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The 2024 All Ireland Senior Football Championship (Sam Maguire Cup)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,032 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    I found it enthralling but definitely with a few tweaks the game could be much better.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    Never liked the ball being manhandled into the net

    No issue with a fisted goal



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,683 ✭✭✭MacDanger


    That's pretty much what I said.

    I think the term "passive play" is a good description for what's making football a poor spectacle at times though



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,654 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    Half of that list contradicts itself.

    More high fielding and more turnovers will not lend itself to more kick passing and more shooting from distance, it will create less.

    The reason the game has evolved the way it has is because if you field a high ball there is almost certainly a man waiting for you when you land, not a hope you'd get a kick away 8 times out of 10. To make high fielding worth doing you need the option of the quick hand pass to a runner coming on.

    And also, who says people want more scoring from distance? Most people for both football and hurling do not want the game to turn into a sport full of shots from halfway/45m last time I checked.

    Unless you think lateral movement outside the D and ending in a long range shot is exciting.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,032 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    I'm fine with the fisted point. It's the only option for some situations.

    The goal yesterday was fine also. Soupy also definitely intended to pass it. That's obvious to me.

    I think people are nitpicking over small details when really the big problem is that you've 28/29 players in one half of the pitch. That's the major problem.

    If they can remove 6 players, then it's a new game.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,220 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Says a poster who a post later is trying to design a game to suit your personal preference.

    I think the speed and skill of the goal scored yesterday fits brilliantly into a game. It had everything, speed guile and skill. Ditto the point scored by the hand.
    You'll never design a game that fits all expectations, why try so hard and ignore other aspects.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    That's probably the place to start alright

    Easy implemented



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    You're still not making sense

    You make changes to what's not working

    It's great that some aspects work but that's not the point here

    The end result will never be perfection merely improvement and that's the goal here



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,220 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    You make changes to what's not working

    And pandering to fickle support is clearly not working either. Sure change the rules if needed but ALSO consider other change.

    Not a difficult concept to grasp.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,032 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    How would you implement it?

    The full forward and full back line have to stay inside their own half/60/45?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    Probably

    More knowledgeable posters than me here anyhow might know better



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    What's this all about ?

    "Pandering to fickle support"

    and how is it relevant here in the context of rule changes and improving the game ?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,346 ✭✭✭TheRiverman


    I think Damien Comer and Shane Walsh have got a lot of unecessary criticism about bottling it. Yes,Walsh was awful at frees, but in general play they were completely out of it due to the horrendous slow build up, sideways and backwards handpassing and kicking by all the other Galway players out the field. Comer is arguably the most physically strong full forward in the game, but never got quick high or low ball into him while he was on the field. Galway were playing not to lose, Armagh played to win and deserved and should have been more that one point ahead at the final whistle.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,351 ✭✭✭gaffer91


    Not at all, it's totally coherent. FTR, I said speedier turnovers i.e., we don't have 3-4 minutes of handpassing before the ball is lost. Granted, that does probably mean that there will be more overall. Don't agree that high fielding will result in less kickpassing and shooting from distance- I don't see any link there. Handpassing to runners should still be allowed of course- we just want to less handpassing overall.

    It's obvious the current set of rules lend itself to this style of football- so it's the rules that will have to be changed not individual teams. When the likes of Dublin, set up in their negative way with 15 men behind the ball, there is nothing illegal about that. We just need structure the game in such a way that this strategy is less advantageous.

    I'm saying people want more scoring from distance, I'm giving my opinion. People don't like watching weightlifters handpass it to each other endlessly and then try and tap/handpass it over from 10-25 metres- that's why we're seeing all of this complaining. Again, close in scores should still be allowed, it's just it'd be better if there was less of it than there is currently.

    Post edited by gaffer91 on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,850 ✭✭✭intellectual dosser


    McGeeney said yesterday it’s the people who know little that make a lot of noise.


    Who is it that’s demanding these changes? The players? They’re the amateurs putting the time in, I’d love to hear their collective opinion.


    The jubilee team yesterday was Meath containing legends like Tommy Dowd, Trevor Giles and Ollie Murphy. What a final that was too, Murphy scored a good goal in the first half and then Joe Kavanagh scored one of the greatest we’ve seen in the second. But in reality was it a great final? It finished 1-11 to 1-08, outscored by Armagh v Galway yesterday.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..


    He did and he said it on the rte podcast too

    In reality his is just ANother opinion , same as the players is another view, and if he means that sincerely(hard to tell ) I believe he's mistaken

    Not sure whos "demanding" , changes if anyone

    The state of the game and possible rule changes are being discussed here anyhow



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54,560 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    I said the same yesterday after I came home from the match. Two very limited teams. Neither carried out their game plans whatever they were and 1-9 was a very low score to win a Final with.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54,560 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    You could say the same about the Armagh misses to seal the win. Some very poor wides and hitting the post when it was easier to score. Overall a poor match as as I said last night I don't expect to see either team in the semi-finals next year.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54,560 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,944 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    The way the game has gone and with so little ball being kicked into the full forward line and so little space in there you find that wing backs and corners backs are nearly as likely to pop up with the same number of scores as a corner forward.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74,220 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I happen to think most of the calls for rule change/or that the game is in an awful state is coming from fickle support, i.e. They'll never be happy. There are other things to consider.
    You don't agree, fine.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,612 ✭✭✭MfMan


    To be replaced by who? Both teams were there on merit, Galway especially, considering the route they took. Neither played their best football yesterday but both are comfortably in the top 6-7 teams currently.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 54,560 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    I've seen Galway and Armagh several times and have not been overly impressed. I'd be surprised if either win their Provincial titles next year.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,203 ✭✭✭drury..




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,612 ✭✭✭MfMan


    There was no genuinely consistent side all year, save perhaps Donegal who showed greatest improvement. Can't speak for Armagh, but Galway are 3-in-a-row winners in Connacht and should be better again next year with hopefully a fitter and larger squad.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,351 ✭✭✭gaffer91


    God, I definitely think Armagh are deserved Champions just looking at Championship form alone. They were very solid all season. Probably their best trait has been their ability to just take their chances when they presented themselves. If only Galway could say they did that yesterday…



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,359 ✭✭✭rrs


    Galway will be back again and Armagh will be thereabouts. A fit Sean Kelly would make a difference and John Daly. They have had underage success while Armagh haven't. Armagh have 3 or 4 players who are near the end of their career. Galway only have Conroy, who would be a big loss if he goes



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20 howdo1992


    Comer and Walsh getting on in years to. Both will stay on but would have to say they are past their prime now



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,944 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    The issue with the game is not the level of scoring.

    The issue is the lack of contest for possession.This has largely disappeared from the game because we have teams who just retreat and put 15 men in defence and we have very little kick passing.

    We need to increase the contest for possession and the number of them in the game this is what most people like in my opinion.

    When I played football if you played corner forward the number 1 thing you had to do was be out in front of your man and be ready at all times either for a long pass into the corner or a break off the full forward however the ball is very rarely kicked into the full forward line long anymore because of blanket defences.

    You don't get as much contest for possession in midfield either because 75% of kickouts go short to a cornerback.

    I'd make the following rule changes.

    1. Blanket defence tactic is banned, at all times each team must have at least 5 players inside the 65 metre line of the goal they are attacking

    2. All kickouts must cross the 45 metre line .Player can claim a mark for a clean catch from a kick out .

    3. 3 consecutive handpasses and then the ball must be kicked forward.(getting rid of the blanket defence will mean it will actually be worthwhile kicking the ball forward).

    Do this and you'd bring back more catch and kick into the game which is what fans want (and I'd imagine the players would prefer it as well), if I want to see players hand passing the ball around in the circle in order to get a perfect position for a shot (like we see constantly) I'll watch Olympic handball.

    Basketball had to introduce the shot clock because teams used to pass the ball around in a circle endless as a way of keeping possession (and stifling the oppositions) and hold back shooting until they were in a perfect posession, that is what Galway were doing for a lot of the game yesterday and it's awful to watch.

    People seem to think that the game would work it's way through this defensive phase it's stuck in and it's around 15 years of it now and it hasn't it's got worse over time, people need to face it that the rules don't encourage teams to play more exciting football and we need to legislate the type of football we see far too often out of the game.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 963 ✭✭✭ledwithhedwith




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