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Women's prisons and the Gender Recognition Act (2015)

12467…10

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  • #92
    One eyed Jack
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,695 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482932#Comment_123482932

    Well, no, it's not an issue because it's simply not true that women in prison are locked up for longer because the men want to go out and play. Their playtimes are staggered, meaning that they don't get to go out at the same time and mix together, because that's generally seen as a bad idea for reasons which should be obvious, and if they're not, there's always the pictures -

    image.png

    At least they didn't have far to send the party invites -

    At the time both Charlotte's sister Linda and her mother Kathleen were also serving sentences in the Dóchas Centre.

    Scissor Sister Charlotte Mulhall enjoys rare Dublin day trip from jail - SundayWorld.com



  • #93
    Raichų
    Site Banned Posts: 1,745 ✭✭✭Raichų


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482932#Comment_123482932

    Definitely. I was speaking with my wife a while ago and she put it perfectly. Trans women are trying to rob women of their identity.

    It’s true too. Men have been doing it for hundreds (let’s be honest, thousands) of years. Is it that wild to think some men would go as far as changing who they appear to be in order to fcuk with ye some more?

    I don’t think it’s all that outrageous to suggest…



  • #94
    Boggles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,565 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482918#Comment_123482918

    and as was explained by volchista if women in prison are afforded less leisure and recreation time because of the need to keep trans prisoners segregated then they are suffering immensely.

    Where is this happening?

    Prisons have blocks and sections, secure wings and segregation wings.

    Female child murderers are routinely segregated from general population as are women with acute mental health difficulties.

    The only trans prisoner in Ireland is currently in a men's prison in segregation sharing a wing with an infamous torturer.

    The Prison service has massive problems at the minute, this strawman isn't one of them.

    This obsession with a minute portion of the population is just beyond creepy.



  • #95
    Ezeoul
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,009 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482894#Comment_123482894
    1000075655.jpg

    ....



  • #96
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482962#Comment_123482962

    Well, no, it's not an issue because it's simply not true that women in prison are locked up for longer because the men want to go out and play. Their playtimes are staggered,

    That's the exact opposite of the claims made by a number of women who were in prison at the same time as one or more transwomen. Unless you've some actual evidence, I'm going to take their word on that over yours.

    The reason you're likely to be wrong anyway - well apart from your history of wild, unfounded claims on whatever you happen to be arguing😁 - is that the women's sections are usually much lower security than the male sections (not for dangerous convicts like your Scissor sisters women obviously, so you can drop that bit of whataboutery).

    This is purely because women prisoners are less of a risk to guards than the male prisoners. Hence they are normally allowed to associate freely for much of the day, contrary to many of the male prisons. So it would be very difficult to just alternate the times while taking into account fixed times like meals, and also prisoner officers' working schedules, without reducing the total time the women were allowed out.

    ”I enjoy cigars, whisky and facing down totalitarians, so am I really Winston Churchill?” (JK Rowling)



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  • #97
    One eyed Jack
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,695 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482966#Comment_123482966

    I don’t think it’s all that outrageous to suggest…


    The reason it’s an outrageous suggestion is simply because if men wanted to fcuk with women, they don’t need to do any of that, they can, and do, do it anyway, and most of the time get away with it too because nobody would expect it of them, because such men are able to put on a front of purity and respectability that they don’t need to wear a frock, which would have them regarded with a far greater degree of suspicion that they were up to no good.



  • #98
    Boggles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,565 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482966#Comment_123482966

    Definitely. I was speaking with my wife a while ago and she put it perfectly. Trans women are trying to rob women of their identity.

    It sounds like she needs to have good purge of her social media.

    It's having an absolute field day with her.

    An absolute bonkers thing to come out with.



  • #99
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483019#Comment_123483019

    By that logic we can get rid of male and female prisons, hospital wards etc etc because men rape women anyway so what's the point in trying to reduce that number by separating them anywhere?

    ”I enjoy cigars, whisky and facing down totalitarians, so am I really Winston Churchill?” (JK Rowling)



  • #100
    suvigirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,919 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483016#Comment_123483016

    Unless you've some actual evidence, I'm going to take their word on that over yours.

    So you're happy to take someone's word, with no evidence?

    The 'scissor sisters ' were imprisoned in the same sections and prisons as other female inmates, so don't know where you're going with they had more security?



  • #101
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482982#Comment_123482982

    Where is this happening?

    If you don't know, you could try reading the links in the OP. Or better, listen to Paddy O'Gorman's interviews with former inmates of the Women's Estate in Limerick Jail.

    And since you don't know, maybe educate yourself?

    ”I enjoy cigars, whisky and facing down totalitarians, so am I really Winston Churchill?” (JK Rowling)



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  • #102
    Boggles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,565 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483038#Comment_123483038

    Quick google suggest he is he writes for that god bothering racist blog.

    I imagine listening to him would just make me dumber.



  • #103
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482966#Comment_123482966

    Yes. Nobody said that it was only a few priests who were abusers so let's not change anything. Well I'm wrong, some people did, but luckily they weren't listened to.

    And the same logic applies too: it wasn't being a priest that made men into abusers - it was that abusers were drawn to the priesthood for the opportunities the role afforded them. We're doing the exact same thing by making transidentifying men a special sacred category who are assumed by default not to be abusers.

    Ireland, eh? 😕

    ”I enjoy cigars, whisky and facing down totalitarians, so am I really Winston Churchill?” (JK Rowling)



  • #104
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483033#Comment_123483033

    Unless you've some actual evidence, I'm going to take their word on that over yours.

    So you're happy to take someone's word, with no evidence?

    I mean, I've given you links from studies that indicate that men in prisons who self identify as women are far more likely to be there for sex crimes than the average male prisoner, so I'm not just taking one person's word over another person's, but FWIW, given two people making opposing claims, why would you not give more credit to the person who was interviewed and gave her real name, and described her own personal experience over a randomer posting stuff on the internet without even a link to his name? It's positively comical.

    The 'scissor sisters ' were imprisoned in the same sections and prisons as other female inmates, so don't know where you're going with they had more security?

    I don't remember, and didn't check before replying, largely because I don't see the relevance anyway. Should the Scissor Sisters have been put in the male estate on a case by case basis? If not, why not? Doesn't that prove you know very well that Barbie Kardashian is not a woman?

    ”I enjoy cigars, whisky and facing down totalitarians, so am I really Winston Churchill?” (JK Rowling)



  • #105
    Raichų
    Site Banned Posts: 1,745 ✭✭✭Raichų


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483025#Comment_123483025

    it’s definitely not but anyway. You can disagree, I do not care.



  • #106
    AMKC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,896 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482791#Comment_123482791

    How/Why would putting 1 Trans Women in with other women in a prison cause this?

    Do you mean that them Women are then endangered by the Trans Woman? I do not see it. So are they also endangered by a lesbian Masc Woman?

    Live long and Prosper

    Peace and long life.



  • #107
    suvigirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,919 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483060#Comment_123483060

    I prefer evidence before I randomly believe anyone just saying something.

    I was pointing out how you don't require evidence from random people on podcasts.



  • #108
    Boggles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,565 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483059#Comment_123483059

    Ah sure you are right. Trans people have had it good for too long. About time they were knocked down a peg or 2.

    Ludicrous. If Jesus wasn't belly laughing at this nonsense, he'd be weeping.



  • #109
    One eyed Jack
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,695 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483016#Comment_123483016

    That's the exact opposite of the claims made by a number of women who were in prison at the same time as one or more transwomen. Unless you've some actual evidence, I'm going to take their word on that over yours.

    At this point I do wonder have we listened to the same interviews, the podcast which plodder recommended I listen to this morning is this here -

    https://x.com/paddyjogorman?lang=en


    In it the women he speaks to recount how the prisoners playtimes are staggered, and how the prisoners in question growl at the women from their cells as they are being let out to play, not quite how they put it but I’m paraphrasing, in particular the claim that they growled and were rude and used foul language and all the rest of it.

    Of course you’re free to accept or reject evidence on the basis it doesn’t suit your narrative, but asking me to to provide evidence while claiming that evidence I do provide in support of my argument is whataboutery, is obviously going to lead to your rejection of evidence which doesn’t suit your narrative - the idea that a handful of men are a threat to all women, or that women in prison are all suffering as a consequence of men being accommodated in the prison which conveniently ignores a whole boatload of context in order to make your case that circumstances in society are what they are because nobody cares about women.



  • #110
    Raichų
    Site Banned Posts: 1,745 ✭✭✭Raichų


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483068#Comment_123483068

    If trans women don’t want pushback then why are they so desperate to make everyone (including women) subscribe to their mannerisms etc?

    For example apparently it’s transphobic to call breastfeeding, well breastfeeding. It’s “chest feeding”.

    Bullshit!



  • #111
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483064#Comment_123483064

    I've already explained in detail. Maybe read back. Even the OP alone will give you good idea. There's no point in me repeating it for what must be at least the fourth time now.

    And if women are endangered by a lesbian woman in prison, then that needs to be dealt with. Would you suggest the lesbian woman should be sent to a male prison? Because if not (and nobody sane does) then the posters saying it's ever appropriate for transwomen to be sent to a male prison are just admitting that they don't believe that TWAW.

    ”I enjoy cigars, whisky and facing down totalitarians, so am I really Winston Churchill?” (JK Rowling)



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  • #112
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483066#Comment_123483066

    And yet you've completely ignored the evidence from the FOIA requests that I posted in the OP.

    So what level of evidence would convince you then? Is there anything?

    ”I enjoy cigars, whisky and facing down totalitarians, so am I really Winston Churchill?” (JK Rowling)



  • #113
    baxterooneydoody
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 407 ✭✭baxterooneydoody


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483064#Comment_123483064

    How are you even considering these to be the same thing, one is a biological male and the other is a biological female. Also it's not like people who commit crime are alien to lying or deceit to try make life easier ie to spend time in a less secure female prison to have an easier sentence as has been seen before. Women's rights seem fine but only when they don't impinge on the rights of men who claim to be women, gotcha.



  • #114
    suvigirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,919 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483096#Comment_123483096

    The evidence you put in the OP has nothing to do with the podcast, or what the women on the podcast said. You can believe them if you wish, without evidence.



  • #115
    maik3n
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 728 ✭✭✭maik3n


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123482779#Comment_123482779

    The masks have definitely slipped in the last page or so. You were right on the money I'm afraid. 🤦 🤦‍♂️



  • #116
    Raichų
    Site Banned Posts: 1,745 ✭✭✭Raichų


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483111#Comment_123483111

    really? Okie doke.



  • #117
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,006 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483075#Comment_123483075

    He did several, and I think the one linked to was a recap of them (I didn't listen this time to that so could be wrong) so perhaps that's why there's a difference.

    But I'm talking about a woman called Leanne Casey, who definitely said that the women were locked up more because of the TW prisoners being let out, and also that they couldn't take certain routes around the prison, but had to take different stairwells, lengthening the time to go anywhere and thus shortening their free time, because of the male prisoners.

    ”I enjoy cigars, whisky and facing down totalitarians, so am I really Winston Churchill?” (JK Rowling)



  • #118
    One eyed Jack
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,695 ✭✭✭✭One eyed Jack


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483032#Comment_123483032

    Feel free to make that argument if you want, and I’d simply point out that segregation of the sexes hasn’t worked in preventing men who are of a mind to do so from abusing women, evidently!

    There are several reasons why men and women are separated and services are tailored accordingly, but preventing women from being abused has never been one of them.



  • #119
    Raichų
    Site Banned Posts: 1,745 ✭✭✭Raichų


    since prisons are so overcrowded and men in women’s prisons are not an issue apparently why don’t we just stop the segregation and allow non violent male offenders into women’s prisons?

    Very good, overcrowding sorted, no reason not to cos it’s not dangerous or a problem sure.



  • #120
    baxterooneydoody
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 407 ✭✭baxterooneydoody


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483111#Comment_123483111

    But you've no problem putting women in prison in a position where they feel unsafe with the likes of Barbie K threatening and shouting insults. Isn't taht what this is all about 'feelings'. Where we care more about the feelings of trans convicts than how real women feel



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  • #121
    suvigirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,919 ✭✭✭✭suvigirl


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123483123#Comment_123483123

    Nope. How many women in women's prisons threaten each other and shout insults? And they are not separated from each other.

    That particular prisoner was moved out of the women's prison anyway. The IPS decided where prisoners should be housed, I think that's perfectly acceptable.



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