Russia-Ukraine War

Soooo, sweeping generalisations informed by nothing but your own voyeurism, bitterness, prejudices and paranoia. Glad we cleared that up.

The true war mongerers are those who excuse Russia's actions in launching this illegal, unprovoked war of plunder against Ukraine, and who seem to condemn the innocent for defending themselves against atrocity more than those actually committing the atrocity. Who 'both sides' such conduct - which you have done. In condemning everything you condemn nothing, you don't condemn what needs to be condemned.

Those who would reward Russia for their aggression and atrocities. Which is what your position of peace now at all costs would do.

That is far more likely to lead to more such wars and conflicts, than those who seek a secure Ukraine that is safe from Russian invasion.

So if you are concerned about war mongerers, look in the mirror. It is you who give succour to war mongerers when you treat the attacked (Ukraine) on the same level and as culpable for the war and atrocities as the attacker (Russia).

If there is no just war, then the innocent are not entitled to defend themselves against aggression, a philosophy which would inevitably lead to the aggressors doing whatever they want. The likes of Putin would hear that and laugh. A recipe not for peace, but for war.

That is where your morally and intellectually bankrupt position would inevitably lead.

A position which does not distinguish between moral behaviour (between the attacker and the attacked, between the rapist and the victim) is morally bankrupt.

» So you are saying that Ukraine army is comprised of volunteers only and they are fighting for free just because of their desire to free their country right?

Nope.

»your happy warmongering club celebrating explosions and killing when they are done by one side

Bingo.

You join the ranks of those who can't stand the level of support for Ukraine. They can't stand when people celebrate battlefield success by Ukraine. They can't stand that people celebrate when the invaders take losses. It "irks" them when someone posts a clip of a Russian tank being blown up.

They think people are "celebrating" death. No, they are celebrating life, the lives of Ukrainians who don't deserve any of this horror for a second.

I am delighted when Ukrainian defenders take out a Russian tank, not because I want those poor sods from Siberia to die, far from it, but because those Russian soldiers will go on to murder, torture, rape Ukrainians, steal their property, destroy, occupy - and the only thing that's stopping them from doing that are those defenders. None of whom want to be there. But they don't have a choice of peace.

It's Bucha or defend. Those are the only options available.

Your alternative narratives and pearl-clutching act about the "tragedy of war" are fooling no one.

Over two years in to the Russian invasion of neutral democratic Ukraine it's grim to see individuals who are still attempting to "both sides" it. Feel free to go on, let us know how you do "support" Ukraine but how it's just so terrible for both sides and that you just want peace, as if it's some mutual war where both sides are at fault and the Ukrainians have some option of peace they aren't taking..

Avoiding the question asked. Pathetic

Bucha.

Any attempt to 'both sides' the conduct of Russia and Ukraine in this conflict is atrocity denial.

It is just repeating Russian lies and propaganda, the lies and propaganda of war mongerers. Under the guise of "peace", what you serve is war and atrocity.

That is not peace. Peace is not the mere temporary absence of active warfare, but a secure Ukraine safe from further Russian aggression.

You've been utterly unable to respond to the multiple posters who have completely discredited your posts, avoiding every question except by whataboutery and repetition of 'resources'. As if that proves anything. The Nazis wanted resources. The Russians want resources. Saying it is about resources says nothing.

Proof positive your argument hasn't a leg to stand on.

When has Romania claimed this?

It seems you may have personal beef or fixation with Daly and Wallace and if so please discuss this with them.

Please kindly point me to where I called this a "mutual war between NATO and Russia" and where did I stated that "Ukraine should reward it's invader with land"?

I am asking you again, kindly stop making elaborate construction trying to tie me with any animosity you feel towards Daly and Wallace.

You do realise that to have one of those wars which you profess to hate, a war must be started. And for a war to start, a first shot must be fired. I think Putin satisfied that requirement twice - once when sending 'peacekeepers' into a sovereign nation and again when sending columns of tanks, showers of missiles, droves of soldiers and swarms of attack aircraft over the border into - you guessed it - a sovereign nation who didn't invite them.

It's that simple. Provocation or whatever - that's not your argument, you're simply saying you hate wars. By your logic, disputes can be solved through dialogue. So there's no excusing, even using that 'provocation' fig leaf, a ground and air invasion. That's the war you're talking about.

And yet - despite being encouraged by a number of posters, you can't bring yourself to suggest that the obvious end to this terrible war you hate so much, is for the invading force to leave the country they invaded and bring themselves to the negotiation table.

No, what you suggest as the only solution to this terrible war that you hate, is for Ukraine and its people to lay down their arms and crawl to the negotiation table. What do you think the outcome of that will be? Putin will turn around and say, thanks, now I'll go home and you can have your borders back? Of course not, what you know full well but appear to care little about, is that a democracy will be torn apart by an autocracy which will pick and chose what it wants from the carcass and leave Ukraine and the West to pick up the pieces of a war torn nation - broken cities, obliterated towns and villages and broken bodies.

With attitudes like yours, where the aggressor is treated the same as the attacked, its no wonder that Ukraine feels it has no choice but to keep up the military resistance. Putin is counting whole heartedly on attitudes like yours spreading, with the disingenuous suggestion that to resist Putin is to embrace war.

@patnor1011

Some posters here argued that why would Russia want more when they are swimming in resources already. Why would McDonalds want a bigger share of the market?

Your argument doesn't make sense because the pain and suffering that McDonalds would be willing to endure in order to capture a bit more of the market pales in comparison to what Russia (or Putin, rather) appears willing to expend just to capture the eastern fringes of Ukraine. And if Russia is willing to undergo such a vast loss of life and material in order to get a bit more of the stuff they already have in spades, then it is behaving extremely stupidly because that is a very poor cost-benefit analysis.

Then share instead of telling us to do our own research

You are getting way ahead of yourself. Your hypothetical scenario came from your head not mine. I simply mentioned that there is unrest in Catalonia. As far as I know they want to be independent from Spain. I never heard about reunification with France until you invented it.

Where do I support Russians exactly?

Oh I see, the old if you are not with us you must be against reasoning.

Sorry. Not interested in your Ukrainian or some Russian camp either.

Please educate yourself on subject you want to discuss.