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Sinn Fein and how do they form a government dilemma

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,088 ✭✭✭Clo-Clo


    Car crash interview, one after another, expect a few media places to get hit with defamation or some other excuse for the poor performance.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,476 ✭✭✭pureza


    On the subject of defamation,a bill has been aporoved by cabinet to end Slapp's and is expected to be passed in the next session,I heard on the wireless this morning



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Yeah but,is there a community in the country that would say yes,there isn't

    I think you may have hit on the reason why vulnerable communities are largely being chosen.

    Hopefully this nonsense can now shift to seeing how these 'audits' are conducted and maybe proper focus on 'invite only' 'consultations'. An FOI or two by decent journalists maybe?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,887 ✭✭✭blackwhite


    Where is "far right" mentioned anywhere in the post you quoted?

    It's quite an amazing level of dishonesty to repeatedly try to put words in other people's mouths.

    Letting the mask slip quite badly there



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,476 ✭✭✭pureza


    I have refugee's in my town ,lots of them,its not vulnerable



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I was talking about them not chasing the far right vote. The poster contradicted that.
    Speaking up for their electorate is not 'chasing a far right vote', it's representing people.



  • Posts: 14,768 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I think you might be indulging in a bit of stereotyping yourself there, unless I missed it, there is no mention of far right in the post you quoted.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Your personal anecdotal experiences nor mine is going to get the information required.

    Lets see if these 'audits' get produced and we see how locations are actually chosen.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    And in the post quoted by the poster, I don't mention normal representation of the electorate in an area.
    I was specifically referring to 'chasing' a specific type of voter.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,079 ✭✭✭PeadarCo


    What relevance does this have to anything here? So what you once voted for another party other than SF. The fact is for years you have been defending SF and promoting their policies. Personally I don't have a problem it's a politics forum and anyone interested to post here is going to care some what about politics. With that goes support for certain political policies/parties.

    The hard fact is for SF is they are the main opposition party. We will have an election sometime in the next year. If we are going to have an alternative government that does not include FF or FG bar some political earthquake SF will be in that alternative government.

    With that comes certain responsibilities and also scrutiny. If SF can't tolerate expected questions on a new policy on a hot topic how will they cope in government?

    From reading the thread I don't see any differences between SF and the current government policy on immigration. A bit about not using the private sector less. But even on point SF can't answer questions on costs.



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  • Posts: 14,768 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    It’s a little incoherent Francie. On the one hand mentioning stereotyping by another poster, then deflecting from doing precisely that yourself.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    What relevance does this have to anything here?

    I was asked a question, I answered it.

    I already said that I agree with MLMD assessment, the policy is similar the difference is that what the government say they are doing and will do is different to what they are actually doing.
    Is, for instance, 'invite only' consultation good policy?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I guess you have to ask, what is wrong with representing your electorate? That is not 'chasing a vote' that is doing the job you were elected to do.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,887 ✭✭✭blackwhite


    You accused another poster of stereotyping everyone who lives in a deprived are as being "far right" when they never said anything of the sort.

    Disgusting false accusation to throw at someone



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Well, I await the poster's clarification. If I was wrong, no problem withdrawing.



  • Posts: 14,768 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The poster didn’t say it in the first place, that in itself shows that you are irrefutably wrong saying he/she did.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    The poster was specifically answering a post I made about 'chasing votes' referencing the far right vote.

    He said 'but they are chasing votes'.

    Again, representing those who elected you is not 'chasing a vote' it is in fact fulfilling your mandate.

    The poster needs to clarify.



  • Posts: 14,768 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    You accused the poster of stereotyping by branding people in under resourced areas as far right, the poster did no such thing.

    There is obstinate, and there is obstinate to the point of ridicule, you are reaching the threshold of the latter.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,195 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/sinn-fein-puts-cost-of-its-migration-plans-at-50m-after-disastrous-interview/a1888619657.html

    When you are in a hole, the first thing to do is to stop digging. SF and their supporters need to realise that.

    We now have some costings. Let us have a look at them.

    "Tripling IPO staff “over the term of government” would cost €32m and tripling IPAT resources would cost €18m, Sinn Féin said."

    So €32m over the term of government, which is the phrase that Sinn Fein have used. The term of government is usually five years, so that means the extra 800 staff will cost €6.4m a year. I had to check this a couple of times on my calculator as I was shocked by the result, but that means that Sinn Fein will pay these 800 staff the brilliant salary of €8,000 each. Wow.

    Now maybe Donnacha O'Laoghaire who supplied the figures to the SF Press Office, or the researcher who did the work, or the SF Press Office or someone else in SF is really really incompetent, and they actually meant to say "€32m a year over the term of government". Now this works out at a salary of €40,000 each, which appears more reasonable. However, as this would include employers PRSI, we have to deflate this amount by around 9%, meaning that the salary available is only €36,700. According to the June 2024 Civil Service Pay Circular, a Clerical Officer after 5 years will be earning €34,830. Add in some travel and subsistence to travel to the various immigration centres, a laptop, phone and other sundries, and you might, just might, be able to hire 800 Clerical Officers at €32m a year (rather than the €32m over the term of government).

    Now, this only further demonstrates the level of ignorance and incompetence within Sinn Fein. Clerical Officers don't make any decisions on immigration applicants. Executive Officers make those decisions, they also do the inspections of immigration centres and housing. Their salary after 5 years would be around €45,000 before you add on the office costs, the employers PRSI, the travel and subsistence etc., as well as the costs of those who manage them.

    Going back to the first thing I said in this post, SF should stop digging while in a hole. It didn't take me long to figure out their numbers are laughable, it won't take others long either.

    As for their supporters, they love going down rabbit holes all the time, so I doubt that they will stop digging.

    P.S. Now that the interview is being widely reported as disastorous, will that be quietly accepted?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    The poster has made previous stereotyping comments that I am not able to ignore,

    The residents destabilise their communities themselves



    That is classic stereotyping, the poster of course should have said 'some residents'

    It is up to the poster to clarify what they meant this time.



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  • Posts: 14,768 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    No, it is up to the accuser to support the accusation. It is clear for all to read that what you accused the poster of, far right stereotyping, is not contained in the text you quoted.

    You are wrong, you know you are wrong, the poster can point to the text you quoted, to affirm that they did not say what you accused them of.

    Francie, you are making a fool of yourself, take a breathe, own what you posted, admit you are wrong, then move on.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,476 ✭✭✭pureza


    You said 2 posts up that SF aren't chasing the far right vote

    How is what they are doing not abandoning voters,traditionally core SF who have followed pyed piper style, the flag usurpers down the garden path after being offered a false promise rage machine ?

    Thats Kamikaze behaviour for a party,if you ask me



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 985 ✭✭✭Butson


    Just listened back to that interview - jesus, car crash is right.

    I'd be no fan of Boucher-Hayes but they were all very reasonable questions and I didn't detect any "tone".

    Mary Lou and Sinn Fein coming across like cry babies.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    If the poster clarifies and I am wrong, I have no issue withdrawing what I said.
    The poster has form as shown by a direct quote from them with stereotyping a community.

    That is all I am saying to you on this. Let the poster clarify.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    You cannot choose who votes for you.
    You can choose to support a stance or not support it.
    It is clear, despite the salivating here that they are not chasing those on the far right who may have voted for them before.

    That is something I would support in any party.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,195 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    They don't have to chase that vote, the dog-whistling they are currently engaged in, will be sufficient.



  • Posts: 14,768 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Clarification is contained in the post you quoted, it contains no mention to far right stereotyping. That clear, unambiguous fact, is all you need to be proved wrong.

    The stand you are taking on this is easily discounted, you are being ridiculous.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,476 ✭✭✭pureza


    No interest in disuading them from the new error of their ways then?

    I'd have thought it an easier path than trying to attract wealthier voters

    Oh and of course you can choose who votes for you and doesn't it seem a lot of traditionsl SF voters hoodwinked by the flag usurpers are being abandoned?

    Let them off is the new strategy?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Doesn't stand scrutiny to be honest.
    The Far Right have come out against this policy even harder than those who were salivating about them turning to the far right since their poll numbers dropped.
    Their policy is as PHB and others have said, the same as the governments. The difference as MLMD claimed (remains to be seen if she is correct) would be that SF intend to actually do as they say.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,772 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    No interest in disuading them from the new error of their ways then?

    Back in January MLMD called the far right out and said they 'are not republicans', has criticised and condemned their activity in Coolock and elsewhere and has received an overt death threat as a result.

    Are you for real here Pureza?



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