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LUAS Network + Future Expansion

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Comments

  • #602
    spillit67
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,538 ✭✭✭spillit67


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123927332#Comment_123927332

    I haven’t seen it to be sure.

    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123927332#Comment_123927332

    Chat GPT suggests it’s been done in Calgary, various US cities and also Japan with light rail. I haven’t looked but seems to have so so success.

    I would think the biggest issue is the Cherrywood to Sandyford segment anyway which makes it a challenge.



  • #603
    roadmaster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,587 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    With Luas finglas getting planning today. To speed up the delivery of these projects once the routes of the other luas lines are fixed could TII not award advanced contracts for moving utilites asap as these do not need planning. I know you run the risk of not getting funding or planning of the line and it could be seen as wasted momey but it might be a way of speeding up construction.



  • #604
    spacetweek
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,561 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    I don’t follow you. It does have planning so why would we move utilities now as “they do not need planning”?

    You would not move any utilities until you have planning because there’s a small possibility the planning could be rejected and you end up having to take a different route. As for funding, moving utilities is often quite expensive and you need the project itself to be funded for money to be available for this.

    Right now the project has planning but its funding is not confirmed, so no work can take place until then.



  • #605
    murphaph
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,130 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Once you have Luas at Charlestown it's an absolute no brainer to me to drive the line east to interchange with ML in the short term and ultimately DART around Raheny or somwhere like that. Luas feeding metro and DART is the way to go.



  • #606
    OisinCooke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 242 ✭✭OisinCooke


    Some interesting discussions on the DART Underground thread about making the Howth breach into metro or Luas post DART+ and I thought it’d be an interesting discussion to continue here.

    The two obvious options are as the start of Luas Orbital, continuing through Coolock and all the way down through Blanch, across the Liffey Valley and down through Clondalkin to Tallaght, like the rest of route on the 2050 proposed map.

    The other option however is as a metro line heading SW through Coolock, Beaumont, Whitehall, Ballybough, CC, Liberties, Crumlin, Walkinstown and into Tallaght there.

    However as mentioned in the DU thread, there is issues with trying to turn a legacy non-grade separated rail line into automated metro so maybe a Luas style system is better. Any thoughts on this?



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  • #607
    loyatemu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,132 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123985222#Comment_123985222

    a bigger question is why, what's the benefit? Howth can't be redeveloped or densified in any major way so why spend hundreds of millions replacing one railway with a slightly different one. By all means run an orbital Luas to HJ, the good burghers of the peninsula can transfer there.

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  • #608
    pigtown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,402 ✭✭✭pigtown


    1000028913.jpg

    Roderic O'Gorman on LinkedIn



  • #609
    loyatemu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,132 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    I hadn't noticed before the Poolbeg extension being marked "post-2040" - surely that's a mistake, I thought it was planned to be one of the next lines out the gate, and it's a pretty short and easy project?

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  • #610
    eoin91
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54 ✭✭eoin91


    Roderic O'Gorman questions to NTA Hugh Creegan at 1 hour 46 on Galway, Cork and Dublin Luas projects: https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/committees/34/transport/

    I didn't watch the whole presentation, so maybe Hugh committed to 2030's commencement elsewhere, but his answers directly following that 1:46 mark didn't give me an indication of an accelerated timeline, all his answers just stated we are waiting for the 5 year transport sector plan with regards funding from government in the coming weeks.



  • #611
    Daith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,339 ✭✭✭Daith


    Yeah, take everything with a pinch of salt here. I'd be slightly more optimistic once some work, however tiny, starts for the Luas to Finglas, but until then I won't be expecting much.



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  • #612
    KrisW1001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,005 ✭✭✭KrisW1001


    The comments about Luas from TII are from 2h37 in that video, during closing questions.

    ”We think there’s an opportunity, and a need, to bring some of those schemes forward … [Luas] Tyrellstown and Blanchardstown will be worked on on early 30s and will be delivered ahead of the schedule in current strategy”



  • #613
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 19,348 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    I think that the point here is that what could technically happen and what funding will be provided for to happen are two completely different things.



  • #614
    MayoSalmon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,495 ✭✭✭MayoSalmon


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124002258#Comment_124002258

    Mind boggles really….striaghtforward track laying 2.4 km



  • #615
    loyatemu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,132 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124002969#Comment_124002969

    the main infrastructure item is the new bridge, but the port company are building that and it's due to be done by 2030.

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  • #616
    KrisW1001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,005 ✭✭✭KrisW1001


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124002969#Comment_124002969

    It’s a short project, not a simple one.

    What unusual feature does the current road bridge from the Point to Poolbeg have? How well would that work with a tram powered by overhead lines?



  • #617
    loyatemu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,132 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124003101#Comment_124003101

    it's probably going to use the port company's new bridge, which is also a lifting design but I'm sure this is not something unique that there aren't established technical solutions for. The lifting section will be short enough.

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  • #618
    MayoSalmon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,495 ✭✭✭MayoSalmon


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124003101#Comment_124003101

    Its going across a brand new bridge…that I am assuming the well paid consultants and engineers have incorporated how to carry a tram across.



  • #619
    loyatemu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,132 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124003198#Comment_124003198

    the port company are building the bridge and it will be specced to carry the weight of a tram, but the technical details for the overhead wiring across the lifting section I assume will be left for TII to figure out. But there are other examples of trams and trains crossing lifting bridge, and the standard method seems to be to have a gap in the wiring that the tram coasts through.

    Incidentally the Beckett bridge (which swings open, though not often) was built with tram tracks embedded into the roadway to accommodate a future Luas line that will probably never be built.

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  • #620
    The Venus Project
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38 ✭The Venus Project


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124001959#Comment_124001959

    The design is good but using LUAS on most of these routes is a cop out and mish mash of inadequate light rail to service transport around the city.

    Light rail is good for shuttling people up the road from A to B on short rides between larger scale types of transport such as Metro or DART. Anything else is inadequate for shipping people in large numbers around the city.

    The design is done in a semi circular way around the city in a cobweb type structure. This is what is needed for a area like Dublin which is shaped in semi circular shape.

    Then you have to make trade-offs between most populous areas and less populated areas.



  • #621
    OisinCooke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 242 ✭✭OisinCooke


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124002901#Comment_124002901

    Interesting that Tyrrelstown and Blanch will be going first… I would’ve thought that a Malahide Road route and an N11 route would get greenlit first, but maybe they’re going off the ones that have no connection at the moment.

    Malahide Rd and N11 have good bus links and while they will exceed capacity (they’re getting very close already…) and will need to be upgraded to Luas in the future, Tyrrelstown and Blanchardstown effectively have nothing.

    The Tyrrelstown route would definitely open up huge areas of land for new housing, with direct Luas access to town (either via a link with DART W or all the way on the Luas) so maybe that’s another major reason that they’re being prioritised.



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  • #622
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,575 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Following the conversion of the GL from Carlemont to Sandyford to metro, the GL should continue along Adelaide RD, Wilton Terrace to GCD to connect with the Dart. The Luas should have a spur from Harcourt following the South Circullar to join the Redline at Rialto.

    There could be all sorts of network routes possible with GCD to Rialto and onto the red line in either direction. SSG to Harcourt and onto Rialto and again on to either direction.

    The red Line could go down High St to College Green and connect with the GL at Trinity.

    Lots of possible combinations with frequency determined by passenger numbers..



  • #623
    Daith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,339 ✭✭✭Daith


    Is it a case that Tyrrelstown will connect to Broombridge too?

    I thought a Blanch route and a spur to Tyrrelstown could work, but sure the more lines the better tbh.

    And yes, places without a rail connection should be priority.



  • #624
    tom1ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,635 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    On a slight tangent here but I was wondering what bus services currently go from Tyrelstown to Hansfield heavy rail train station to see if that’s a viable alternative instead of a LUAS line there (to prioritise LUAS being built in other areas).
    No busses going from Tyrelstown to Hansfield.
    Surely that would be a start!



  • #625
    Daith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,339 ✭✭✭Daith


    The problem with a bus connection service is that they're rarely able to connect to the train time table that well.

    Broombridge is a perfect example where sometimes a train to Broombridge from Connolly might leave you with 30 seconds to connect to the 40e and if the train is slightly delayed, you're waiting 30 mins for the next one.



  • #626
    Zebra3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,209 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    At least Broombridge also has the Luas.



  • #627
    mackerski
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,297 ✭✭✭mackerski


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124004618#Comment_124004618

    Why Hansfield? It's further away than stations like Clonsilla or Coolmine, its road connection isn't any more attractive and it's on a branch line. In the time it would take you to get to any of those stations by bus, a bus heading directly towards town would probably have you most of the way to Navan Road Parkway.



  • #628
    Daith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,339 ✭✭✭Daith


    I hope whatever happens the O'Connell St North/Parnell St junction could be improved. Not solely a Luas issue, there's a lot of traffic using that area.

    Also when the Luas going to Broombridge has to wait for the Luas terminating at Parnell to move at OCS, which can be around 5 mins at times.

    Post edited by Daith on


  • #629
    OisinCooke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 242 ✭✭OisinCooke


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124003889#Comment_124003889

    I disagree here, I think the Green Line should be sent down the Stillorgan Road/N11 as far as Leopardstown to rejoin the Brides Glen section and eventually hit Bray.

    What you are suggesting in the City Centre is not a bad idea though, but what is a bad idea is using the Red and Green lines for these routes/spurs. With the amount of new radial Luas lines planned, they can surely fulfil these roles in the city centre. The less branches off of a line the better, especially in the city centre.

    I don’t really understand what you mean by the Red Line using High Street to connect to the Green Line at College Green… Luas Lucan should take this route, or even better, a route along Cork Street/Kevin Street/Cuffe Street to hit the GL and the Metro at SSG, before continuing out towards GCD to connect with DART.

    I can also see another north-south routing using Constitution Hill/Church Street/Bridge Street/Christchurch/St Patrcks and on south. This would make Christchurch a hub between a couple of Luas lines, DART Underground, and a possible second metro line.



  • #630
    DubToDeise
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38 ✭DubToDeise


    In terms of the Tyrrelstown line, it could easily go through open land from Broombridge to the Sports Campus. Then you've got the corporate parks beyond that.

    For Blanchardstown, there was alignment preserved for Metro West. I have no idea what they'd do when they get towards the Halfway House though? Putting it through the Phoenix Park to Heuston would be an option but surely there'd be pushback?

    Post edited by DubToDeise on


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  • #631
    Red Silurian
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,897 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123927315#Comment_123927315

    You would need a third set of railway tracks at the very least under regular usage so not much point. I can see something like this making sense on a busy match day or when there's something very big at the point to take people express to/from Heuston station but all they need to do there is to close off the right hand track and use that

    With that being said if you can run an express tram from Brides Glen, Sagart, Tallaght, and to a leser extent, broombridge you'd see usage of the system increasing hugely



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