Manchester United Thread 25/26 - Teamtalk/Transfers/Gossip Mod Note in OP 26.09.24

Utd will not hoover up points against the other teams though

The pattern shows that what is far more likely to happen is that the team plays OK/well for a period of the game but don't put the opposition to bed or take advantage to the level they should, the tide of the game will turn and then we end up either losing, dropping points or barely getting over the line.

There are structural issues with the side that will always see us struggle once the opponent gets on top. Good teams (not great teams, just good teams) don't need to be on top for 90 min but they do make hay when they are on top in the game and they are difficult to break down when they aren't on top.

We are incapable of both of those and will remain so as long as players like Bruno are paired in a midfield 2 and your goalkeeper wouldn't start for any other PL team.

Even if he irons out the main defensive issue in the system of players not knowing when to jump and when to hold position (which is a major issue which really needed to have been fixed by now), will this system bring us success in the PL? I keep coming back to the wingbacks. If you play with 3 CBs on the field, then surely the wingbacks just have to be a major creative outlet. But instead our wingbacks have worse creative stats that many fullbacks that play in a back 4! It just doesn't make sense to me that he thinks it's ok to play with wingbacks like Dorgu, Dalot and Mazaroui AS WELL as having 3 CBs on the field. I could see the system working an awful lot better if he had players like Trent, Hakimi, Mendes, Frimpong etc. but the ceiling of the system feels too low in the PL without those high quality specialist players for the wingback roles. I'm genuinely sick of relying on Dorgu, Dalot and Mazaroui to be an attacking threat.

The thing is though, without the reality of the team finishing in 15th if another manager came in and finished 8th that too would have been seen as a failure.

I don't believe there is any world where in Nov 2024 a manager can come in and get the side to finish outside the European spots (without winning another trophy) and it would be viewed as anything other than failure. You could do it now because the floor has once again been lowered at this club…

Ruben has likely sealed his fate at this stage and it is largely due to his refusal to tweak midfield or elsewhere to compensate for the clear weaknesses that the team has. It's one thing to say we are going to play a system that has a back 3, wingbacks and a sole striker up front and it's another thing to pull your best attacking player deeper because the system doesn't work if you can't release players quickly from deep and the other midfielders at the club can't pass wind. Bruno doesn't understand and isn't nearly as effective in this role as he is further up the pitch.

What got Ruben so much grace with fans was the promise of something better down the line, remove the problem players (which absolutely did need to happen), develop an identity, build towards something down the line. Similar with ETH is many ways. Fans bought into it because for so long these have been major issues at the club and they are things fans have felt needed to be sorted.

But just like ETH it seems now his undoing will be his refusal to adapt to what he is seeing week to week on the pitch.

To be fair, I do think man for man the squad is better than it was in Nov 2024 but the failure to address the main problems areas correctly over the summer is a failure from the top down ONCE AGAIN!

How we come out of nearly every summer with similar issues I'll never understand

Too many square pegs pushed into round holes.

Bruno is a 10 and has consistently produced for us in that role. But now is being asked to perform the duties of a Defensive Midfielder, in a 2 man midfield. Its just nonsensical to pursue this.

Yesterday we had Maz and Dorgu, neither of whom are natural WBs asked to fulfil that role again.

They don't have the natural confidence to play aggressively high up the pitch and I honestly don't think they have the quality anyway to deliver into the box from such positions either. On other days it will be Dalot playing in that position - with the same limitations.

We simply don't have the squad to play and apply this method. That much is clear. And our relegation form since last November shows it.

The squad may not be brilliant……but there is enough there employing a 4-3-3, to get us competing at least for a Europa League place.

8th got Ten Hag sacked, and with the players available it should have been viewed as failure. Don't forget though that most fans were ready for change and perfectly happy to accept a period of mediocrity as long as they could see building blocks being laid.

A solid 8th with evidence of at least some players thriving in the new system, with the toxic players being sold, with good results here and there, I fully believe that fans would have understood that.

Instead we got a year of gaslighting, with no evidence of improvement but a lot of fans convinced that it must be happening behind the scenes somewhere.

Here is a scary thought. When Amorim joined, the squad of players were in no way suited to his system of play, it suited basically nobody.

Today, coming up on a year later, it still doesn't. Still the vast majority of players available don't suit it.

The whole thing is a farce.

Hojlund came to us as a very ambitious young striker who always gave his all but should never have been our no 1 striker who was never rested.

He left with his head held high and I’m also delighted for him.

To be fair the current brains trust seem worse than Woodward, Dicky Arnold and co. Berrada and Wilcox are just as responsible for the mess as anyone

I just don't see him being sacked yet unless INEOS have identified a new permanent manager that can start immediately. If you don't have that, then you are obviously looking at an Interim. But the purpose of an Interim is usually just to 'steady the ship' and detoxify a dressing room. We're not at a point where that's needed atm. The players haven't downed tools for Amorim and the dressing room doesn't seem to be toxic. No chance they will get rid now unless they are really sold on someone like Iraola to come in on a permanent basis. The most likely course of action is that Amorim stays until the end of the season and will be replaced in an orderly fashion. Only two things can change this:

1. The teams completely falls apart and enters an irreversible downward spiral (we're nowhere near this point yet although it can transpire quite quickly)

2. INEOS are totally sold on a replacement that's available to start immediately

They are absolutely at the "Steady the ship" stage, Amorims 31 game record is 17th place ffs.

I swear this place has lost its marbles.

United need to sign any of the dozens of managers who would take that squad, play the formation that most suits it, start winning games again and coast to the top 8 finish that allows them more time to fix the finances behind the scenes.

One Payoff and minimal transfers needed.

We have a bunch of players trying to enact a fairly rigid looking playing style, with a massive set of rules as to who does what, when, who goes where, who passes where…..but then you have a captain in the middle of the pitch who does as he pleases largely and then the coaches mood and emotions are like sharks teeth with the peaks and troughs and is he happy and telling all his innermost thoughts to the press gang or is he depressed and quitting or what is going on?

This does not intuitively make sense.

And when you look at how we play, it kind of adds up, there is no conviction in how we play, we are neither here nor there, 2 good passes, one terrible one….constant brain farts in defense.

I think essentially the players are just confused.

Simplify and solidify the whole thing and things improve dramatically. Hopefully the new keeper helps with solidity, anyone else notice a little change in tone once Bayindir nearly lost control of that back pass early on yesterday…..all out panic permeates the team.

The level of performance in the first 4 PL games was much higher than the average PL performance last season.

Last season had different attackers and a strong focus on Europa League after a very bad first 5 months between ETH and Amorim. I'm not going to just combine two totally different contexts together and pretend they're a continuous season because they're not.

Looking at this season in context, we are absolutely not at the 'steady the ship' stage yet.

Amorim is so likeable he has been given a huge grace period with most of the supporters.

Unfortunately whatever coaching is going on behind the scenes is not working.

Not one player has improved over his tenure.

Last season Bruno improved dramatically as the season went on and rightly won player of the season and Amad certainly improved and was not far behind Bruno.

Both were removed from their respective positions and it could be easily argued that they are now amongst the worst players on this team.