Sinn Fein and how do they form a government dilemma

FF/FG actually don't represent the majority of people in the country because in these elections more people voted for other candidates than FF/FG.

The problem for SF is that they're drifting all over the place under McDonald. There doesn't appear to be any coherent strategy other than copy FF/FG. It seems that McDonald is trying to copy Starmer whereby he's basically adotped every tory policy as his own to neutralise the tories (exactly as Blair did in 1997) who are so unpopular that people will just vote Labour.

That won't work in Ireland. FF/FG are everything they accuse SF of being - populist and right wing - and there really isn't room in Ireland for a third party of the same nature.

If SF really are a party of the left (as MLMcD says they are) then where are their lefty policies?

Between them they have about half the councillors in the country and with independents from their gene pool vs a disparate bunch of opposing others elected,I think saying they're the majority is close enough now to be honest

If they got the same share of the vote at a GE as on friday,the current government would democraticslly be returned,which youd have to concede even if you don't like it,as the people have spoken,people are sovereign,democracy etc ?

It's worth pointing out that FF and FG are supposedly two separate independent parties. Perhaps they did merge and I never noticed?

The fact is is that the general trend is that less people are voting FF/FG than ever and they're more reliant on the fact that the opposition are fragmented into separate small groups including independents.

If FF/FG do form the next government, and it looks as if that'll be the case, then by 2030 FG will be in government for 19 consecutive years whilst they were in opposition for the previous 14 years before that. They've only come to find themselves in government due to the financial crash which decimated FF and then desire to keep SF in opposition.

Point being? As I was talking about SF and how they have come across to the public.

T he title of this thread needs to be changed. They wont be forming a government. FF is the only hope they had of forming a stable government.Dont think it will happen now. Hard to believe that SF TD Martin Brown's daughter only polled 174 votes.

First count in from Midlands North West. The constituency covering the border counties. Sinn Fein got just 11%.

Time for Mary-Lou to go.

Not trying to spin anything, just trying to be factual

Yeah so if Eamon Ryan wanted to, then he could walk out on the coalition tomorrow or make a deal that he won't if the other 2 agree to wait for the new year. The only issue is that he'd need to be awake to do that

11 % ? Sweet Jesus that’s another awful result.

They ballsed the MNW selection badly on so many levels.

McManus (based in Sligo) never elected to anything more than county council and only got the MEP gig as he was Cartys replacement when he went back to the Dail, throwing in a carpetbagger in Gildernew from Tyrone in a constituency that stretches east across to the boundaries with Dublin and south to the borders with Clare and Tipperary was either the height of arrogance, or outright lunacy

MLMcD is incorrect when she says SF lost support due to anger with government policy. SF lost support because of anger with MLMcD's support for government policy.

It's like they just realised that their working-class base is not all that progressive and pro-immigration.

SF was always weird that way. A nationalist nativist party that have socialist roots. The Far Right has never taken off here because SF got that vote. But now, their base is fighting back.

Forget the true believers, the 'Up the IRA' types, like Francie. They are only about 10% of the base at most. If SF ever want power, they need to find a way to attract new voters, while keeping the existing base happy.

That is one major reason for sure. The other being that their 'working class' / welfare base doesn't want to share the limited social housing pot and state freebies with immigrants.

I thought the only saving grace of the emergence of the bottom feeders on the right would be to nibble away at the SF vote. I didn't think it would feast on it to that extent.

I don't like Yates but he's dead right on the hubris of SF heading into this election.

A merger of labour and soc.dems in time for the election could hurt them further but unlikely to happen in time.

What did they expect when they are the fakest opposition in history? Basically an extension of FFG at this stage.

'Change' is a pretty weak argument.

People are happy enough with their lot even though they might like to complain

Not enough believe that SF are capable of running a govt department properly

Everyone is tired of Mary Lou McDonald moaning on the telly

The new extremist candidates are better craic than po-faced SF

Older voters remember what old guard SF did to this country.

It's not that complicated