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6N '25 Ireland v France Match Thread: Sat8th Mar 2:15 Farewell & Adieu to you POMs, Murrays & Healys

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 590 ✭✭✭baas baa


    Anybody else see the Nash yellow as harsh. He was upright moving across the line as he didn't know where the ball was going to go. Next thing the French lad catches it and runs straight into his head. He looked like he tried to dip but it all happened so fast. That's how it seemed to me anyway be interested to hear a different take on it. The law is very odd, if you make contact to someone's head with your shoulder it's treated less severely than head to head contact even though your bound to be lower in the tackle if it's H2H rather than shoulder to head level.

    Gardner was very poor yesterday, felt like he was trying to be too clever and stamp his mark on the match. The POM incident obviously but hurrying Dupont off the pitch as though he was time wasting when he'd suffered a serious injury was disgraceful IMO



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,837 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Agree with all of this including the ref, I thought he was good, I'd argue about the taking out of POM but accept his explanation.

    I thought he was very clear in his discussions with both captains and in what he wanted from the teams



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,535 ✭✭✭techdiver


    The ref had a shocker but the Hash YC was as clear cut as they get.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,520 ✭✭✭Lost Ormond


    TheTheres lots from clubs and other areas of the game. People actively involced in sport who are never going to be season ticket holders to provinces who would not get tickets then. Just gicing tickets or more to seqson ticket holders from the provinces isnt better. Theres issues with who get tickets but just giving them to provincial season ticket holdwrs isnt the answer to anything and atmosphwre at plenty of provoncial games is still shite. Speaking as someone who works in the ground



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,520 ✭✭✭Lost Ormond


    NNo Province can replicate leinsters schools. It has to be a mix of clubs and schools elsewhere as there isnt the fee paying schools in other provinces to do anything like what leinster have



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,854 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Largely agree bar the POM incident. I've seen far more marginal cases of blocking get called. That was so blatant. POM is never in the ruck, the French player clears him out well behind the defensive line, and knocks him down. You're correct that it doesn't immediately benefit the French, but that is a penalty all day long.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,260 ✭✭✭Ben Bailey


    For anyone who might be interested ;

    Law 9 : Foul Play

    Law 9.14 : A player must not tackle an oponent who is not in possession of the ball. Sanction : Penalty

    Law 9.15 : Except in a scrum, ruck or maul a player who is not in possession of the ball must not hold, push, charge or obstruct an opponent not in possession of the ball. Sanction : Penalty

    Ref, correctly applied 9.15 to the incident involving McCarthy & Ramos.

    At no point in the Laws is there any reference to a player moving backwards, sideways or forwards.

    Any participant in sport will commit errors, and this applies equally to the on field officials. However, the Referee has a particular advantage in that he / she can alter their decision after the fact on foot of advice from other officials.

    Players & most followers can (& should) accept a erroroneous decision that happens 'live' and continue to maintain respect for the officials. When a Ref, being able to halt play completely in order to review multiple angles provided by his TMO, chooses to ignore the Laws he is employed to administer in favour of some logic of his own choosing, then players & followers are less likely to maintain respect for all officials.

    Nash didn't get a 'do over' for his misjudged tackle attempt. I suspect he'd have liked one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,444 ✭✭✭Wailin


    At least they were well supported, unlike the Irish nonce's trouncing about with beers the whole match.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,575 ✭✭✭McFly85


    Im not saying season ticket holders should get all the tickets, club staff, schools rugby should all be able to get tickets also. But in terms of of atmosphere the corporate culture of the national games hurts and would be better with fans who go to rugby week in week out, and the only real way to identify these are season ticket holders.

    Even outside of the atmosphere debate it’s actually ludicrous that there’s no path for ordinary rugby fans to even attempt to buy tickets.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,012 ✭✭✭clsmooth


    I need to watch again as I could be wrong but I think he let Penaud away with one for holding on just before half time after Osborne caught him as he ambled back. Doris got in over the ball and was cleared out from the side. Think it ended up in a scrum for France.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,520 ✭✭✭Lost Ormond


    My Point is that people always say season ticket holders first. When there can be as many issues with provincial fans. And the only way to identify these people isnt with season ticket holders getting more tickets.

    There wont be any tickets going on general sale as every sector of game gets allocation of tickets from all 200+ clubs, a hundred plus or more schools, then people involced in provincial committees etc running the game. Then provincial season ticket holders. Many of the so called corporates at irish games are at provincial games wvery week as well

    There is more than a few ways to get tickets for "ordinary rugby fans"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,894 ✭✭✭Paul Smeenus


    I'd imagine like every ref in every game ever, he missed some stuff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,854 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    Mirror of the call against Osborne in the HC final after Sheehan's break. That should have been a penalty all to Doris and borderline yellow card territory.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,383 ✭✭✭JanuarySnowstor


    I think whatever team is picked now for Italy damage has been done on the No10 position. If Sam was preferred to Crowley he should have at least been replacing him around 65mins in all of the matches. Most coaches learn as they go on, I'm afraid in Easterby's case he has gotten worse by the game!! The debate on the kickers is almost toxic now and Farell would never have allowed that. Farrell is great at man management and he was sorely missed in this tournament.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,012 ✭✭✭clsmooth


    Of course, there was one blatant one where we played it on the ground and it popped out the side in the first half which he didn’t call. A shot to the corner at 8-3 down from that Penaud incident and we possibly go in 10-8 up at half time and 17-8 up early in the second with the Sheehan try. Small margins at the top level and a different game.

    We’re not as bad as some on here would like you to believe after that loss in the same way France aren’t the best team in the world on the basis of that win. Wasn’t too long ago they somehow managed to lose to England.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,537 ✭✭✭niallm77


    In R1 Crowley came on for 21 min at 10

    In r2 he replaced Nash. Maybe just as a way of seeing them both together.

    In R3 the red card kinda scuppered things a little bit. We had to hold off as it was a tight game.

    Yesterday Crowley was coming on for SP but Aki was getting attention and was removed. Hence Crowley came on for Aki.

    The toxicity online is down to one thing only, a certain section of rugby fans and their constant vitriol.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,012 ✭✭✭clsmooth


    What’s your opinion on the citing commissioners decision that no further action was required for that incident? You seemed to think it was at least reckless by Beirne in no intent yesterday.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,894 ✭✭✭Paul Smeenus


    I think it's wrong. I don't see any attempt to wrap going into the ruck - straight off feet. But I'm not surprised. I think they very rarely make life difficult for the refs by bringing question marks in over their decisions. Their reticence to cite doesn't change my mind.

    I don't think it was malicious, I think it was reckless, and I think we got away with one. I also think if there was anything to the ludicrous posts calling Gardner "corrupt" or "the 16th man" for France, that was a gift-wrapped opportunity for him to give a penalty or even a card against us.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,854 ✭✭✭✭AbusesToilets


    It was quite reminiscent of the QF. A ton of possession in their 22 that we didn't convert into scores, then they get a couple of sucker punch tries and we're chasing the game. This time however, we had the added burden of being a man down for 20mins and never got back into the game.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,894 ✭✭✭Paul Smeenus


    Further I think quite a few posts on this forum yesterday put one-eyed SA fans on Twitter to shame for hysteria and bias.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,012 ✭✭✭clsmooth


    This place is hardly a beacon of rationality at the best of times! Sometimes you lose to a better team on the day like yesterday. Sometimes you get the decisions, sometimes they go the other way. Some posters always want a scapegoat. Not sure what’s worse, blaming the ref or going for players on your own team. Neither reflect well.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,537 ✭✭✭niallm77


    That's literally the same at every ruck. Just this time Porter latched onto and drove forward on Beirne and he landed on Duponts leg. It's a total accident. It happens. It wasn't reckless. Beirne made no attempt to grab Duponts leg.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,894 ✭✭✭Paul Smeenus


    No harm, but you're not going to persuade me unless you have another camera angle that looks less problematic.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,260 ✭✭✭Ben Bailey


    I'd share @Paul Smeenus concerns.

    Beirne does not appear to have his arms / arms in a position to bind onto Dupont (who is the sole France player at the breakdown). Beirne goes off his feet. He is impacted by Porter's arrival, but this happens afterwards (Beirne would have contacted Dupont, without attempting to bind and without attempting to remain on his feet anyway). It appears illegal and reckless (as many of these ruck entries routinely are).

    Gardner's refereeing style, ably encouraged by World Rugby, promotes faster play with fewer stoppages and he tends to not penalise the team in possession at the breakdown. This leads players into more aggressive / less controlled clear outs.

    No great surprise that these citing referrals from an intemperate France coach were dismissed. WR don't like being told what to do.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,837 ✭✭✭✭phog


    I's a discussion forum, it should be ok to say player X had a bad game, or Player Y should be tried instead of Player X without other posters jumping on the hate or vitriol train.

    If posters want group think maybe they should steer clear of internet forums or set something like a Twitter Group and only allow happy clappy posters into their group.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,226 ✭✭✭PeggyShippen


    Beirne made no attempt to protect Dupont either. In my opinion Beirne deliberately laid onto Duponts leg. France always get screwed by refs woth no French and citings ect.

    By Easterby not swapping out Prendergast for Crowley he really made and error and definitely there is a level of toxicity to the battle for 10 now. That and the Irish independent giving Prendergast a '7'. That was the last straw for many Munster folk. There isn't an International paper that rated him more than a 5. But that's semantics. The fact is Farrell is going to take Prendergast on the Lions and that's when the real outrage will occur. The English papers will devour Farrell . It ll be toxic

    Support 🇮🇱 Israel



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 449 ✭✭For Petes Sake


    I think the problem is posters don't just want to see someone tried out.

    There is a cohort of posters here who are hell bent on wanting Sam Prendergast to fail and fail badly. Irish rugby fans they most certainly are not.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,012 ✭✭✭clsmooth


    Agree 100%. There’s some excellent posters on here but I also think there’s a difference in saying someone didn’t play well and some of the overly negative posts we’ve seen on here by several accounts over the last 6 months regarding two players in particular which makes any proper constructive discussion near impossible.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,837 ✭✭✭✭phog


    Tbh, a lot of the excellent posters have left and those that caused them to leave re reg to avoid being banned

    Or the excellent posters type a reply, re read and think, nah, not worth the hassle from the Karens and delete their post.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,652 ✭✭✭50HX




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