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Manchester United Thread 25/26 - Teamtalk/Transfers/Gossip Mod Note in OP 12.02.26

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,339 ✭✭✭Iseedeadpixels


    Im hoping Zirkzee behind Hojlund for once but I've a feeling it will be Mount.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 49,304 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    Onana, Mazraoui, De Ligt, Martinez, Dalot, Casemiro, Ugarte, Eriksen, Garnacho, Hojlund, Rashford

    Surely they don't just start Mount after weeks out (again). If Mount doesn't start, I can't see what the midfield could be otherwise.

    I fear an absolute embarrasment on Thursday, cause narrative.

    Ex-City striker Dzecko.
    Ex United midfielder - Fred.
    Ex United midfielder - Amrabat
    Ex United Manager - Mourinho
    Ex Ajax Captain and EtH favourite - Tadic.

    And then throw in Dalot tormentor ASM for good measure.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,577 ✭✭✭✭PARlance


    I do think Dalot switches off too often but I think it's harsh enough to criticise him too much for the goal.

    It looked like he was caught napping again but in fact I think it was an excellent set piece from Brentford. That, or they get very lucky in the way that it all happened.

    Collins made a decoy run and forced Hojlund the other side, Hojlund ended up blocking Dalot ever so slightly, enough for Pinnock to get that yard or two on Dalot.

    It's clear enough from this still I think. If they meant it, it was an excellent set piece from Burnley and my question would be why we can't do that rather than questioning Dalot.

    Screenshot_20241021_164133_YouTube.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 49,304 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    The gyy we hired in the summer is supposed to be very good on set pieces.

    Used to be the set piece coach at Brentford, til Arsenal poached him, and then he went on to be manager elsewhere. Was at Southampton for a bit too, but only a very short time.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 7,233 ✭✭✭secman


    A work colleague was at the match against Brentford, he was alarmed at how bad Zirkzee is, looks like he may be shipped out on loan in Jan, at least Antony looked good for a short period of time. Hard to get excited about a home win v Brentford. Far too many false dawns . Never regret a win though.

    Post edited by secman on


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,142 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    From the 3m 20s mark you can clearly see Dalot just completely switched off and lost his man. There's just no excuse for that. He had one job to do and just didn't bother. He should be touch right and stopping him getting a running jump, nevermind leaving him completely free for a header in the 6 yard box. Whatever is going on with him this season he most definitely isn't mentally switched on when it comes to defending. When it keeps happening, almost on a weekly basis then he no longer gets the benefit of the doubt in my mind

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,199 ✭✭✭✭FourFourRED


    I don’t see him going on loan. Only noise about that was Di Canio throwing it out there last week but it seems like nonsense from him.

    He doesn’t look great but only having one full 90 completed and playing up front in a team that for the most part has been pretty poor, would be some mitigating factors. It’s not been all bad but he has frustrated me most of the time he’s been anywhere near the ball. The same could be said for a few others.

    You can’t rely solely on Højlund up front for the season with his injury/form history so there’s no chance he leaves on loan unless someone comes in.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,799 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    Its become apparent that Zirkzee is in no way an actual striker. He is more of a false 9 which means himself and Bruno are generally both tryna fill the same area's.

    And he is a dreadful alternate for Hojlund who is an actual striker as both need to have completely different offensive structures around them.

    I really hope Zirk was an ETH signing because if it was the higher ups that somehow thought he was a striker we already have deeper problems than ETH.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,577 ✭✭✭✭PARlance


    He told us himself during the summer that he wasn't a striker. There was never any doubt that he wasn't imo. The goal against Fulham may have got the vibes rolling but if he got 11 in Serie A last year, I think double figures in the PL for his first year would be an achievement.

    That sais, I would give it some time to see what is the plan for him now that Hojlund and himself seem to be fit... it may be the case that he will start wide with Hojlund central in some games. I wouldn't mind seeing that in games that we can control possession. I can't see him being used behind Hojlund too often, unless Bruno is suspended.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 675 ✭✭✭Annabella1


    looks like Højlund pretty much on his own again this season

    Strikers like wood and welbeck were get able as back up this summer

    Both scored 5 goals each already

    We still have no back up 9



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,404 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,719 ✭✭✭Cotts72


    Neither should be anywhere near the club..arguably wellbeck should never have been sold all those years ago.

    They wouldn't improve our side and we should be looking at No9s that can not only deputise but start of needs be



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 49,304 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    I think you could easily make an aguement to have signed either alongside Zirkzee. I like the… concept (?) of Zirkzee but I don't know if he is a guy you throw on with 20minutes to go if pushing for a goal - not without other tactical changes. He's not a McTominay emergency replacement to go long to.

    IMO Zirkzee's use can only really come from providing chances and spaces for the wingers and the deeper runners. I see his hopeful impact being more like Firminho. He should still be doing better chance wise, but the reality (IMO) is that his impact should be measured in the performances of the players around him (which imo we have not yet seen him have a significant impact on).

    So, saying all that, I think a 'cheap' number 9 that would be the 'in case of emergency' throw them on and try cause some havoc player, the player McTominay basically was, is a missing component of the squad.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,719 ✭✭✭Cotts72


    I agree that another ST should have been brought in to offer something different up top but woods/wellbeck aren't the quality we should be looking at. It's like weghorst all over again. If we were looking at older No9s then taremi should have been the one to look at.

    I look back at the fergie era when we always seemed to have an abundance of strikers that could score goals whether it be in the starting 11 or the bench. I can see united pushing for Sesko next summer but again it's another young ST when we could probably land Oshimen for the same price or even Johnathan David on a free. The other side of it is ETH doesn't seem to want to play with 2 No9s at any stage



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,173 ✭✭✭Caustic


    there aren't many teams in the league with back up strikers near the quality of the starters, as they wouldn't get much playing time and these players cost the most money in transfer fees and wages.

    City have no one, pool have nunez (who did cost a lot but certainly is not a good striker) arsenal have Jesus (again not a great striker) spurs Richardson, villa have that young lad (who is doing great tbf) only Chelsea really have but they have 2 or 3 players in every position.

    Hopefully Hojunds is the man we need and then we have a few options depending on how a game is going, rashford can be used like in his first season under ten hagg as a counter attacking option when we go ahead in games when teams push up (scored a lot of his goals that season like this) Zirkzee once he hopefully gets up to pace can be a creative player for others, and if people need a box crasher we have casmaerio who is absolutely fantastic at getting on the end of crosses but I doubt ten hagg will want to see that much unless in real emergency situations, mct did great last year but its not sustainable football to just have a box crasher on the pitch offering little else.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 49,304 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    To be fair, I don't think there are many coaches that would play with two number 9s. while 442 out of possession seems to be a bigger thing now, I would guess it is mostly similar to what United are doing in that it is a midfielder pushing up into the pressing position to make it a 442 rather than another striker.

    I do wonder if Hojlund and Zirkzee is something we will see - even this week you could argue Zirkzee in for the suspended Bruno. I think it will be ugarte (same midfied as vs barnsley), but Zirkzee at 10 is an experiement we should try at some point.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,577 ✭✭✭✭PARlance


    I wouldn't be concerned about ETH not wanting to play two no.9s at once... not many managers do. The really concerning thing is that he doesn't seem to want two no.9s in the squad.

    Any good manager, football or not, should be ensuring they have adequate resources. Maybe I should bring the Ineos guys in on some of the blame as well. Surely with all their footballing brains, they could have looked at the previous 2 seasons under ETH and see that we are miles away from the top 4 in terms of goals scored, embarrassingly far away, and the lack of goals directly translates into points on the board.

    It's early days for Zirkzee yet and he deserves more time but I can't see him adding a lot more goals than what we lost from McTominay.

    I get what you're saying about the quality but I would absolutely bite someone's hand off to have Welbeck in the squad. That's a sign of how little options we have (and the fact that Welbeck seems a model pro who is still scoring in the PL).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,173 ✭✭✭Caustic


    The most goals Welbeck has scored in the league since he left us is 6, he is 33 now and having his first ever purple patch with 5 goals in a short space of time so may beat that this year but he isn't really an example of someone we would have wanted for the last 10 years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 49,304 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    I just don't think putting Haaland, for example, in our teams actually solves the scoring issue. It would help, but i think our lack of goals is down to an inability to create a volume of chances regularly.

    And I would reckon INEOS thought/hoped that changes could be made that would bring out more goals in Rashford, Hojlund, Zirkzee, Garnacho, Bruno and also Amad and Mount. I think they should be good for goal retrns of 15,15, 10, 10, 10, 5 and 5 in the PL given their quality - thats 70 goals, before you add in an additional few from the likes of Dalot, Eriksen, Mainoo, De Ligt. I would accept that people will think those goal returns are wildly ambitious based on recent evidence, but surely the club have to be thinking about what players could do, when playing to their potential. If we accept they are not playing to their potential, then surely that is the element you need to fix first? Or the replacements will suffer the same fate.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,600 ✭✭✭IncognitoMan


    The best thing about getting Welbeck back as a backup is he'd fill a "trained by the club" spot and potentially open up another spot in the squad that can be used on a foreign player.

    But Welbeck and Chris bloody Wood are many many levels below what we should have in the squad.

    Solanke or Toney are the level of strikers we'd have been looking at before to provide competition for better players but now those level of players PL clubs are looking for small fortunes to sell.

    So we need to think outside the box a little



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,719 ✭✭✭Cotts72


    I'm not saying we should be looking at 442 but more so with regards to when chasing a game ETH never looks at throwing on a second striker...he's more interested in putting an extra Midfielder on instead, perhaps in time when Zirkzee is hopefully acclimatised we may see him come in at times to play off/behind Rasmus.

    Rashford as a ST hasn't worked...there's nothing in the youth team for now that can supplement either. Perhaps Johnathan David is something we should be looking at in January along with Angle Gomes on free transfers to aid our attacking options to allow us spend money elsewhere on an LB and a CM



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 49,304 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    I agree Rashford at St doesn't work, but I thoughy he played quite central with rasmus at the weekend with dalot wide, and did well.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,404 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,142 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    Zirkzee looks like the type of player that needs minutes under his belt to get match sharpness. There's a player there but he's been in and out of the team. I also think he'll struggle in the same team as Bruno with them both looking to occupy the same space at times.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,577 ✭✭✭✭PARlance


    Those figures shouldn't look wildly ambitious at all, but past form would suggest they are ambitious.

    I do agree that no one player is going to make a huge difference if the team just isn't performing/scoring but I'm kind of stuck on the fact that if Hojlund gets injured, we have no one player who can naturally play CF.

    My logic would be that you need to get sufficient resources (an additional player who can play CF as back-up) in place and then once you have those resources, you tackle the problem of style of play / getting them to gel etc.

    We started the season without a CF, it's hard to create fluidity within attacking play when you are plugging holes by playing players out of position. Or when very different players in one position. The LB situation is more or less the same deal for me.

    Maybe we have a manager who constantly wants to change things. If we do, I would expect the Ineos guys to be telling him he needs some sort of basic system / foundation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 6,331 ✭✭✭roosterman71


    Bruno is out for the game in Turkey. Will Zirkzee get deployed in his role?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,173 ✭✭✭Caustic


    Without Bruno we probably have 4 options, Zirkzee, Mount, Erikson, Amad.

    For me personally just to see it, I'd like amad to play there just to see what we look like we a creative ball carrier as a 10, who has the ability to dribble in tight spaces. But given Garnacho is probably due a rest that'd mean starting anothy in a game we need to win.

    Zirkzee might be likely although with Hojund only back from injury it's possible we see him rested and having his minutes managed and Z up top.

    Mount who knows if he will be fit enough but against a Jose side who will sit back maybe we need more creativity.

    Erikson is probably still needed in midfield with Mainoo out unless we go ugarte Casmaerio. But even he could do with a rest after all his games for us and on international duty.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,600 ✭✭✭IncognitoMan


    Early days for Zirkzee but on the eye test he doesn't pass yet.
    He looks kinda clumsy in a way that Firmino never did. They might look to take up similar positions but Firmino was a lot smoother on the ball from what I have seen so far.

    Hopefully he finds his groove and starts to link things together but it's a slow start.

    If we ever went 3 at the back and allowed for 2 strikers it would be interesting to see what Zirkzee and Hojlund could work together. Both big and physical players.

    Bruno linking the midfield to the attack then.

    We don't have a left back anyway so could be an idea worth exploring



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,142 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    The back 3 idea will never happen. We are coming up on 12 months without a fit LB at the club and we haven’t attempted it once. It’s completely mental when you think about it that we still don’t have a fit LB and no sign of one anytime soon.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 49,304 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    BUt then if you look at the build up on Saturday we kinda went:

    …………….Hojlund-Rashford
    Garnacho…….Bruno………..Dalot
    ……………Eriksen…..Carmiro
    …..Martinez…..Evans…..De Ligt
    So it isn't 442, but in possession we kinda did play with Rashford up top, or at least more infield and more involed than when we have isolated him on the left touchline.


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