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New bus gates on Bachelors Walk and Aston Quay

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,274 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,000 ✭✭✭✭cgcsb


    Not sure where you are living but there is no legal way that a rush hour commute between the suburbs and Dublin City Centre is faster by car than by public transport. An of course the fastest, cheapest and easiest solution to PT reliability issues is to dedicate more road space to public transport.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,728 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere


    I came up Bachelors Walk today. It was bedlam. 2 okes in yellow overalls standing by the traffic lights where the cars & busses switch lanes pointing cars to switch to the left lane ( to go up OCS ). But the yellow box was being constantly blocked , & then plenty of cars driving straight onto Eden Quay. I also saw one turn right for D’Olier Street.
    What’s the effing point in obeying the law when people cannot be arsed or it’s not enforced?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,714 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    Even allowing for the lawbreakers, there are still far fewer drivers driving east/west or v.v. than there were - that’s the point.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,851 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    The first month of these changes is always about people not knowing and redirecting them. The second month is about penalising them.



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  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 23,625 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    And note someone from DCC said exactly that in a RTE interview, that Garda enforcement will be brought in after the introductory period. They just want to inform and encourage people for now, which I think is fair enough.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,622 ✭✭✭IngazZagni


    Private cars are still driving through College Green. Very little enforcement there. On the quays I witnessed a driver nearly run over the traffic warden despite him clearly telling him to turn right. Only ANPR cameras will fix this problem.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,988 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Where are we with ANPR cameras?
    Does this subject require its own thread, given how important they are and how much of a difference they’d make?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,714 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    They may be, but not in numbers to cause a serious problem to the bus service.

    I can remember when there was a traffic jam from Parnell Square to Nassau Street.

    That doesn’t exist any more.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,097 ✭✭✭✭Zebra3


    I don’t see how allowing people to break the law is acceptable.

    If motorists are incapable of following sign posts and the rules of the road, take away their licence.



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  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 23,625 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    I don’t disagree, but we don’t really do things that way in Ireland!

    If you had strong enforcement from day one, you would have those folks on Joe Duffy moaning that they didn’t notice, etc.

    By leaving enforcement for a month or more, but with lots of staff trying to direct people, etc. they can’t use that excuse once the Gardai roll out. I’m sure they will still try, but there would be little public sympathy.

    As annoying as it is to see people get away with rule breaking, in the end the goal of this is to improve public transport, not catch every last offender.

    Keep in mind there is a PR element to all this, this change is supposed to be reviewed in a few months, we don’t want to see it reversed! And we have many other similar bus gate type schemes to rollout, which we don’t want to risk.

    So as annoying as it is I think the softly softly approach is the right approach for now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,430 ✭✭✭Hippodrome Song Owl


    I wish this was true. I don't drive and I'm 100% in support of prioritising public transport in every way possible and don't disagree with what you say there at all. But right now if you depart large parts of Lucan at 8am weekdays to commute to the city centre - say Leeson Street for example, it will take 45 mins to 1 hour by car, but 1 hour minimum to Pearse Street by bus plus however long to get to Leeson Street from there. Of course, some days, cars will be held up by particularly bad traffic, but that's the typical journey time. The nature of routes that wind around every housing estate and which have been endlessly extended to incorporate thousands of new houses with no new routes introduced, means it takes 30 mins just to get to the N4 - very often 40 minutes.

    During school holidays the discrepancy is even greater as cars benefit from the light traffic while bus users experience "a short delay to get the bus back on schedule " at several stops. So as much as I wish your statement was true, it's unfortunately not in my experience.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 149 ✭✭Kincora2017


    I’ve now cycled/walked up the North Quays about 20 times since the restrictions have been in place, at various times. Without commenting on the knock on effects elsewhere (as I don’t have enough info on this) the change in the environment of the quays is amazing. They are just a much more pleasant place to be as a cyclist and as a pedestrian. The completed Liffey Street is probably helping this as well.

    It’s a real glimpse in what is possible for Dublin. I have always personally thought that the Luas should have went on the quays and all other traffic being one street in, rather than the opposite which is the way it is. While this will never happen now, I have genuine hope to one day see the North quays fully pedestrianised between Jervis and the Custom House. The lift it would give the city would , in my opinion, far outweigh any downsides. I really hope the usual neigh-sayers can set aside their prejudices and actually look at what this small change has made, and what other possibilities there are



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,000 ✭✭✭✭cgcsb




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,172 ✭✭✭Ben D Bus


    Bikes could continue. The alternative to buses could be DART Underground :)



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 23,625 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Trams and buses can share the same route. They do so all over Europe and even in Dublin, see College Green.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,000 ✭✭✭✭cgcsb


    I had a look at the 2023 canal cordon report today. Post covid trips to the city centre still haven't recovered to the 2019 peak which is a concern. I expect it might be 2 or 3 years till we see that 2019 peak again, by which time hopefully the roll out of bus connects and a few cycling projects can make a dent. The 2024 canal cordon count will be interesting to see how drastic an impact the bus gate has made and the Westland row/Pearse st left turn ban (if that happens before november).

    NTA-Canal-Cordon-Report-2023.pdf (nationaltransport.ie)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 952 ✭✭✭lordleitrim


    But if 1000s of workers who never WFH pre Covid buy regularly do so now, it would make sense why that section of traffic hasn't increased. Also, if car traffic into the city centre is on a general downward trajectory anyway, why would car journeys not reaching pre Covid levels be a concern? Don't we want less car traffic within the canals?



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 23,625 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    If you dig into the data, there is some very interesting trends there.

    Basically it suggests that those travelling in or near the city has recovered to or even surpassed 2019 figures, while those travelling longer distances from outside the city haven't recovered.

    Luas is back to 2019 levels and Dublin Bus have actually surpassed it, both modes in or closer to the city, while Irish Rail and BE continue to be significantly down on 2019, modes which are typically much longer distance.

    It suggests to me that those living far outside the city are still taking advantage of WFH or various hybrid working options. While the city center population continues to grow.

    Good to see that public transport and active travel mode share continues to grow and cars continue to shrink, cars just 26% now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 897 ✭✭✭DumbBrunette


    Not sure if this has been posted before, but it's a very deep dive by RTE on the benefits and downsides of different transport modes in Dublin.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,000 ✭✭✭✭cgcsb


    The Concern is that all journeys are down on the 2019 peak, not just by car.



  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 23,625 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Well not all are down, DB has surpassed 2019 and Luas is basically equal. Yes, cars, walking and longer distance train/bus are down, (cycling down a little but pretty close).

    Sort of suggest to me a certain amount of modal shift happening.

    What I'm guessing is happening:

    There is still a significant amount of people WFH or hybrid working, which has freed up space on DB/Luas, so people who live closer to the city who in the past wouldn't have been able to squeeze onto a packed bus/Luas and would walk/cycle instead, are now choosing to get on the Bus/Luas as their is some spare room.

    For cars, I suspect it is the same reason BE/Trains are down, those who drive are typically (yes generalisation) coming from much further outside the city and are perhaps more likely to continue to WFH if they can.

    The question I'd have is this a long term trend or just a short term blip?

    If it is a long term trend, then perhaps we should be putting more emphasis and investment on shorter distance PT services like Metrolink, Luas lines, BusConnects. But if it is just a short term blip, then all it is doing is giving us some breathing space to start working on improving the longer distance commuter services.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,851 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    If we build housing more densely in the city between the canals, the trend could become self-sustaining.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,786 ✭✭✭Phil.x


    Went up and down the quays this week after 7pm, south side is free flowing and fast due to little traffic. North side at bus gate is a **** show (but it was planned to be) green light for cars is 5 seconds long.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,246 ✭✭✭Daith


    Seems fairly positive. Though I'm not sure I get the reasoning about potentially allowing blue badge holders to drive in bus corridors.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,000 ✭✭✭✭cgcsb


    I think that disability group are a front tbh



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,274 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    i hope if I'm ever disabled or elderly they don't plan our transport system around me



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,000 ✭✭✭✭cgcsb


    They just don't seem all that concerned with actual access issues like the many locations in the city where footpaths are too narrow for a wheelchair, e.g. SWS or the lack of safe crossing places or where footpaths are too littered with signposts to actually get around. They are uniquely focused on making bus and cycle infrastructure unworkable

    Post edited by cgcsb on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,246 ✭✭✭Daith


    Yeah, I was a bit surprised that allowing PwD drive in bus corridors was the only thing mentioned or at least reported.

    Do those orgs not have other concerns. Was just a bit odd.



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,990 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Posted on the cycling forum earlier: https://www.independent.ie/regionals/dublin/dublin-news/private-car-use-in-dublin-city-drops-significantly-due-to-traffic-plan-on-quays/a1584918723.html



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