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Energy infrastructure

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,154 ✭✭✭BKtje


    Leitrim is a net recipient of money form the rest of the country, something along the lines of 900 euro per person. Every region in the country sacrifices and gains something from every other region in the country. It's how a country is supposed to work. Dublin makes the money and transfers this to the other regions where the people there provide something to Dublin. This is why parish pumps politics, as a whole, is such a drain on the country, it makes everyone poorer in the long term.

    I'm not saying build windfarms willy nilly without input from locals but locals shouldn't be able to block everything either. A compromise needs to be reached. Those datacenters, while energy hogs, do contribute majorly to the Irish economy which allows these high transfers of funding from Dublin and other areas to "poorer" regions such as Leitrim. Sure they only employ about 27,000 well paid individuals directly (many more indirectly of course) but they also pay coporation tax and property taxes. I read that one datacenter can pay up to 62 million a year in taxes to the local council. For reference that one datacenter's property tax would almost pay Leitrims entire allocated budget for 2026. Open to correction as much of the financial info was provided by an AI.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56 ✭✭GasolineAlley


    Leitrim is one of the smallest counties in Ireland with near a quarter of it being wetland and you decide that it isn't pulling its weight. This is pimpenomics.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,150 ✭✭✭✭Birdnuts


    Wow - doubling down on your ignorance. Sums up the wind bothers on here🙄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭Busman Paddy Lasty


    His analogy is very apt. If you don't see the bigger picture that is your fault nobody else's.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,154 ✭✭✭BKtje


    Pimpenomics? Really? What you are asking is for the rest of the country to fund Leitrim's infrastructure but not willing to offer anything in return. Do the people of Leitrim believe they have a given right to this financial transfer? I see it is pointless to discuss with you as you seem to want Leitrim to take without giving in return so this isn't even a question of windfarms but probably any kind of infrastructure that could be viewed as a local negative. I think I'll leave it at that.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭hans aus dtschl


    Outside of windfarms but more generally I'm from a rural area, and I regularly see people protesting against anything/everything "strategic" or of national importance, but there's almost no acknowledgement of the things they get from the state that someone else must provide or live with. I also see it in urban areas with people protesting against housing and density. It's just NIMBYism really.

    Of course nobody wants to live next to a turbine or a battery farm or substation. And nobody wants to live next to a new very dense housing development on what was a green field. But we need to have these things.

    One thing the state could do better in general in rural areas is linking local amenities to new national energy infrastructure: new wind farm goes in, direct funding of local playgrounds etc. At the moment it's a bit all cloak-and-dagger with undisclosed sums going around. Another thing that could work well would be if a very small % of the wind farm profits could be directed back to the local community: I suspect that a lot of negativity could dissipate very fast. As it is right now, only the landowner really gains. I think you'd find a lot more goodwill if they were "our" turbines, if you know what I mean.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,154 ✭✭✭BKtje


    I would completely agree that there does of course have to be value brought back to the area from the infrastructure. Large commercial centers for example create large noise traffic volumes but in return people have increased services from the taxes that are collected. As I've tried to argue, it should be give and take from both sides (as well as from the greater population who benefit as a whole). It's possible that more needs to be done to highlight the advantages of these projects rather than just the down sides to the local community.

    I don't know if this is the thread for that debate though :)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56 ✭✭GasolineAlley


    When you are not able to conceptualize a problem beyond its monetary elements there is absolutely no way that you and I will ever see eye to eye. Ireland is a society not a Business. The people of Leitrim are few in number and enjoy the benefits of their landscape not being over concreted over or laid waste; for that you wish to exact a toll upon them, a toll disproportionate to their earning potential. You can discuss your neoliberal free market capitalism over a Latte in some tourist trap in SCD but leave them out of the discussion.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭hans aus dtschl


    We can frame everything in monetary/budgetary terms or in societal/social terms but it all pretty much amounts to the same thing: nobody wants to live beside the industrial infrastructure that facilitates modern living. Everyone wants to live at just the right distance from these things. This even comes down to small things like bus stops: everyone wants to be near a bus stop but nobody wants a bus stop at their door.

    People of Leitrim enjoy things like roads maintenance, access to air transport, access to fresh market goods etc. The bitumen for the roads is made somewhere, the airports and ports are located somewhere… The list is long which contains the types of infrastructure which are necessary for modern living. And almost nobody wants to live beside those facilities.

    I might be wrong, but I feel the Irish are particularly mé-féin about this stuff, there's a bit of a selfish or anti-social undercurrent in Irish society. I know people who are currently blocking playgrounds from going ahead. I know (many) people in brand new housing estates who are protesting against new housing estates going in beside their own brand new housing estate! The list goes on and on.

    It's all very well for the people of Leitrim (or elsewhere) to want to live in splendid isolation and not near any energy infrastructure, but that's not really reasonable: everyone can't be "just near enough but not too near" everything unfortunately.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭hans aus dtschl


    As a secondary point, the type of surroundings we have in modern day rural Ireland are not really representative of the "natural" environment at all. There's a lot of large one-off houses surrounded by tar, there's a lot of cattle ranching, etc and even though people seem to think of these as "natural" they are also the trappings of modern industrial technology.

    My neighbours cry foul about "industrial equipment" (energy infrastructure) and it kind of feels unreasonable to me because I regularly experience fairly heavy and noisy and disruptive farming equipment. I know people draining bogs and clearing trees with no consultation. But we all just put up with those because the industry is agricultue.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,150 ✭✭✭✭Birdnuts


    I'm seeing the bigger picture ie. U don't kill planet to save it, something your type apparently is oblivious too🙄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,150 ✭✭✭✭Birdnuts


    The majority of windfarms built to date are not on intensive farmland or other low nature value areas eg. Ireland has more windfarms built on peatlands than any other country in the EU and has already been slapped down several times by the ECJ on this matter concerning damage done to same.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭hans aus dtschl


    I'm not knowledgeable enough to reply but those peatlands are probably some of the least-populated areas and least financially desirable for other industries so likely the least pushback unfortunately. You're obviously pointing out a bad situation, but I'm not sure how best to account for that. In the scramble to fill the generation gap, these areas could have been the "low hanging fruit". Could also be something simpler like these happened to be the most desirable areas from a windspeed measurement perspective.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,604 ✭✭✭✭josip


    Yes, they'd be agriculturally unproductive, low value uplands. They're often planted on an industrial scale by Coillte with a monoculture tree species that supports very little in the way of flora or fauna diversity.

    I cannot see how a nordic plantation forest would be preferable from an environmental and biodiversity perspective to a wind farm on original bog, but look forward to being informed by those who know more.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,150 ✭✭✭✭Birdnuts


    THe government has EU targets to restore Nature on 20% of land within the next decade - the goverment has said the majority of this will be on state land, that neans Coillte and BNM landholdings.Neither industrial spruce plantations or wind farms are compatible with that policy



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 98,142 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Actually :

    https://eur-lex.europa.eu/eli/reg/2024/1991/oj

    Article 6

    Energy from renewable sources

    1. For the purposes of Article 4(14) and (15) and Article 5(11) and (12), the planning, construction and operation of plants for the production of energy from renewable sources, their connection to the grid and the related grid itself, and storage assets shall be presumed to be in the overriding public interest.


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 98,142 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Birds can see further into the ultraviolet than we can.

    It's a possible way of invisibly illuminating turbines at night.

    During the day UV paint can provide contrast colours on what to human eyes would still be white.

    Bats can hear much higher frequencies than we can so maybe some scope for "silent" noisemakers.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭medoc


    Actually Offaly was consistently in the top 5 for wind (top 3 on a couple of occasions) since Dec 24 up until August of this year. Prolongued outages at a couple of the bigger wind farms since July caused a drop in the rankings.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 316 ✭✭tppytoppy


    https://www.rte.ie/news/regional/2025/1112/1543444-wetland-restoration-leitrim/

    Don't see how you can put wind turbines on those hills extending to 9700 hectares of Leitrim and border areas without partially draining and destroying blanket bogs.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,150 ✭✭✭✭Birdnuts


    I suggest you read up on the "Go to areas" for renewable energy production in the relevant EU Directive adopted just last year . It specifically instructs goverments to plan for such projects in "low impact" areas - as countless examples show, current state policy does nearly the exact opposite…



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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,964 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Sectoral capital investment plan for energy was published yesterday covering years 2026-2030


    https://www.gov.ie/en/department-of-climate-energy-and-the-environment/publications/sectoral-capital-plan/


    Decent level of detail here vs the past of just a headline list of projects 



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,127 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    Not going to be popular with some , but would it be possible to erect wind turbines on undrained bog , ( or currently drained and due to be re wetted bogland )

    If they can anchor turbines to the sea floor , surely it must be possible to cross bogland , a lot of tracked machines can have very, very low ground pressure ,

    And it's possible to build temporary bog roads,

    There might have to be a limit on the height of the mast or size of the turbine , but could be a way to increase usable wind resource , avoid as many houses as possible, rewet / restore bog lands ect ..

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 98,142 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    £100 m Offshore Wind Deal Transforms Belfast Harbour supporting up to 3GW of wind.

    The joint venture between EnBW and JERA Nex bp will lease the port’s D1 terminal for assembling and marshalling turbine components. … Belfast Harbour, as a Trust Port, reinvests all profits and is already investing £90 million in a new D3 terminal to serve both cruise and offshore wind sectors.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,754 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    "We're seeing a rooftop solar revolution, backed by the €1,800 SEAI grant. A grant which I’ve confirmed will stay in place. With 28,000 installs last year and over 33,000 expected this year, momentum is strong and we’re committed to supporting it."

    From Darragh O'Brien twitter.

    Pretty good numbers. Over 600 a week.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,825 ✭✭✭plodder


    So, it's not dropping as planned by €300 on Dec 31st?

    Apparently not, which is good news. Really the cost of the panels is not the major cost in doing the work.

    https://www.rte.ie/news/2025/1117/1544474-solar-panels-homes/

    “The opposite of 'good' is 'good intentions'”



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,754 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    Is labour the major cost?

    Sodium batteries are coming to market soon so cost of batteries will continue to drop at least.

    33,000 a year is a good number.

    Apparently just over a million homes are suitable for solar so if we could increase to 50,000 a year installations, we'd have every roof done in 18 years (100,000 already done).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,825 ✭✭✭plodder


    Only started looking into it recently. But, individual panels can be bought for less than €80. So, even ten panels (at eg €800) is not the biggest part of the cost. Inverters and batteries are a lot more costly, as is labour obviously and all the usual other overheads of doing business. You're paying for expertise as well, as there are plenty of pitfalls, especially with the wiring in older houses. And yeah, batteries are the next revolution. Even households that can't install panels will be installing batteries to store cheap night time electricity.

    “The opposite of 'good' is 'good intentions'”



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,754 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    Grid scale batteries also will be a big deal.

    We produce a surplus of wind energy lots of nights.

    We should be storing all that.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,873 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 1,513 ✭✭✭riddlinrussell


    I don't really get what you're trying to say with those images, where is this, is this a village/town?

    So far I see a single turbine, not a farm?

    I also see classic Irish semi-d/terrace setup and a sizeable sprawl of town in the wide shot that looks like it would have a lot of opportunity for denser infill, but I can't say more without knowing where it is.

    Boards is in danger of closing very soon, if it's yer thing, go here (use your boards.ie email!)

    👇️ 👇️



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