Kilkenny GAA Thread

Genuinely not having a go at you but I’m confused…. weren’t you one of the posters saying the older players have to move on? You seem to be contradicting yourself.

And again the onus is on the manager to move them on if he feels they’re no longer making a contribution.
Why would any player retire himself if it’s a huge part of his life and he enjoys what he’s doing?

As far as personal gain is concerned, have you any idea of the commitment and sacrifices these players have to make in relation to their time and missed opportunities in relation to travel and social life etc..? Anything they get is well and truly earned many times over.

Personally I’m always disappointed from a totally selfish point of view when a young talented Kilkenny hurler doesn’t want to make that commitment and basically give up his twenties and early thirties to the cause, so I’m certainly not going to come on here and criticise the ones that did.

Show them a bit of respect, it’s the least they deserve.

well Charlie, I don’t think I’m contradicting myself I just feel the end result needs to be a clear out. Derek should have been moving things a bit the first year which he didn’t, he should certainly of been changing it up the second year and he done absolutely nothing.so we are now left with this situation. Wat would you think of that yourself.

A lot of the worrying points for me is that some of the names people (not just on here) are talking about are lads who have been on the panel before. Bill Sheehan, for the brilliant club player he is, is probably below the level needed at county level and when he was on the panel lads were giving out that he wasn't good enough! I haven't been to as many games as I usually would be at due to other commitments but the below are a list of lads who I have seen who are worth a call up or more of a chance next year:

Padraig Moylan (Boro)

Martin O'Neill (Mooncoin)

Billy Reid (Glenmore)

Colman O'Sullivan (Tullogher)

Harry Shine (Boro)

Paul Cody (Clara)

Jeff Neary (GBC)

Paul Hennebry (Mooncoin)

Marty Murphy (Tullogher)

Ed McDermott (Village)

Killian Corcoran (Shamrocks)

There are probably more that I haven't seen and some of these are young and we'd be looking to the future with them but as Village87 said we have to start planning for 2/3 time where we could have a very talented settled team but we need to put in the hard work, and maybe take a bit of pain, in 2025 with a view to the having a strong team from 2026 on. We cannot do what we did to the likes of Darragh Corcoran last year of putting him in a central position and then the minute it goes wrong he's taken off and not given much of a chance for the rest of the year. Lads have to be given time to gain experience and make mistakes, we can't be chopping and changing players in key positions like we did last year to in the end go back to the same as we had the previous year.

Well Ned you are welcome back into the fold . I only saw 5 of those players so far this year, the two Boro lads, the village man, the Ballycallan man and the Glenmore man and I would agree with your pick of all those lads and I would certainly take your word on the others who I hope I will still see some of them. I was very impressed with Billy Reid. On Bill Sheehan I only mentioned him as an example of not getting enough game time , I think a lot of the problem is that they expect to be dropped when they are getting so little game time when given the chance and not performing great they then drop the head.

the trouble is in my opinion we are starting this year where we were at this stage two years ago. So if we are starting from scratch we can’t use the league for the simple reason is that it is necessary to stay in division one, what would be the point competing in a lower grade the following year.so what I suggested earlier about the three grade senior, junior and intermediate competing in trials and pick a big panel off of this. Have to go to a meeting bye.

I think the point is he didn't necessarily need to cull the panel in 2023 but probably should have used that year to give some of the youngsters their chance particularly in the league. One poor performance and lads get relegated to the panel not even the bench. As someone else said lads have to be allowed make mistakes and learn from them.

Whatever about 2023 last year was a real lost opportunity he essentially ran back the same team as 23 and 22. I know for a fact that one of the players that people saying should have gone sat down with Derek. He told him he was ready to finish and he wasn't interested in just being a panel player or being there for the sake of it. Derek convinced him to stay and that he was needed. He wasn't needed and wasn't used much all year. That was a perfect opportunity for Derek to get rid of a senior player who was past it at IC level but he choose to go the opposite way.

This could and should have been a gradual process newer lads given a chance, older lads moving on or being pushed on. Last year many of us saw Shane Murphy really progress to a level I didn't know he had to be honest but one shakey half against Dublin and he wasn't seen again. I thought for the amount of messing around they did with Shane in different positions that he did really well and should have been given more chances. He is flying it in the few matches I've seen Glenmore play.

In 23 I was hoping TJ would stay and I probably was last year too. I'm indifferent this year I think he'll add a bit on the day but I don't think it will be enough to get us an All Ireland. That being the case I think he should move on but I doubt he will.

The others mentioned should go too. Wally is done as is Fogarty, hey have been great servants but they've had two years plus without being regular starters that's not going to change as they age. If Richie Reid was played in a different position he might be useful but he can't be CB against a top team. Murph is the best shot stopper I'll likely ever see but he's puck outs are way behind Tallis'.

I'd also question Lyngs judgement on coaching. From what I've heard he convinced a reluctant Conor Phelan to stay on last winter, that they wanted to play his style but then Donovan did virtually all the coaching. I don't know Donovan and maybe he's the next Kinnerk but from those I've spoken to, who do know him, they wouldn't put him at that level.

One last thing I hoped would have changed from the Cody era was the communication we all know from interviews, biographies or chats with the ex players Cody and most of his regime communicated very little with the players. When Derek was with Cody he was seen as the approachable one so I had hope that would carry on into his own management style. My all accounts I've heard, he's turned into Cody and communication in the camp is very poor.

I suppose Derek only ever played under one manager and was only ever part of one management set up so he's doing what he has seen work before but I thought he would realise that it needed a new approach.

I really like Derek he's a very nice guy and I'll be pulling for him this year but he does need to straighten his house out. It's not an easy job and fair dues to him for taking it on after BC as it was always going to be hard. Unfortunately he has spent his honeymoon credits and has gained little for it.

In my mind he would be best off going with a clear out as there will be less pressure to succeed with an inexperienced team than there will be if runs back the same team again. There will always be pressure in Kilkenny we want to win but if he has a young team he will get some leeway.

Yeah Brennan needs to be up forward.

Yeah I agree now they are too old to bring in maybe Kenny was asked. Yeah Sweeney is small and not massive in bulk but I have seen him a few times and he has cleaned out kk players and even last week he ran the show.

Tom Monaghan of Galway not massive either but a good player. Look as we say too old now probably but are they being missed at 25/28?

I recall a good chat with a player from Thomastown on a Kk intermediate panel a few years back and how it was a really poor set up but they basically brought in all the kk21s who had just been beaten by Westmeath and of course that turned lads off. This kinda negligence has cost us. County board are so inept!

And also on the S&C side we are catching up but still you might as well be small and class than muscly and useless!

No word on Selectors? Mick Kav isn’t going in as far as I know.

Not sure about Donovans credentials at all so can’t say much. But on the coaching in our county we are behind.

Are you insinuating our greatest ever player is motivated to stay on the Kilkenny panel by personal gain? He is the only self employed player I am aware of. Perhaps you would clarify.

Not sure they will ever be involved but the best coaches out there in my opinion are:

Jimmy Meagher, Willie Maher, Thomas Mullally, Eddie Brennan.

Might have left out one or two but the above will probably never be involved for a combination of reasons. Pity.

The jury is still out on Eddie for me I think he’s a good manager but I think Niall Corcoran does a lot of the coaching where ever they ve been together

Yeah agree look take my bias out of it we need a big one from both this weekend or we are in bother!

Let's hope he doesn't do another interview before tomorrow 😂