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Harris Vs Trump 2024 US Presidential election - read the warning in the OP posted 18/09/24

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,378 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Lots of things Trump does would be insane, or considered as such, by any other candidate.

    Spouting discredited racist vomit about pets being eaten in a National TV debate.

    It was a Nazi rally, led by Nazis. The Nazi flags were a dead giveaway. This was all confirmed by Snopes.
    If you turned up to that rally, and stayed there while Nazi scum waving Nazi flags chanted about Jews replacing 'us', then newsflash, you are Nazi scum too.

    And we also have Trump spouting Nazi sounding racist vomit about immigrants poisoning the blood of the nation.

    His campaign tweet racist memes about immigrant mobs taking over neighborhoods - no white faces present.

    So what would be insane is the notion that Trump wouldn't dog whistle to racist scum.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 41,599 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    He did. You can gish gallop all you like but he did. It's funny seeing people so desperately defend a bigot on an Irish message board, given how Irish immigrants were initially treated in the US and the UK.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    But those people were fine with marching with nazis. Therefore, they weren't fine people.

    That is assuming such people actually existed and didn't share the beliefs of the nazis they were marching with.

    Can you point out some examples of these people with noble intentions who joined a rally organised by neo nazis?

    Or will it be like when you dodged the Deep State question?



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,558 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    I’m going to say something that should be non controversial, but appears it is. Anyone who praises the leaders of the confederacy is a fine person. None of them.

    The confederacy was built to protect the right to own other human beings. You can give me the “states rights” nonsense, but the leaders of the Confederacy were very clear about it. They enshrined the right to own slaves in their constitution.

    So, not fine people at all.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 41,599 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    The American racism problem really is next level which is a bit ironic when you think about what the Spanish, Portuguese, English, Belgians and Dutch got up to and where they are now, imperfect but better at least.

    Most of those abominable monuments to slavery went up in the twentieth century, well after Robert E. Lee explicitly said that no memorials of any kind should be erected.

    I don't know what it is with the American right and the Confederacy and the Nazis, two entities which lasted a handful of years and lost the only war they ever fought. I've seen a few people mount pathetic defences of both over the years.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 531 ✭✭✭Dingaan


    Ah yes, the tired Irish immigrant analogy. It’s always dragged up with such convenience as a deflection strategy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,560 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    Since no poster has ever been able to a fine person among the Nazis, I think it's fair to say that Trump was either criminally uninformed about an event that he was briefed on or he was dogwhistling to white supremacists. Both scenarios make him pretty unfit to lead the US.

    In fairness, he seems to apply the same fine people logic to Russia invading Ukraine.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,528 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    They were all white nationalists.

    He condemns "the racists" cause someone told him he had to. But he can't help himself and ends up also praising them because that is what he really thinks.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    And condemns them in a way that those white nationalists took as a dog whistle for support.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,854 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    there is a full transcript , quote me the bit where he condemns the white nationalists and explain why that means he praised them , again language to brain disorder is all I see

    Warned and 1 day forum ban applied

    Post edited by Beasty on

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    Perhaps one of the worst posts ever on boards. "Worked for the Democrats in 1944." When did that war start? What were the reasons? Why was Antisemitism an issue in the War for the Allies? Who were the allies? Who ran in the 1944 US Presidential election besides Roosevelt? What was his position re: the ongoing world war?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    The bit where he said there was fine people on the side exclusively composed of white nationalists.

    Do you believe he was referring to imaginary people?



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 41,599 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • Posts: 6,597 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The irony, you have made some frankly incomprehensible statement in this thread. Statement that bare no relationship to whatever was going on in your head at the time.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,725 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    And the Italians, Greeks etc etc and every other out group who was not at all convenienced by what they experienced. History isn’t a deflection.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,560 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    Multiple posters have addressed @silverharp , he's not able to point to any fine people at the rally. So he's now moved onto calling anyone who challenges him as brain damaged in some way. Pretty clearly deflecting from points he can't actually address.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,854 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    thats an assumption isnt it, assuming there were even a few local Black people or Jewish people or even White people there that just had an interest in history the assumption was that they were white supremacists too very convenient circular argument

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Yet defends a fellow who sees imaginary fine people in groups of nazis.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,560 ✭✭✭eightieschewbaccy


    How can't you point to anyone so? Also worth repeating cause you keep avoiding, the rally was not arranged by concerned citizens, it was two prominent neo Nazis. The groups represented weren't the Charlottesville Historical society, it was neo Nazi and white supremacist groups.

    So once again, the burden of proof is on you but you can't prove anything. You were happy to cite snopes until you copped it differed from your unproven claim. No credible news outlet is pointing to any concerned non Nazi citizens cause it was a bunch of extremists present. The big assumptions are coming from you.

    Just to add, the average concerned Jewish or black citizen is unlikely to attend a rally arranged by Neo Nazi and White supremacist rally. It's fair to assume they'd prefer to remain safe from such a rally. But you're bizarrely assuming they'd choose to attend.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    OK.

    Which local black or Jewish people were part of the rally organised by neo nazis where a bunch of nazis chanted abouts Jews not replacing them?

    Can you point to any of them?

    I think it's very clear you can't and won't.

    Your excuses will be very funny.

    It's not an assumption that there were white supremacists were there. They organised the event.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,014 ✭✭✭✭briany


    It's perfectly possible there were people in Charlottesville who were on the side of not taking the statues down just from the perspective of not liking change. Just ordinary folks with not much knowledge of history or who really don't think deeply about political issues.

    But when someone ploughs their car into a throng of people, killing one, you don't need the President of the United States, of all people, making any equivocational statements. No one from the side who were broadly in favour of taking the statues down murdered an innocent on that day. That was the other side. It should be a slam dunk for any president of the US to flatly condemn that action without being tempted to muddy the moral waters in the same speech or presser. It, at best, makes Trump an ignoramus for saying what he said, and at worst he was knowingly trying not to alienate part of his voter base. Both represent a precipitous drop off in the standard of character and statecraft normally expected of a sitting US president.

    The amount of whataboutery in American politics, particularly, is insane. It's like the whole country forget the adage, "Two wrongs don't make a right." So, when it's pointed out how bad Jan 6th was, the usual heads go, "Well, what about the BLM riots?"

    It may break their brain to hear that both of those things can be condemned and you can argue for offenders to get the full penalty of the law in both cases.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    Dockworker strike over till January, anyway.

    https://apnews.com/article/longshoremen-strike-ports-dockworkers-agreement-ila-f136bdcd52738e94f2938aaa79a1fa2a

    Little/no supply chain impacts. Another potential October surprise fizzles.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Yes, there might have been people who attended the tally being ignorant of the organizers and background. But if those people then saw all of the nazi flags and heard all the nazi chants, and didn't immediately leave...

    Not good people.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 955 ✭✭✭The Phantom Jipper


    Condemning Nazis who have murdered a woman in an act of domestic terrorism is among the easiest tasks an American president has ever had. Contrast his craven and mealy-mouthed response to that incident to his usual attacks on the most benign of things (scum, vermin, dogs etc); it was jarring then and still is to this day.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,879 ✭✭✭political analyst


    The point is the nature of the European regime that the Allies fought against. The Ayatollah wants to destroy the only Jewish-majority country - just like what was being done to Jews on the European mainland.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,233 ✭✭✭Oscar_Madison
    #MEGA MAKE EUROPE GREAT AGAIN


    Very interesting approach measuring people betting preferences as opposed to how they will actually vote - and no I’m not link dumping but go ahead and report the post if you so wish !


    Data scientist Thomas Miller has crafted a model for forecasting the 2024 presidential election that, he says, is far more reliable than the polling that’s constantly cited in the media as the best guide to the outcome on Nov. 5. Instead, the Northwestern University professor deploys a framework based on the betting odds set by folks wagering their dollars not on the candidate they intend to vote for, but the one they expect to win. 

    https://fortune.com/2024/10/03/kamala-harris-trump-latest-polls-swing-states/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,633 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    But, you stated the nature of the German government impacted events in 1944. Do you think that war just started in 1944? As a reminder, it started in 1939 and the US joined in 1941. The events of 1933+ forward indeed included obvious antisemitic policies by the German dictatorship.

    Was the antisemitism of the German government impactful on the war? I think not - the US didn't join until attacked by Japan. The UK, France, etc. didn't get to fighting until the invasion of Poland in 1939.

    None of this had anything to do with destruction of European Jewry, which was underway by 39, but the dramatic rampup came a little bit later, in 1941.

    So, what's this got to do with 1944? What exactly 'worked' for the Democrats in 1944? Why did you choose 1944?



  • Posts: 6,597 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    That's going to be real limited dataset he has to work with which means it's robustness over the long term is going to be very poor. Can he test it over more than a few election cycles ?

    I call BS on this approach, the intelligence of crowds as measured by betting preference is just agrigating more fools.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,378 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    You kinda buried the lead there…

    Harris holds a 66-electoral vote lead over Trump… By basic electoral math, says Miller, Harris as of today holds a lock on most of the big swing states, looking like a sure winner in Wisconsin, Minnesota, Pennsylvania, and Michigan. He adds that Harris also had Georgia in her column when she reached 337 EVs at the apex of her post-debate climb on Sept. 20. Now, he says, the modest Trump bump has put the Peach State back in play, and Trump also stands a good chance in North Carolina. But for now the states that have loomed as most pivotal since the race began remain beyond his reach.

    I would add, not all bets are placed under that metric generally. Some people think at the odds given, it is worth betting on, there is a difference. But maybe it does apply to PredictIT, which is what Miller is basing it on.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,529 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Both polls and betting odds are flawed in many ways and can provide general insights only. Polls are often based on small sample sizes, who happens to answer, and how the questions are phrased. Betting odds are based on who people are betting on to win (rather than who they prefer), what the odds are in terms of a payout, and are only based on the subsect of people who bet. Wild swings in both can demonstrate a changing electorate and possible vote shifts, but small fluctuations between yesterdays polls/odds and todays are often just inconsequential.



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