N3 - Virginia Bypass [route options published]

Because ye are all supposed to be using buses or "active travel" if in/around the town itself. 🙄 Doesn't matter how much longer or impractical it may be - we have to save the planet while China and Russia do whatever sure!

The reality of how people live/work/commute doesn't enter the equation when it comes to the "Green" ideology.

I lived in Virginia myself for a few years about a decade or so ago and it was bad then at peak times so I can only imagine what it's like now. Having the M3 just end at the border where it does was pointless even at that stage.

i would say 4/5 years at earliest before buckets are in the ground.

Shouldn't be a surprise. Large roundabouts are the standard option for Type 2 DCs where the movements on and off will be significant compared to the traffic on the mainline. Compact GSJs are preferred where most traffic is continuing straight ahead. This might seem counter-intuitive, but in the situation where you're using a Type 2 DC, maximising capacity is not the goal: eliminating right turns is.

A full, grade-separated interchange would be very unusual on a Type 2 DC because the expense of this kind of interchange is only justified for traffic levels that are close to the limits of a Type 2. Where a Type 2 continues from a Type 1/Motorway, the recommendation is to use a large at-grade roundabout to give drivers a clear signal that the type of road is changing.

If its the Mullagh road you're referring to, no. It looks as if the existing Derver roundabout may become the defacto exit for Mullagh. The L3021/3020 from Whitegate is a better road than the R194 anyway.

So, as N22 Macroom has been shown to be fine, the argument is basically that Cavan people are more stupid than Cork people?

Not something I'd argue if those people were my electorate...

Even better, refuge laybys are provided every 2 km. There’s also about 1.5 metres between the hard strip and grass verge along most of a 2+2. In extremis, a truck could pull over onto that, and there would still be 6.5 metres of road space free for other vehicles.

This whole argument about hard shoulders was done to death when N22 was being done. Now its open, people can see clearly that with the kind of sight-lines on the road, there’s zero chance of being caught unawares by a truck stopped ahead.

[quote]“It’s not future proof” either, argued Cllr Feeley, who said that road designers nationally are so fixated on installing cycle lanes that they’ve forgotten about the basics.[/quote]

That's it, blame the cyclists.

no, they are suggesting that the entire road design manual be revised so that theres an extra lane for tractors/ lay bys for and aul lads to pull over and take "urgent" phone calls. Probably also half wishing for it to be implemented on already completed N55 schemes.

For info, the N55 upgrades are fantastic but I drive neither a tractor nor have the need to STOP dead in my tracks if someone rings me (em, thanks to new fangled handsfree technology) so a hardshoulder-less road is grand.

They are NOT more dangerous. There's a load of bullshit going around about 2+2 roads, and to be honest I didn't expect you to be one of the ones repeating it.

2+2 has a design speed of 100 km/h. For a Type 1 DC that design speed is 120 km/h. That higher design speed is the main reason why a Type 1 has hard shoulders.

The only alternative to 2+2 here is a wide single, which actually is more dangerous, as it can be shared with bikes and walkers.

There's no way on earth a Type 1 DC can be justified here.

This whole nonsense could be stopped if that councillor would just visit Cork and drive on the N22 Macroom road.

There really isn’t any need. Where there isn’t a layby, there’s sufficient hard strip and verge for a passenger car to be pretty much completely over the edge marking of the road. A tractor or rigid truck might cross that edge marking by 30 cm. That's less than 1 ft in old money.

I think the complaints are from unfamiliarity with what these roads are, plus people not relating given widths and measurements to actual objects. Here's a photo of N22 Macroom with a car conveniently pulled in at the side. They could actually have pulled in a little further, but even this illustrates what I’m trying to say here.

I’ve also put the widths of the various parts onto the drawing.

As I’ve marked, You can actually squeeze four of these cars along that road if you drove slowly enough, but three could pass safely at 60 km/h. If the car pulled in a little onto the drain, then it would have left pretty much the whole 7.0 m of road available to other users.

A tractor with trailer is around 2~2.2 m wide - there's still plenty of room if the driver has done nothing more than pull over to the left edge of their road lane. Three tractors can pass side-by-side on this road.

This section of the road is on an embankment, which is why the edge fencing is so close. For a road at ground level, as N3 will be, the grass verge would be wider, making it even easier to safely get off the road.

That, combined with the long sight-lines (you’d see this car from over a kilometre away) means that there’s no need for hard shoulders. The laybys are large enough for people to get out and stand by the car, but for just “stopping”, they are not needed.