Hamas strike on Israel

Indeed - that was the version of events given.

Bit like the IDF lads who didn't see the lights on the ambulances so ended up executing 15 medics because they "didn't see them".

Nail on the head.

Anyone supporting Israel whilst they continue to deny food, water and medicine (8 weeks and counting) are morally bankrupt.

Anyone backing the Israeli government and IDF in their Genocide is equally as guilty imo. Pretending it is not Genocide is not an excuse, it's assistance.

"We have nothing to give them"

A few interesting news items from Haaretz.

IDF are demolishing homes to ensure the freedom of movement of troops there are no witnesses to their atrocities and lies.

• Marking World Press Freedom Day, the Foreign Press Association in Israel renewed its call for Israel to allow foreign reporters into Gaza, citing its pending petition to the High Court of Justice on the issue.
• A man was filmed threatening activists at the hostage families' encampment in Jerusalem, shouting: "When the [Israeli] right wakes up, this whole tent will burn down."
• The IDF recently informed residents of two refugee camps in the Tulkarm area of its intention to demolish 106 homes. The IDF said the demolitions are required to ensure troops' freedom of movement in counter-terror operations. The UN Relief and Works Agency called the move, which follows widespread demolitions in refugee camps in the West Bank over the past few months, "collective punishment."

Most water sources will be in the occupied areas of Gaza which the civilians cannot access.
Israel is taking 20% of Gaza - that's why they're calling up 10s of thousands of reservists.

But it's not Genocide, no sir.

Now I hate israelis, you need to demonstrate that, so do spell it out.

While you're at it what do you think FF or SF have to do with it.

What is obvious is you getting annoyed because you're being lambasted with fact after fact about the horrors being inflicted by israel. Your only answer is "if you say anything against israel i'll label you antisemetic" or "look over there at what they did, israel really isn't that bad" and now "everyone is trying to kill israelis , we're just defending ourselves in loads of other countries"

This horrific video about Haiti shows the gangs doing the same thing. They move into an area, burn the homes, and claim it's for the safety of their troops and it's better for people to lose their home than their lives.

It's a really hard watch in parts.

It's astonishing that the people of Gaza are experiencing the same sort of depravity and violence, but from the IDF with the support of Western nations. Just complete destruction, rape, and murder. And the destruction of homes. What's even more astonishing is the hell on Earth shown there in Haiti, with marauding gangs taking over the capital, is actual heaven compared to what millions are experiencing in Gaza.

I posted the report here - Settlers set fire to Palestinian farm lands causing wildfires.

Settlers were the arsonists.

By the way, we see the pattern alright. But it looks nothing like the one you see.

What's the bigger picture?

This thread has discussed all aspects - those who regularly follow and post are very familiar with the history of the area.

Those who pop in from time to time less so I'd imagine. And not being fully informed are more likely to have a closed mind attitude - along with getting in perceived digs and criticisms and no real contribution.

But as you say, I'll continue to keep the mind open but I really cannot see anyone eventually coming here with a robust and cogent argument in favour of Genocide and War Crimes. Can you?

In an argument with Nazis, would you avoid using terms "genocide" and "war crimes" with regards to the Holocaust in case you come across as closed minded and maybe turn folk off?

The people we are dealing with here didn't logic their way into their support of Israel's actions. No one on the planet could do that. So we can't use logic to change their positions either. All we can do is tell them what their positions actually mean, which is, they support war crimes and the starving of children etc.

I genuinely don't see what else we can do. At least it's actually truthful unlike their accusations of antisemitism.