Transgender man wins women's 100 yd and 400 yd freestyle races.

Whole issue is pretty lame.

I would consider it more appropriate to deal with handful of representatives of a fraction of a % hurt feelings, than allowing their feelings of some inclusivity to alienate or deprive of possible success in sport every woman who might want to try it in a sport.

Make a cathegory for them so they can compete against each other as much as they want. Problem solved.

XX with elevated hormones: several female athletes with; for example, PCOS, have already found themselves banned from their sports for a certain time until their testosterone levels are brought to within female norms.

These increased levels - minor in comparison to normal male levels - are caused by an identified illness, but studies show this is enough to increase their physical performances. https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article/100/3/828/2839059

Importantly though, the difference is nowhere near enough to be similar to the permanent effects on a body that has gone through male puberty.

So my conclusion would be that there is a range of "normal" for a reason and that, however unfortunate it may be for women with an illness that causes their testosterone to rise above that level, even slightly, just as we wouldn't accept that athletes with an illness that put them at a disadvantage should be forced to compete against able-bodied people, neither should we accept that an unfair advantage caused by an illness is a reason to force other women to compete against these women. Otherwise why not accept the administration of testosterone as a food supplement?

Anyway, that's the current situation, and there's little controversy about it. That said, I wouldn't have any real objection if enough elite female athletes wanted to change that rule - but I don't think there's any suggestion of it.

As for lower level sports or Parkrun, that follows on from the decisions made at elite levels. If it is considered acceptable for males to compete with females because of their beliefs about themselves at elite levels, then it will happen at lower levels. The reality however is that faced with a male body, in practice there is rarely any need to test to know what one is looking at, so I don't believe hormone tests would be needed at those levels once it's clear to all that that would be cheating.

Thanks. I was thinking about a couple of cases from a good few years ago now. Before all the gender madness, or at least before I was aware of it. One, possibly two, well-known female athlete(s) were subject to a ban for being above the limits - I remember one being banned for a year. Obviously the internet algorithms working as they do, all that now comes up is in relation to transgender or the recent olympics controversy, so I can't find her name, but it will come back to me at some point.

So yes, some equivalent of a TUE exemption is fine, IMO, as long as the effects on sporting performance are minor.

To be fair that athlete has vision impairment will compete against others with similar disabilities.

I'm not sure of the average age for competitors in that event but 50 seems old in athletics terms.

I literally told you how. Reading comprehension is not great there.

Medical records or a diagnosis. It's that simple. what are you nor grasping there?
The fact that I can detail specifically how a diagnosis is preformed does not mean it doesn't exist. Bizarre that you think it does.

You were also given details of an objective assessment on the Tanner scale. Whoosh tere too I guess.

Do you have a link to the PCOS exclusion examples?
There are limits for test levels, for obvious reasons. But my understand that it was around 4 times the typical level. And much higher still than the normal "limit".

They might be excluded at a point. But its not the point of advantage. If the normal range is 0.5 to 2.0, the upper end being an advantage. The limit to my understanding is 5.0nmol/L.

Otherwise why not accept the administration of testosterone as a food supplement?

Is that a real question? There is a obviously difference somebody have a natural hormonal advantage and taking exogenous steroids. It's kids of the fundamental idea behind anti-doping.

As for lower level sports or Parkrun, that follows on from the decisions made at elite levels. If it is considered acceptable for males to compete with females because of their beliefs about themselves at elite levels, then it will happen at lower levels.

But its not acceptable at elite levels, certainly that's your view so strange to hide behind a contrary one. A post suggested it should be stamped out at Parkrun level. Do we include school sports? Have people how hold these views sex screen their kids? I doubt it, so i'm wondering were we set the line. There is a balance to be had.

The reality however is that faced with a male body, in practice there is rarely any need to test to know what one is looking at, so I don't believe hormone tests would be needed at those levels once it's clear to all that that would be cheating.

Hormone check are need in elite sports, for every obvious reasons. Nothing to do with sex.
I disagreed previous with the idea it is obvious. Nobody said anything about Khelif during the Tokyo Olympics. And there are other females with similar questionable looks, that are apparently not a concern.

From the values of the Olympics: “Olympism seeks to create a way of life based on the joy found in effort, the educational value of good example and respect for universal fundamental ethical principles.

The goal of the Olympic Movement is to contribute to building a peaceful and better world by educating youth through sport practiced without discrimination of any kind and in the Olympic spirit, which requires mutual understanding with a spirit of friendship, solidarity and fair play.”

Is it ethical for him to fight women?? Is it fair play??

Yes indeed, the IOC and Bach should have foreseen there may have been problems with these two boxers given the emergence of the controversy last year (even allowing for the fact that the IBA are seen by them as discredited and untrustworthy).

Khelif has been boxing for years and was hardly 'not' going to show up at the Olympics after qualifying, especially as she seems to genuinely still view herself as a woman and eligible to be there. If any good comes out of this, it will be that the IOC will have to address this issue head on before 2024 and come up with some solution that allows such athletes to be properly categorised - via testing or whatever - which will allow them compete in the appropriate category (or not compete at all, if it comes to that).