisemetism targets Jewish as people. It is the very same thing.

However, your lumping of all the different sects and interpretations of Islam into the worst things you can derive from the faith, is not a legitimate criticism of the religion.

I'm glad this ridiculous proposal is being knocked on the head.

Could Dublin City Council now focus on making Dublin a better place for residents and visitors.