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Amazon WFH Policy

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,109 ✭✭✭✭Xavi6


    Sounds like you've just got bad staff tbh, maybe as a result of being micromanaged.

    I'm a manager with a lot of direct reports and my company has mandated a 50% office attendance policy which to me is a happy enough medium. Trekking into the office for no meetings is a waste of my time so I plan my WFH days accordingly and commute when there's a need to interact in person (even then, most meetings don't need to be face-to-face or could be an email)

    I allow my people longer lunches if they want when they WFH, to go collect the kids from school, to have staggered start and finish times, to take a cancellation at the dentist, to get their car serviced, and much more. And in return, their productivity has gone up over the past few years and I have no negative attrition. If people are happy and producing then there's no need for me to micromanage. Everyone wins.

    I also get more done at home simply because I'm out of sight, out of mind and don't have people tapping me on the shoulder every ten minutes. Like most things, balance is key and hybrid should be the way forward wherever possible. If you can't trust your people, maybe a review is needed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,109 ✭✭✭✭Xavi6


    "Up sticks", bringing a laptop in a bag and plugging it into the monitors in the office instead of the ones at home? This is quite the dramatisation.

    Hybrid is better than 100% of either.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,278 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    I've done this based solely on the attitude of HR, HR is one of the defining reasons not to take a job in some places, they are simply awful. Stupid sh1t like, you have to start 4 weeks from the job offer date, and not understanding that no, I won't be handing in my notice until I see a contract in my hand and that notice could be longer than 4 weeks.

    I disagree, sometimes during the interview itself, you find out something about the role or company that doesn't work for you, that is it, nothing more, nothing less.



  • Posts: 4,229 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I am referring to internal vacancies. The person is already employed by the company and researching the role is something you do before you do the interview. And when it's in-house, it's a lot easier to find out stuff.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 21,529 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    so the posters here are full of hot air is what you are saying? I tend to agree. As for your thoughts on the best way to progress i disagree.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,642 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    In house you might get a internal counter offer or hear something in the grapevine afterwards that wasn't in the interview.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 639 ✭✭✭SodiumCooled


    While I would like a fully remote job or one that you only pop into the office a few days per month hybrid is indeed a nice medium. I do like keeping my WFH and office days in a row though, not that it’s a big job as you say but it’s nice to get a run in one place and the other. So I have always done Monday and Friday at home.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,307 ✭✭✭twin_beacon


    Salaries are higher in the US but its all relative. People graduating college in the US basically leave with a mortgage of college loans, the APR can be 7-8% on that too.

    Its very clear what Amazon are doing in bringing people back into the office for 5 days a week. They want to reduce their work force, and this is the cheapest way of doing this, you work people out of a job, it costs the employer nothing. They can say its about efficiencies and being able to collaborate better, but that's all a big pile of BS. I work in a US tech company, the whole company is WFH since covid. We have offices across 4 locations in North America and Europe. We have no single team, in any of our departments that are based in a single location. My current team consists of individuals working out of 4 different countries, so if we were to go back into the office, my day wouldn't be much different that it is at home, when I need to talk to some team members, its via IM or teams calls. I would expect the situation in Amazon is very similar.
    Thankfully, we have downsized our office space in Dublin, which has saved us a lot of money in both rent and energy bills. we have only hot desks now, and only enough for around 1/3 of our Dublin work force.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,307 ✭✭✭twin_beacon


    It really depends on the type of industry you are in. Lower paid workers in a dead end boring job are far more likely to slack off. Higher paid, career driven employees in a satisfying job where there is great career growth potential rarely slack off.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,642 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    No shortage of scandals involving highly paid people at the top getting nothing done. I've met a few top level people I wouldn't let build Lego. Dangerous with a crayon.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 297 ✭✭Dr.Tom


    Wouldn't be so sure about that…..

    I previously worked for a global medical device company and the type of people promoted weren't career driven.

    They were basically bottom kissers, knew who to befriend and knew what committees to be on in order to increase their salary.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 21,529 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    Doesnt say much for the places you work folks, management are being described as idiots, barely able to tie their own shoe laces and being promoted because of their sucking up abilities,

    id get out now before they go under….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 220 ✭✭HurlingBoy


    I agree. Companies that build a culture of career growth and employee development will not be impacted by WFH policies. If you know that you are going to get recognition by working hard you will still need to get the work done at home or in the office. Often in these companies workers will feel that being in the office is to your advantage i.e building better networks, visibility etc. It might suit some people when they get to a certain level to just do the minimum and not work the longer hours to focus on family e.g if worker has young kids that they need to look after, etc but they do run the risk of staying on the same level for too long and these are the first out door if company cuts headcount. For other companies that don't value career growth WFH can have a negative effect on morale particular if the WFH policies are not adhered and those violating the rules are not pulled up on it. If a manager is not in the office you cannot expect his direct reports to be motivated or if a direct report is not in the office and gets away with it the other team members will not be happy either.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,307 ✭✭✭twin_beacon


    I seen similar stuff before early in my career, when I worked for a large American Financial company. After two years of doing good work, no promotion because there wasn't a "business need" for our department to have a higher grade software engineer, and no pay increase because I was on the "appropriate" rate for an engineer at that grade. All the time other engineers were being promoted in different departments. So I left, went to a much smaller company where you couldn't hide, and career progression was based on how good you are at doing your job, not based on who you are friendly with!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,990 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    Yup, I think a lot of people will say and do different things. The jobs market is also a factor as well, so if it was gang busters like 2/3 years ago, then people can speak with their feet and bail. I am sure some actually have left due to certain circumstances changing, not saying that it doesn't happen, just not as often.

    We of course can disagree on how to progress (I was expecting that), I am at the stage in my career to know that all that matters is getting your work done, showing up, and not being a dick. "High performers" etc, who burn the midnight oil and do tasks outside of their JD, they aren't guaranteed a promotion, or safety if the company falls on hard times, that is a myth. So my own advice to young professionals is to do your work with the least amount of effort, foster good relationships in your job, but always put your own needs before that of any company.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,571 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    Whatever the rationale for Amazon to do this, it ultimately means that WFH isn't an option for any staff anymore. Just say they get their headcount down, do the bring it back in again?

    The rationale for removing it isn't really that important to those that work there or plan to work there in future.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,642 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,642 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    It's obvious some here only have the experience of one mostly company. If you've worked across a number of companies and industries, or as a contractor you see the reality of it all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 21,529 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    no one is guaranteed anything but there are ways to make it more likely you will be the one promoted or not the one cut.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,109 ✭✭✭✭Xavi6


    If that hybrid arrangement works for you, great. My team all work different days and hours to suit their personal needs and preferences. I WFH on days I’ve football training so I’m not rushing home from the office and can eat properly before playing. The work gets done so it doesn’t matter who’s where on what days for the most part. How it should be.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,307 ✭✭✭twin_beacon


    will they bring it back? Who knows. If they need to hire more people in the future, and they are failing to attract the talent they require, then I would wager nothing would be off the table.

    The rational given by the CEO makes zero sense,
    "Andy Jassy emphasized the benefits of in-person work, such as increased collaboration, innovation and cultural connection."
    Thats pure BS, have a look at the amazon share price now compared to 2019, when everyone attended the office 5 days a week. Its all optics and money saving, this means that they don't have to announce and most importantly, pay for redundancies.

    https://thehill.com/opinion/technology/4885672-amazon-return-office-controversy/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,571 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    Again the rationale isn't important to the people currently working there or those that may work there in future. It's just another organisation that doesn't have a WFH policy.

    If Amazon are having issues filling positions down the line I doubt they will put it down to a lack of a WFH policy and if they do they will no doubt increase some other area of employee benefits.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,990 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    That is a misguided myth, I am afraid. No one is more or less likely to be promoted or saved if they work beyond what is asked of them. If anything, high performers (which would possibly earn more), would be more likely if anything to be cut in layoffs, bigger salary gone means bigger savings for the company.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 21,529 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    A misguided myth ? In whatever planet you are on how do people get promoted ?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,990 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    Oh dear, that is not what I said :)

    but there are ways to make it more likely you will be the one promoted or not the one cut.

    People get promoted by doing their work, simple as that. As for your inference that if you work extra hard etc, that you would be less likely to be laid off etc, that is pure fallacy. When it comes to layoffs, it settles on the cost saved, not who works the hardest.



  • Posts: 3,330 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Screenshot_20240925_191623_LinkedIn.jpg

    I saw this on LinkedIn from an Irish recruitment agency. Interesting results. WFH is hugely important to so many people nowadays, for a variety of reasons. Lack of time/expense for commuting has to be one of the main reasons.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 21,529 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    oh dear indeed, your post is there for anyone else to read.

    It’s a given that people do their work, not everyone gets promoted, funny that ? If you don’t do your work you tend to get ushered out.

    Your inference that being a better performer won’t make you any less likely to be laid off is pure fallacy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,990 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    It’s a given that people do their work, not everyone gets promoted, funny that ? If you don’t do your work you tend to get ushered out.

    Well colour me surprised. It is just not a given that people do their work, and there are different factors that involve a promotion, people can often refuse them if a company only has a narrow track for them to go in. Take management as an example, a high performing dev might get offered the promotion of dev manager, but refuses because management is not a route they wish to pursue, so it goes to next inline. The high performer didn't get the promotion, but how can that be???

    Your inference that being a better performer won’t make you any less likely to be laid off is pure fallacy.

    Sounds like you have no exposure or experience with this, kinda shows. Layoffs revolve around money mostly, there are other issues that can be a factor like cultural fit etc, but it primarily revolves around money. If you think that someone, who goes above and beyond, is safer than someone on the same or less money, you really haven't a clue how business work at all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,642 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    The old Elon/Thanos is quite accurate. They'll just cut down the middle on financial basis. Perhaps the finance dept is duplicated or can be outsourced. Click it's gone top to bottom. R&D too expensive click it's gone.

    That's said the whole interview for your job, that's classic. Nothing like it to cull numbers.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,307 ✭✭✭twin_beacon


    ..



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