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USA 2024 presidential election

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,803 ✭✭✭hometruths


    Those are the candidates who put their own personal ambition above trying to save democracy in America. They sound like a great bunch.



  • Site Banned Posts: 1,331 ✭✭✭Yvonne007


    Jesus. When he said he would be a dictator on day one, it was an obviously tongue in cheek remark. But you have people claiming that it is an admission that he would be an actual dictator.

    It's absolutely crazy how some people willingly misrepresent things he says when there are countless genuine concerns and things that are egregious about the man.

    Bizarre behaviour.

    It would be like someone claiming that Biden definitely questions the legitimacy of people's race when he said "if you have a problem figuring out whether you’re for me or Trump, then you ain’t black"



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 32,814 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    What are you basing it being tongue in cheek on? He has said it multiple times and I have heard the context in which he said it. He is deadly serious.

    How is it misrepresented? He clearly feels he was constrained from doing what he really wanted in his previous administration and wishes to unleash chaos this time round. The man is not subtle in his speech mor has he ever knowingly made a joking or playful comment. He may have verbal diarrhea but the one benefit of this is you get to understand exactly what he's thinking.

    His desire to gut the civil service and populate it with people who will unquestionably do his bidding no matter the legal nature of them and to unshackle himself from all controls and norms is one of the more egregious things about the man. And he's telling you directly that he'll do it and you're ignoring it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38,081 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    The Snopes fact check on this even clarifies:

     For the record, virtually every source that covered the Unite the Right debacle concluded that it was conceived of, led by and attended by white supremacists, and that therefore Trump's characterization was wrong

    The only person making stuff up is Trump, by pretending that there were fine people on both sides there that day.

    There were not.

    One side was a racist mob, pure and simple.

    Therefore, de facto, Trump was openly praising white supremacists by implying some of them were fine people.

    It is Trump giving cover to a racist mob.

    You have been duped by Trump's lies and racist dog whistling.

    Trump is a racist, who has, during the current campaign come out with stuff about immigrants poisoning the blood of the nation, eating pets, and similar race baiting memes.

    So why would someone go to these lengths today to defend him on the semantics of what exactly he may or may not have intended to mean in 2017?

    It doesn't make any sense does it?

    It was like the posters trying to excuse stuff from Trump like grab them by the pussy… that it didn't mean Trump is a sexual predator, he was just joking … and then we had Trump established as a rapist by a court of law.

    Why do people go to these lengths to make excuses for Trump?

    He is not just joking. He is revealing himself and people don't seem to be able to handle the truth and so resort to excuse making.


    That never do the same for any other politicians at home or abroad.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Site Banned Posts: 1,331 ✭✭✭Yvonne007


    Trump Says He Won’t Be a Dictator ‘Except for Day One’ if Re-Elected | WSJ News (youtube.com)

    You mean to say you believe this quote is deadly serious?

    So then you also believe that after day one after he closes the border and drills baby drills, he won't be a dictator?

    Or do you just take him verbatim when it suits you?

    The man is a buffoon, but why do you choose the most benign and false things to prove your point?



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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 45,402 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Again, despite previous denials to the contrary, you're posting in defence of Trump. Please make up your mind.

    Nonetheless, what you're saying is that he didn't mean what he said. So in other words, you cannot believe anything Trump says

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  • Site Banned Posts: 1,331 ✭✭✭Yvonne007


    I've not been duped. I don't agree with Trump on most things. I don't find him appealing. I don't find him likeable.

    I just think that stupid **** like saying he is a white supremacist is silly.

    I like to discuss politics and this particular election cycle is remarkable. but it's absolutely pointless on here. Unless you caveat any statement with "Trump is a prick too", you are accused of being a Trump supporter and piled on.

    I have no skin in the game, I don't like Harris, I don't like Trump, but the race interests me. Nothing more, nothing less.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38,081 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    The man is a buffoon. Why are you going to bat for him in post after post?

    He tried to steal the last election… so yes, when he dog whistles about being a dictator alarm bells go off.

    You could add your own detailed criticisms of … well these are the things I see he has done that are not benign, this is why he is not a fit and proper person to be President.

    But you never do, do you?

    Instead it is post after post defending the semantics of this point or that point defending Trump.

    When have you ever posted an unprompted criticism of Trump, or defence of a Democrat or public figure against one of his baseless scurrilous attacks?
    So you are not doing so from some commitment, equally applied to both sides, to a high standard of proof for claims.

    For someone who claims not to have skin in the game, your posts create the entirely contrary impression.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Site Banned Posts: 1,331 ✭✭✭Yvonne007


    Nope. Pointing out that you are saying something wrong is not defending Trump.

    And perhaps you should take your own advice. You don't believe Donald Trump, until it's adventageous to your stance. Then everything he says should be taken as gospel.

    But as per usual, anything that isn't critical of Trump, is classed as defence. I don't like the man. I just like actual discussion that is in good faith and I think that parroting debunked and easily disproven statements like "remember when he praised white supremacists at the rally" doesn't lend to good conversation.

    I'll leave you guys to it.

    As I said earlier, I thought the politics forum would be of a higher standard than CA, but I was wrong.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,242 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    No. They know that democracy will still be there in 4 years after Trump.

    There was the practicality of the nomination sown up by Biden early on. His being bounced out and Harris being anointed by the leadership, so there was also no chance of the party members deciding in an open contest.



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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 45,402 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Mod: you've engaged in low level trolling which has been clear and despite other posters here engaging with you in good faith, you've continued with your approach. I also encouraged you yesterday to post with more credibility and you've apparently just ignored me. Next time it will be an actual ban.

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  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,803 ✭✭✭hometruths


    Harris being anointed by the leadership, so there was also no chance of the party members deciding in an open contest.

    I guess we'll never know if Harris was anointed by the leadership because clearly nobody else was prepared to put their name forward, or nobody put their name forward because Harris was clearly going to be anointed by the leadership.

    I suspect at least some of the names bandied about decided they would be personally better off by sitting this **** show out.

    I agree democracy will still exist in four years time irrespective of the result.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,792 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    In a 2 way race there is only 2 outcomes, Harris will either win or the USA will loose, until we know what way every citizen in the swing states chooses to vote it's only logical to assume they will make one of the 2 candidates president



  • Posts: 1,167 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Me fighting in a heavyweight boxing world championship is a 1vs1. Does not mean that I have a 50% chance.

    One of us will win but it's not 50% split



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,335 ✭✭✭✭Rjd2


    Tell that to the lunatics are still betting Michelle Obama to win this. 😂



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 45,402 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    …but it isn't actually a 2 way race given that there are more than two candidates!
    (Although the candidate from one of the two big parties is pretty much guarranteed to win)

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,310 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Latest national poll has her 5 points ahead of Trump. Plus a clear majority thought she won the debate.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,781 ✭✭✭Flaneur OBrien




  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 17,383 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Here's the thing though.

    If you were at that rally , even just to stand on the pavement and watch it go by , by default at the very very least you are a White Supremacist apologist and a racist.

    Simple as that.

    Not physically holding a Tiki-torch or not being a card carrying member of the local KKK isn't a get out of jail free card.

    So - the absolute facts are that there were not "Fine people on both sides" , not at all.

    His message was a dog whistle get out clause designed to not offend the Nazi-adjacent people who went to see that rally but didn't necessarily actively participate. That way , the racist cowards who went to watch the Sh!t-bags march get to think to themselves "Well , obviously he didn't mean me.. I mean I'm not a racist but……."

    He tried and failed to walk the line of not offending potential voters and needing to actually condemn White Supremacists.

    Just like his "Stand back and Standby" comment about the Proud Boys and when his response when asked about QANON was "I don't really know them, but I hear they really like me, which is nice".

    Don't praise , don't condemn and make sure to leave enough ambiguity so they'll still vote for me.

    Horrible horrible man.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,678 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    I think Irish people just have more of a sense of humour when it comes to Trump. Something missed by the very Trump serious posters here for the past 10 years.

    But no time for humour when democracy is at stake, apparently.



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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 17,383 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Oddly enough , most normal people don't find Rapists particularly funny.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,678 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    I suspect many of the serious posters here find nothing funny.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,310 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    I don't. However I've been following polls on aggregate and there's obviously a marked diff between e.g. Biden and Harris. It's simply a gauge that's all, just too lazy to type out all the generic disclaimers.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,181 ✭✭✭eire4


    The initial polls post debate have Harris leading at between 3 and 5%. If she can maintain at least something in that range that will be enough for her to win by a big enough margin to make the anti democratic electoral college irrelevant.



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,803 ✭✭✭hometruths


    I'm fascinated why so many are so reluctant to believe this is now Harris' to lose.

    She has overturned Biden's deficit in the polls, is now opening up her own lead, she's breaking fundraising records left right and centre, won the debate handily, has just been endorsed by probably the most influential person in America, is not a convicted felon, rapist or election denier, nor is her mental acuity in question.

    Meanwhile Trump is falling apart at the seams.

    Where is the doubt coming from?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 23,852 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Actually there are at least 5 candidates

    Jill Stein, Chase Oliver and Cornell West are also on the ballot and haven't dropped out

    I guess that means there's only a 40% that either Harris or Trump will be elected

    Ban billionaires



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,181 ✭✭✭eire4


    Maybe because the US is not a true democracy. At least that is where the doubt is for me. I have no doubt that Harris will win the election. But it is still close in terms of can she win by enough to make the anti democratic electoral college irrelevant. Any Harris win from a tiny margin to about 2.5% is probably not enough. She needs IMHO to win by 3% at least to be sure of being president of the US. Currently her margin in the polls is a lead of between 3 and 5% so right now she is doing enough to win. But she is still dangerously close to a margin of victory which could be overturned by the anti democratic electoral college.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 23,852 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Has anyone ever heard Trump tell a joke?

    I can't find a single example

    Ban billionaires



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,261 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    lot of talk on the right side that DJT may-stress may-be convinced to step down and let Ivana run.

    DJT is ranting but still he may tally it all up and hand it to Ivana head to head with another female.



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  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,803 ✭✭✭hometruths


    I think she'll do better than Biden did in terms of electoral college number.



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