DART+ (DART Expansion)

jwm121 · 23-10-2025 12:28AM

So when is the planned entry of service of the new Dart trains anywhere on the network now? Nothing till halfway through 2027? It is really disappointing and annoying to see. The amount of set backs on every public transport project in Dublin is just causing more and more congestion. You can't get a seat at Greystones at 7am on the Dart.

Bodan · 23-10-2025 12:36AM

"The battery proposed for the Australian tram project is smaller than the battery used on the Dart+ battery electric multiple unit train, but is otherwise technically the same. During testing on the Australian tram project, this battery did not pass the required tests and needed some redesign.”

He said: “Arising from their experience on the Australia tram project, Alstom and OP Mobility advised us of the requirement to redesign the Dart+ battery-electric train battery design arrangements in order to improve the resilience of the battery packs.” “This was notified to Iarnrod Éireann in August 2025, and this redesign is now complete. However, the formal certification tests for the Dart+ battery-electric battery must be repeated due to the design change,” he said.

Kenny added: “This means that the application for approval of the battery-electric trainset to the European Rail Agency (ERA) has moved to August 2026. While it may be the case that ERA completes its decision process sooner, IÉ must be prudent in forecasting, and has based an eight-month timeline for ERA decision on typical experience of ERA processes with other fleets in Europe.”

Some interesting quotes from Barry Kenny on irishcycle.com explaining the nub of the issue.

https://irishcycle.com/2025/10/22/expansion-of-dart-to-drogheda-using-battery-electric-trains-delayed-until-2027/

riddlinrussell · 23-10-2025 07:21AM

IrishCycle has some well researched journalism. Disappointing but here's hoping the EMUs get ordered quick and maybe those can be prioritised in the factory?

loyatemu · 23-10-2025 09:27AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123929337#Comment_123929337

in fairness, Drogheda is being electrified and the BEMUs were a stopgap. If they'd just ordered EMUs do you think the electrification project would be any further along? I doubt it.

Citizen Six · 23-10-2025 09:56AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123929337#Comment_123929337

Think that might have been the presentation with Paul Hendrick.

Glaceon · 23-10-2025 10:06AM

Considering that we now have a JR on the northern line electrification project, the BEMU idea doesn't seem all that far-fetched. But as someone who lives in Drogheda and uses the commuter rail regularly, the delay is very disappointing. I suspected that they weren't going to meet the original "early 2026" target considering that we only have three units in the country at this stage.

p_haugh · 23-10-2025 10:32AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123929794#Comment_123929794

I just noticed, the Irish cycle article also mentions that the new DARTs were already delayed until late 2026 according to what was said at the Oireachtas

However, the company is now claiming that the delay has been pushed from “the end of 2026” to Q2 2027. If the rollout of the new train was already delayed to the end of next year, it is unclear where this information was made public.

Beta Ray Bill · 23-10-2025 12:08PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123929995#Comment_123929995

I think it would to be honest. Adding the overhead lines is the easy part
Getting the right type of power to them is the tricky bit.

It's a huge setback, but this is to be expected with new technologies.

I still think it was the right idea to go Batteries as it adds flexibility/scalability.

The big issue now though is that Irish Rail are stuck with the 8100 class for another 2 years (Unless they can use the new DARTs without the batteries while they wait for the new batteries to be delivered)

LXFlyer · 23-10-2025 02:44PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123929659#Comment_123929659

Cian does make one significant error in that article, which many people seem to be making when they see these BEMUs branded as DART.

The BEMUs are like for like replacements for the DMUs currently on the Northern Line, and as such their arrival does not equate to a more frequent service.

That will only happen when DART+ Coastal North is completed.

riddlinrussell · 23-10-2025 08:24PM

It would increase the frequency of service of "somewhere" on the network by freeing those DMUs for other service, but yes not on the Northern Line itself

gjim · 23-10-2025 08:32PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123930077#Comment_123930077

Yeah that’s the one, thanks.

LXFlyer · 23-10-2025 08:34PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123931896#Comment_123931896

That’s not what he says though.

A plan to operate a more frequent train service under the Dart brand on Dublin’s northern line has been delayed by a year until 2027 due to a supply issue with the battery units for the new trains, Irish Rail confirmed today.

The first part of that statement is wrong.

riddlinrussell · 23-10-2025 08:38PM

Sorry, to clarify, I wasn't defending the accuracy of the article, just saying the DMUs will be useful elsewhere.

LXFlyer · 23-10-2025 08:48PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123931930#Comment_123931930

Absolutely.

KrisW1001 · 24-10-2025 08:13AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123931922#Comment_123931922

It's not wrong, though.. they don't say which part of the Northern line will see more frequent services. Removing DMUs from the line will allow more frequent services on the already-electrified sections, as the new BEMUs can operate at the same short headways as the existing DART stock; diesels require more time to accelerate and slow down.

LXFlyer · 24-10-2025 08:45AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123932528#Comment_123932528

With all due respect, there is absolutely nothing in the public domain to suggest that the introduction of the BEMUs on the route will result in more frequent trains at the same time.

Anything posted stating there will be is pure conjecture. People are adding two and two together and making five.

Everything that I have heard so far is that there are no plans for additional services and that these will be simply like-for-like replacements for the DMUs.

CatInABox · 24-10-2025 09:00AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123932579#Comment_123932579

I, for one, was under the impression that the new BEMUs would turn into an all stops service.

That would result in a more frequent service for Malahide onwards.

Perhaps I'm mistaken though, in which case I'm very open to correction.

goingnowhere · 24-10-2025 09:09AM

Correct there is no plan for increased frequency on the Northern line

At introduction it will be a 1:1 replacement, then at the next timetable change the faster acceleration and higher top speed will be factored in so you will see significant journey time reductions north of Malahide. New trains have more seats and more standing room compared to current so you get shorter journeys, more seats so a win

Drogheda services will be non stop Connolly to Howth Junction/Malahide and then all stops to Drogheda

Once everything settles in you might fit an extra train in as one of the constraints currently is a DART following a 29k/22k is held up by the longer dwell time and poor acceleration

LXFlyer · 24-10-2025 09:14AM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123932614#Comment_123932614

What you’re describing is the potential service post-electrication north of Malahide, and not that when the BEMUs are introduced.

EVBusFan · 24-10-2025 11:48AM

Regarding the topic above about BEMU either just casscading existing services or adding to existing services in advance of OHLE;

There was previously dissussion here about service patterns (i think around page 315) and an link to an FOI-ed jacobs report discussing options. It looks like the choice ended up being just to replace existing DMU services with BEMU but maybe someone else remembers if this was ever anounced.

KrisW1001 · 24-10-2025 12:59PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123932579#Comment_123932579

Okay, we seem to be at cross purposes here. I said the BEMUs would allow more services, nothing more. Introduction of the BEMUs removes the major obstacle to having more frequent DART services on the northern line, which is the long headways needed for diesel trains. Without first removing the diesels, any service frequency increase is difficult. I trust we can agree on that.

Any plan (public or not) to increase services is dependent on the BEMUs first being rolled out. Thus, a delay in BEMU rollout is also a delay to any such plans that IÉ may have. While I accept that nothing has been publicised, it would be very strange indeed if there was no plan at all to increase services on the northern line. Turning the Howth branch into a shuttle service only makes sense in the context of freeing slots to offer more services North of Howth Junction.

LXFlyer · 24-10-2025 01:33PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123933242#Comment_123933242

To be honest, you are the one at cross purposes here, not me.

I made a comment in my post above about the very specific wording of the Irish Cycle article, which stated that there were plans to introduce more frequent services on the Northern Line alongside the BEMU introduction.

Now firstly there are no public plans to do any such thing, so that would make a factual article wrong in the first place.

Second of all I can only repeat here what I know from my own sources and that is that there are NO plans for any additional services on the Northern Line to be introduced alongside the BEMU introduction. Genuinely I am not in the habit of posting conjecture, speculation or dud information here. That's the lie of the land as it stands. @goingnowhere confirms that in their post as well.

Adding additional services such as you are talking about is further down the line, and mostly dependent on the rollout of DART+ Coastal North and the rollout of more fleet and it certainly would be far later than the initial BEMU rollout.

Citizen Six · 24-10-2025 07:14PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123933363#Comment_123933363

Additional services on the northern line have been discussed at some level, it’s just not public knowledge, nor should it be at this stage.

OisinCooke · 24-10-2025 08:27PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123933027#Comment_123933027

Can I ask why they mention here (and in every other DART+ capacity document) about running 5tph to Drogheda but having only 3 of them actually serve Drogheda in passenger service, with the other two running empty from Laytown, the last stop before Drogheda…

I don’t really understand the logic behind it, because they’re not talking about a turnback at Laytown, the train would still run to Drogheda to recharge. Does that mean that in passenger service there will be 3tph to Drogheda and 5tph back into the city…? Or would they operate the same service in reverse and start at Laytown again? I am sure that there is sensical logic behind it but in my head I can’t imagine why they would give every station on the line 2 extra services, except for the largest population centre on the route…

Also @EVBusFan I’m just wondering, given that this is the section of that report that you highlighted for the argument that BEMUs will offer a 1:1 replacement of DMUs, that would suggest that there is that many trains servicing Drogheda presently, so I’m just still slightly confused on the matter.

gjim · 24-10-2025 09:31PM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123933242#Comment_123933242

Introduction of the BEMUs removes the major obstacle to having more frequent DART services on the northern line, which is the long headways needed for diesel trains.

You only need long headways for stopping services. Otherwise a diesel commuter or intercity takes about the equivalent of a single DART slot as you can see from the timetables at Connolly. Of course, it means the “express” non-stopping service is actually no quicker than a stopping DART train - so the implications are for quality-of-service of non-DART services and not so much the overall capacity of the alignment.

goingnowhere · 24-10-2025 09:34PM

Issue at Drogheda is getting trains out of the depot and into a platform, as this conflicts with departing and arriving trains.

So if you increase frequency you depart some trains from the depot directly to Laytown to avoid this. The DART+ works at Drogheda include a 4th platform which eases this problem

DART+ (DART Expansion)

Comments