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Leinster Team Talk Thread (Love you Furlong time)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,801 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    I don't think Patterson has shown much at Munster to really prove anyone wrong. Those 8 starts were spread over 7 months, that is not a run of games. He gets games when Murray and Casey are away with Ireland (or injured) and that's it. There's no shame in that, he's got quality players in front of him, but at the same time he hasn't gone south and taken the place by storm.

    Why we haven't managed to produce anyone else at 9 is an absolute mystery. I presume we're not coaching the 9s any differently to everyone else.



  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 36,398 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    Consistency is an issue. Confidence not helped by injuries.

    He was out in the new year with an ankle injury. Injured it again v Leicester.

    Confusion reigns with Leinster injury "news".

    Seems a bit odd to me that you would drop your backup 10 from the bench at this stage.

    Maybe Nienaber/Cullen gave Frawley that 20mins at 10 for a 6-2 v Toulouse but without an outhalf on the bench!

    Whatever concerns they might have of Harry, Frawley covering/finishing out the game at 10 v Toulouse is a recipe for disaster.

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,819 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    Honestly, I did not factor in Luke when gauging RB's performance. So maybe this makes a difference. I'll watch for this on the rewatch.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,145 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Well if JOB is back and takes the 15 position then if they go 6-2 on the bench it will also certainly be Frawley.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,076 ✭✭✭arsebiscuits1


    "Those 8 starts were spread over 7 months, that is not a run of games"

    This isn't true.

    He started rounds 11,12,13,14,15,16 of the URC with a bench appearance in Europe between rounds 12 and 13.

    Not to mention playing in rounds 1,2,6,7,8,9 and another appearance in Europe after round 9 where he had 2 starts in these games

    All this includes starting the the friendly against South Africa A (between rounds 7 and 8) too where he was motm.

    He ruptured his ACL in round 16. So he appeared in 12/16 URC games that season that he was fit for. Pretty good run of games to me.

    But that point is moot. Yes he is 3rd choice in Munster when he's fit. Which is fine. But the point I'm making is YES I do think he played better than McGrath last season and I do think he brings a pace and accuracy in his pass that McGrath sorely lacks especially in recent seasons and there'd be a strong case for him being number 2 here



  • Posts: 1,345 ✭✭✭ Lia Sweet Racist


    I really don't think Frawley having to finish a game at 10 would be a "disaster". He played the second half against La Rochelle (in La Rochelle) and did well. He's not a stopgap player there - he's arguably a better 10 than he is a 15.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    I know he can kick no bother. He did fine v LaR in a game where you aren't moving the ball from halfback.

    It would be a "recipe for disaster" i.e. if you are trying to chase the game with Frawley at 10. And unfair to expect Frawley to seamlessly slot in at 10.

    An unnecessary risk in my opinion if Harry is available.

    it will be another intriguing selection v Ulster and of course Toulouse!

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,086 ✭✭✭✭The Iron Giant


    It's absolutely not a recipe for disaster. Frawley is an OH as well as a FB for Leinster. Even Andy Farrell included him in the wider Ireland squad as OH over Harry Byrne.

    Harry may/may not be a better OH than Frawley but its fair to say that when Harry is having a bad outing, he's a much bigger liability than when Frawley has one. Plenty of games where Harry has been so poor that it's gotten to the point where he starts trying to force the game and puts the team under worse pressure.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    Playing 10 is bloody hard! Esp. if you are been asked to cover from FB

    That's my point.

    Plus you have to make two positional changes if your 10 goes off.

    I'd be much more in favour of tuning up your backup 10 and have him 'ready to go' from the bench.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,819 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    How strong do Leinster go this week?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,819 ✭✭✭Dubinusa


    At this stage, Ringrose, Keenan and Ryan look unlikely for the C.C. I would rest them up if the injuries are persistent. Maybe they're done for the season.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,086 ✭✭✭✭The Iron Giant


    But what happens if Keenan, Henshaw or Ringrose go down? I'd much rather Frawley step in than Harry.



  • Posts: 1,345 ✭✭✭ Lia Sweet Racist


    I definitely wouldn't have those concerns. He's arguably the strongest running threat from 10 of all three, and has a good offloading game. If we're really at a point where we're really chasing the game like that and going for broke, then I'd want the guy who I think has the right head and temperament for it, and right now I'd back Frawley over Harry in that regard 100%.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    Forgot about JOB maybe starting. It appears it could shape up that way.

    I was ok with 6-2 for LaR. Not my preference for the Toulouse game.

    I'd go with a McGrath, Harry, Frawley

    over

    Molony, Conan, Conners/vdF, McGrath, Frawley



  • Posts: 1,345 ✭✭✭ Lia Sweet Racist


    Very little has changed on this topic Dub since you essentially posted the exact same thing a week ago.

    Cullen gave a positive sounding update on all three - it might just be spin, but we don't know. I'm hopeful we'll get at least one or two of them back, with Ryan probably the longest shot (given he doesn't appear to be doing any running or training yet).

    Ryan's injury isn't persistent either - it's just one specific bicep tear he had.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,914 ✭✭✭Rigor Mortis


    Regardless of whether they are genuinely in contention or not, expect that Ryan, Ringrose and Keenan will all be said to be under consideration for this weekend, if only to mess with Tolouses head.

    Would expect very few of last weeks starters to start and even fewer who are going to be 1st XV against Toulouse

    Healy

    Sheehan

    Aalatoa

    Moloney

    Jenkins

    Penny

    Connors

    Conan

    McGrath

    Harry

    Lowe

    Ngatai

    Ringrose / Turner

    Russell

    Keenan / O'Brien

    Milne

    McKee

    Clarkson

    Deeny

    Deegan

    Gunne

    Prendergast

    Frawley



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 96 ✭✭Clontarf_Jazz


    Frawley hasn't exactly a great record of being trusted to come off the bench in finals to win anything. JOB is a far superior player & has pace. If you need a score, a line break or a bit of magic it doesn't have a F in it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    Interesting. Not saying your wrong and It looks like Nienaber/Cullen could go that way.

    For the record I like Frawley (I just always preferred him at 12). Concerns over Harry are legit but I would have backed Harry, a 'natural' outhalf, to come off the bench.

    The non-selection for Ospreys changes my mind right now. Harry starts v Ulster? AND has a 70min run And good game? Im putting him on the bench!

    Post edited by Boards.ie: Mike on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,086 ✭✭✭✭The Iron Giant


    Outside of an injury, I can't see Harry getting anywhere near the 23 for Toulouse.

    Assuming JOB comes in to 15 - if it's a 6-2 split on the bench, it'll be McGrath and Frawley on the bench. If its a 6-3 split on the bench, it'll be McGrath, Frawley and one of Osborne (if Ringrose is back), Ngatai or TOB.



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  • Posts: 12,836 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I thought Harry was having a good enough season to start against Leicester, but he didn't get the shot. Once that happened he was unlikely to get any of the big games.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭Hey_Ho_Lets_Go_3


    Ryan is training today.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca




  • Posts: 1,345 ✭✭✭ Lia Sweet Racist


    Paul O'Connell down watching training too interestingly.

    No sight of Ringrose or Keenan in any of the images.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 33,145 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭Hey_Ho_Lets_Go_3


    Untitled Image

    We back up.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 714 ✭✭✭jonok28


    Now all we need is Ringrose back before the final and we are cookin!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭ionadnapóca


    Loosing track of the number times I've read this from Leinster "______ is expected to return to full training this week ahead of the game against _____ this weekend."

    Surely Keenan will play this weekend!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    I think a lot of the above has to be taken in the context of McGrath's passing game dying a death in the last 2 years. He was a very poor passer when he emerged but he brought that up to an adequate level where he was a European Cup winning scrum half. But since the emergence of JGP as undoubted first choice, he seems to have settled for second best and that's now sliding further.

    We didn't keep someone like Cooney because he wasn't anything special at the time. He went to Connacht and was largely third choice behind Marmion and Blade. He went to Ulster who didn't really have anyone and got the starting spot where he developed and became much better. But that was due to game time that we were never going to be in a position to really give him. And he has been far from perfect during that time too, losing his starting spot to Doak for some big games.

    Paterson looks like a guy we might have missed the boat on but it's very much guesswork still. He has less than 900 minutes of pro rugby and turns 26 this year. Foley is 1 year younger and they backed him at the time. I don't think that was a terrible call at the time and I don't think we know how it will pan out yet. I'd imagine the gap between them physically probably had an impact with the 75kg, 5'7" Paterson probably always up against it slightly to get the nod.



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