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Sleep Apnoea and CPAP

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    I had my machine walking out of the hospital, they used it on me for the second night there. Rep came and met the pair of us in the room.

    Make a burst at the weight when you have it a few weeks, it definitely helps with your new found energy, you might also see the apnea is a lot better even without it. I'm aiming for a healthy BMI then the consultant in the Galway clinic is going to retest me.

    I've tried a few nights without it, I'm much improved but not there yet, 20kg to go😭



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 800 ✭✭✭SQ2


    Thanks, even though the doc doesn't think it will make a difference and with me for life, this is definitely the intention. The slow start in the mornings and tiredness in the evenings just makes it so difficult to get motivated, never mind to do actually anything physical. I'll put a call in to see where it's at, I don't want to be wasting more time than is necessary in this foggy state



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    I was surprised when the consultant said he was going to sleep test me again once the weight was gone. My question was how do I get rid of this machine after my 1st night. (I think he thinks it's fat in the neck, my doctor said the same initially).

    The tiredness is a killer, I was similar to you, not sure how long I've had it, probably a few years looking back, my mum says now that my dad definitely had it but she's only realised it now after seeing me go the same way around the same age as he did. Feel sorry for him as we always used to be pushing him to get fitter but he was wrecked tired after work and even during it. He probably could have got a few more years if any of us realised the cause of why he was so tired.

    You'll be a new man in a few weeks. Without knowing the cause of the apnea the doctor can't say if getting to a healthy BMI won't help, I've just been lifting weights, watching what I eat (but I'm eating more that I ever was) and it's coming off steadily, still a sucker for creamy pints though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 789 ✭✭✭vidapura


    When I decided to buy my Airsense 10 I did a lot of looking for reviews cos there is an Airsense 11 now.. I found an australian guy on youtube that did really in-depth reviews.. and he reviewed the 11 and he reviewed the Travel.
    He took em apart and from looking at the innards reckoned that they were not as well spec'ed as the good ole reliable Airsense 10. The pump was smaller and didn't look like it would last as long. In fact the 11 had the same pump as the travel and he said they weren't as good.
    Other reviews I saw of the Travel were that it was really noisy and not half as good as the Airsense 10.

    I took my airsense 10 to france last year no bother.. on the ferrry in the car. Haven't taken it on a plane.. think there are posts on this forum here from people who have.

    So, if you are thinkin of buying.. my googling led me to stick to what I knew.. the Airsense 10 autoset.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 789 ✭✭✭vidapura


    You're makin an interesting point there alright… the CPAP machine feedback only tells you hours used and events per hour… doesn't measure SpO2…
    I have been thinkin I should get a smartwatch for the blood oxygen measurement..
    Problem is there is a lot of info around that casts aspersions on the reliability of the SpO2 readings from a lot of smartwatches..

    That said.. this paper would support the use of them…

    https://www.mdpi.com/1424-8220/23/22/9164#:~:text=Although%20the%20sensitivity%20was%20highest,lowest%20specificity%20value%20(0.76).



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Yea I don't see any value in the resmed app at all, don't know what the consultant can figure out with it either. I really want to figure out what's causing it. I know from not using the oxygen the odd night it can sometimes be perfect without it, still a disaster at other times though.

    This is the type of watch I have http://www.adverts.ie/34697348 for €100 this one is a bit of a bargain (as long as the battery is ok) if you don't fancy dropping 600 odd on a new one, the new one is fda approved for monitoring sleep apnea, this will do the same job though. The free app it comes with it is excellent, you've all the stats you need. Body composition, heart rate etc.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Has anyone any thoughts on this or tried something to keep warm at night. The apnea was a lot better on holidays even without the machine. I've been away twice this year, once before I got the cpap where my oxygen levels were unusually better than at home.

    I've noticed that before the apnea kicks in my body temperature drops around 4°. Just looked it up there to see was there any relation between your temperature and apnea. Then I found this paper this morning. It seems to be a natural defence process by the body.

    Sleep apnea, respiratory cooling and thermoregulation

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/19699039/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 312 ✭✭Hontou


    @drunkmonkey I think we must have the same consultant. It was recommended that I lose weight today on a return visit to see how the CPAP machine was working for me. I was told that even though I can only keep it on an hour or two at night that the benefits are still showing. I believe I may be retested after I hopefully lose weight.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Galway clinic? Thats's good he's seeing some improvement are you feeling any better?, the weight loss can't hurt I do hope he's right though, weight lifting and the food that goes with it is working well for me (food wise think steaks, spuds, kerrygold, bacon, eggs etc), don't think i've ever been eating as much and losing weight, I run a small calorie deficit and try to hit 10,000 steps a day, the weights are just 3 times a week for an hour each time. I hate running and i'll only cycle in good weather, hence I chose the weights, the strength boost feels good and i'm starting to see the muscles showing, still a good bit to go though. Half to 1kg a week is entirely doable without a huge amount of effort, if you want a few beers or takeaway you just skip a meal, simple enough.

    Gonna try wearing loose socks to bed tonight to see does that keep my body tempature up a bit, not really scientific but i'll know in the morning what effect it had. I think there's a bit more going on than just weight from what i've tried to figure out, tempature and overnight rostral fluid shift seem to play a part in people with apnea, excerise seems to help the latter a lot.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,357 ✭✭✭Schorpio


    Just to add to this, I've had my machine from Resmed PEI for about 6 months. Have no other DPS payments, so got a quote to buy my machine outright. Quote was €1725 (with a sentence in large text at the bottom of the letter saying that the price cannot be negotiated).

    So it doesn't seem to matter how long you've had your machine, that just seems to be their price for 'used' machines.

    Off to cpapstore I go.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,638 ✭✭✭wonga77


    Very shortsighted from resmed to not at least offer a someway competitive price for the machines, especially used ones



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    The money's made in the subscription, hurts their business model to have them out in the wild. They've over 7.8 milion monthly subscribers and growing, I wouldn't be expecting a cure anytime soon.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 789 ✭✭✭vidapura


    Yah PEI are making a killing.. and with our tax money, I'd say, cos anyone I know that has a machine from them is getting it free through the medical card.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,357 ✭✭✭Schorpio


    It definitely is. The letter with the quote also included a large table which outlined what you don't get if you buy the machine outright. Some of it is dubious (no 'data downloads' despite the fact that the machine saves all its data to an SD card which you already have; no 'patient space' app which is technically true but you can access the Resmed app, etc.)

    They seem to be adopting an Americanised system of overcharging on the basis that most peoples' insurance and/or DPS will cover it.

    Still, I would have thought that some money was better than none, combined with the hassle of taking back the machine and cleaning it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Yea they've over 42 million cloud connected machines and 7.8 million are weekly/monthly subscribers, a bit of room for growth left in the subscription model. Probably hoping the people buying from the cpap store will join up with the low prices.

    My insurance isn't covering any of it besides the consultant and I don't have a medical card that makes it free.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 312 ✭✭Hontou


    Hmmmm. All this makes me think we are being had by the subscription companies. Is it all a con? How long are these machines around and is there absolute proof they work? I feel no better after 3 months. In fact my throat hurts since I got it and going to bed has become hassle. I travel for work to add to the hassle. Any other sceptics out there? I also have no medical card so the cost hurts.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 30,631 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    I'm not a sceptic about the machines because I have an oxymeter and seen how low my blood oxygen goes when I am not using the machine. It spends most of the night near or under 90, and at intervals goes as low as 70. This is very bad for the heart (and I have the evidence of that from the years when I was diagnosed but didn't use the machine (due to lack of support and information mostly), I have had several cardiac procedures and am on strong anti arrhythmia drugs and blood 'thinners'.)

    I absolutely agree about sleeping being a hassle, to the point of being depressing, but the alternative is much more than hassle.

    You may well need more support and help with the machine, but it can take a while to settle into it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    I don't think it's a con as I can see the benefits, daytime sleepiness is gone that was the killer for me, I'll put up with the discomfort for that alone, I'm a different person when using it.

    @Hontou I'd agree with looksee you definitely need to reach out and get help to make it work for you, you're paying for a team of nurses with your subscription, make use of them.

    I'd be a bit sceptical that cpap is going to be the only solution ever but there's little research on anything else. There's drugs out there they're researching but you're into side effect of them then. There's also surgery options and implants. One of the implants looks good but it's not in Europe yet only the USA. I'd take it over cpap if it works though

    https://www.inspiresleep.com/en-us/

    UCD were involved in trial of KairosPAP™ while you'll still need the machine it looks like it might make it more comfortable by reducing the constant pressure and only giving the air pressure when needed. It's not approved yet either though.

    https://sleeplay.com/blogs/news/what-is-kairospap-a-new-sleep-apnea-treatment?srsltid=AfmBOorAzlRIZt2drIykJFs7B4mJ3X-hDA527tRvi9OV6DXXcvsbp3Cu



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,357 ✭✭✭Schorpio


    Regarding cancelling the subscription - does anyone know what the notice period is for PEI? It is a month, or can you hand back the machine immediately? Can't find it in any of my documentation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    What have people with the resmed 10 the humidity and tube temperatures set at, I had it 28° tube and 6°, changed it to 27° and 5° last night, would like to get the air cooler without the water building up in the tube.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 30,631 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    My tube isn't temperature controlled. I have the tube hooked up high on the bedhead before it gets to me, the only time I get water in the tube (creating those unholy noises in the middle of the night!) is when the weather is very cold. Only happens the odd time.

    Mine is on 29 temp and 6, I don't know what the 6 represents, there is a water drop beside it, how is that different to the temperature?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    The 6 is humidity, just had a look there and I think I need to go the other way and take it to 7 should make the air more moist. Hopefully don't get the noises.

    I made a make shift hook with a clothes hanger the other night, what do you use?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 30,631 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    I have a bed head with bars on it and a crossbar at the top, so it comes over from the back to the front and is loosely tied with an ignorant piece of string. I am full of good intentions to do something more elegant but the string is about 3 years old at this stage!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 429 ✭✭the14thwarrior


    I've enjoyed reading the posts. after a number of operations including a full thryoidectomy, I was diagnosed with SA. I got a machine and took panic attacks using it, full of anxiety. After a number of months and a consultant visit in Beaumont, he told me he would discharge me as I was not compliant. I asked for another shot. I was afraid I would be suffocated. Work was a nightmare, stress off the charts. I've always, always had issues with sleeping and was always, always tired.

    So he said to try it that night what was the worst that could happen as my readings were so bad and my stress levels so high that it could do no harm. I did what he said and kept it on that night. My next visit after three months showed instead of 25 wake episodes with heart rate etc. and no breathing, i was down to about 9. I'm not technically but he said it was excellent.

    In true form and like other posters, I did get used to it, and I use it to make sure my heart is ok. Before I used it I used to wake up all the time with a massive pain in the heart but not anymore.

    I rent my machine from air liquide, and the expensive is tough but doable; I claim my expenses from HSE anything after 80 euro I get back. I got a letter and even went to USA with it in the bag and it worked fine.

    I'm not going to lie and say i wake up refreshed and ready to go. Never been nor likely ever will be but I am sleeping 8-9 hours a night, sometimes without even waking up to go to the bathroom. I have more energy, I'm told I look healthier. I've had over five operations in as many years, and I can honestly say I missed my machine when I could not use it (for a brief time because of the operations).

    I guess I just wanted to say that the doctor in Beaumont probably added years to my life, and in end saved my eye pressure from causing me blindness it was that high! I use a full face mask, it works best for me. I lowered the temperature down to 3 and it stopped the condensation.

    thanks for reading…. or scrolling through……..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 312 ✭✭Hontou


    That is interesting (and now obvious) about lowering temperature to prevent condensation @the14thwarrior so thanks for that.

    I tried the 'pillows' mask last night for the first time. Although mostly awake, I managed over four hours wearing it which is way better than the one hour or so I managed with the nasal and full face masks over the last 3 months. Thanks to the advice here, I asked to try another mask. (I'm the type that would say 'all is fine' when it's not) In fairness the ResMed company called me to say they noticed I wasn't lasting more than an hour or so a night.

    The pillows mask seems to have alot of air leakage at the elbow. I sealed it with my hand and then that air leaked out the nasal cap. A bit of Googling said that this air leak is norrmal. I live alone during the week so am afraid of suffocating. Can I ask if other 'pillows' mask wearers notice alot of leakage at the elbow joint on top of their heads on the upper mask strap?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    I think that's meant to happen at the elbow, I'm assuming it's some kind of pressure relief maybe for when you're breathing out, if you look there's tiny little vents on it.

    It shouldn't be leaking at the nose though, the packet it came with has 3 size pillows in it, I'm using the middle size one, you might be just using the wrong size one, there shouldn't be any air blowing on your face. The filters are the same size on all 3, don't forget to take it out before washing.

    When I started using it 1st, it was sore on the nose so a tiny bit of vaseline will help there until your nose toughens up a bit.

    I called them yesterday as noticed my oxygen levels were down a bit and I was feeling sleepy during the day again so they turned off the comfort settings to give me more constant pressure and it made a difference last night, it was nailed up around 95% and didn't dip into apnea territory. Was hovering around 91% the night before and slipping below 90%. Feel a lot fresher this morning.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,073 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 429 ✭✭the14thwarrior


    the rep came to service the machine and I told him about the condensation (and loud noise) especially during cold weather. and he said the temp. was to high (1-5) and set it to 3. Such a simple fix.

    the other thing is I do have to shake the tube etc. on some nights; sometimes I put it under the duvet to keep it warm.!

    I don't know anything about my readings, as the consultant only saw me twice and said no follow up appointment, so have no clue on my readings. I think I must follow up on this.

    All I know is I sleep deeply, hardly any sleep paralysis, can sleep on my back to relieve my back pain (I know not ideal but sometimes the pain is too much) and it is doing me good.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    The consultant doesn't know anything about your readings either. Without a constant blood oxygen monitor how could they know, your oxygen levels at night. It's not possible as none of these cpap machines actually monitor oxygen levels.

    If android get a Samsung watch 5 pro or the new ultra. Apple should have it this month. These gadgets are essential in my opinion if you really want to get a handle on it.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,335 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    There's a lot of variables, interesting to note..

    "While more studies would examine the long-term benefits, any side-effects and whether there are specific types of patients that would benefit more from treatment, it was “vitally important we don’t forget that sleep apnoea is, in the majority of cases, linked to obesity and addressing this should be the priority”, she said"

    I'm not convinced it's just BMI related but I'll persevere in getting to a healthy one regardless then I'll worry about plan B if it's not that.



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